[Rade]

noexpert, on 17 August 2010 - 07:25 AM, said:

knowledge is not something that can be passed genetically from generation to generation.

Depends what you mean by knowledge. The "potential to gain knowledge", as a mental activity related to facts of reality, most surely is passed genetically from one generation to another. I would agree that knowledge of specific facts of reality cannot be passed genetically, such knowledge is passed culturally.

To the point of this thread, do you think Jesus came to know that he was the Saviour from facts he gathered about his Jewish religion during his life, or was this thought of being the Saviour passed genetically to him from God indirectly via Mary (here I assume no genetics from Joesph) ?

[noexpert]

Sorry that I kinda forgot about this thread, but what I really meant by that statement was that aquired characteristics can not be passed down through genetics. Since the idea was that a person could learn to think a degree further, and that over the generations this would add up, thus enhancing our abitlity to reason, I was saying that each generation would have to start at square one. So while I do agree that the ability to attain knowledge can be passed genetically, but only to the extent that is encoded in your genes.

To answer your question, I guess that would depend on whether you actually believe that Jesus is the savior. Assuming that we are operating on the basis Jesus is the savior, I would have to say that there came a point where he just knew. He may have even known all along, like from the first moment of conciousness. But to say that he learned from what he was taught, in my opinion, would bring up the question of whether he was even the son of God as the Bible proposes. If the "son of God" has to be taught that he is the son of God then it makes me question whether he is really anything other than just a normal human.

[clapstyx]

noexpert, on 17 August 2010 - 07:25 AM, said:

As far as thinking one degree further adding up over time, knowledge is not something that can be passed genetically from generation to generation.

I think the jury is still out on that one. Dont dismiss the possibility that some people can make conscious exploration of their sub-conscious. DNA is a funny thing and we havent really been studying its potentialities for very long at all have we. Its funny that some people will rule out a possibility without even giving it a second thought without knowing as complete truth that it was not possible. Maybe in your family knowledge cannot modulate into instinct at a survival level consideration but in mine it most certainly can.

[dduckwessel]

Rade, on 14 August 2010 - 09:04 PM, said:

Did not Mohammed surpass Christ as the Savior ? I mean, is that not why God sent Mohammed ?

When did Mohammed ever claim to be God?

[charles brough]

clapstyx, on 13 August 2010 - 02:17 AM, said:

It seems to me that we are at a very strange point in history where on the one hand we have basically been lead to believe that Christ is unsurpassable and on the other hand the planet seems to be getting itself into a situation where it may well need someone to act in the capacity of saviour.

Now the latter situation is (or becomes) a true one what is the best thing the Pope can do about the effective discouragement of aspiration in the sense that to be the saviour one would have to pursue to be the saviour but unless you are Christ you are not supposed to have that aspirational longitude.

Ive thought about this a bit and Ive decided that the singularly best thing that the Pope could do presently in this moment would be to Saint Budha, Mohammed and Christ in a trople ceremony to acknowledge the virtue of developing profound degrees of aspiration for humanity.

Clearly if the planet gets itself into a directionless befuddlement some will have to rise to the challenge of the resolve and I am saying that part of the resolve is to overcome the negativity people come up with when someone else says they are trying to save the planet..because they say "who do you think you are Jesus?" like its a bad thing.

I believe what Christ did can be improved upon and that its noble to try.

If the Pope Saints the three of them it says that in their own way they were trying to do some of the same things and that there has been an acceptance of them with thanks for their contributions then noted.

The reason the faithful call Jesus "the Savior" is because the Bible puts him in the role of returning to the world and destroying "evil"---indeed, like former President Geo. Bush stated he would do after 9/11.(!). Then, the dead would rise up from their graves, stars will fall from the sky and war would end for a millenium in rivers of blood. This millenialism doctrine of Christianity goes back to the days of the Roman Empire when people were under much the same growing tension and stress we are and form the much the same breaking down of their society that we are experiencing. No wonder they longed for a savior---as people are growing more desirous of now. The doctrine was added because it was wanted..

But to regress back to 2000 year old ways of thinking is hardly a way to deal with modern problems of over-population, nuclear proliferation, the economic over-exploiting of resources, and just general ignorance. We need a system that can unite us as Christianity once did (and once pulled the masses from their misery) so we can work together to solve problems, not make them worse. We need a system of belief that is science-based and, hence, advanced and able to be "the wave of the future." Christianity brought us out of the old Monotheistic Age. Now we are ready to make another big step and enter the Non-Theistic Age. All we need to do is use science to answer the four simple questions answered by all mainstream ideologies: What is our origin? (we evolved), what are our goals? (there are a number of them we need to have in common). How do we work together to achieve them?---our moral system (and the old codes of the Bible are in bad need of upgrading and improving!), Finally, the fourth is what stands in our way? One thing, for sure, is the old religions themselves.

Civilization is not doomed, but conditions will surely grow much worse before people are willing to leave their ancient faiths for something new---even though doing so is the only real answer.

[dduckwessel]

noexpert, on 17 August 2010 - 07:25 AM, said:

knowledge is not something that can be passed genetically from generation to generation. It is like saying that the baby giraffe's neck is long because its mother stretched her neck out to reach the food. The next generation would require the same mind-altering treatment plus more to exceed the thinking of a previous generation

Agreed. Knowledge must be gradual. Someone who was born in the early 1900's and lived to see the moon landing had gradually gained the understanding that prepared them to live in very different worlds. If that same person living in the early 1900's was overnight confronted with space flight, the shock would be too much.

[Sci]

The moon as cheese…

Well, you know what happens when you leave cheese out.



Pope…

Unfortunately, the Pope has declared that only Catholics can go to Heaven.

[paigetheoracle]

We must each save ourselves by waking up to reality as it is. There have always been super heroes like Christ, that stepped in at the right minute and another is sure to appear, when needed. Everything dies and that includes the Christian Church. The eternal spirit of salvation though will live on as long as something in humanity wants to survive and continue to progress but it will not take a form we expect or necessarily want but that is reality. Whatever it will be, it will inspire and unite humanity on a new path, suitable for its changed circumstances.