How time dilation occurs

[kalesh]

Anyone got any ideas of how and why time dilation occurs?

The fact that it does happen is fine but why exactly? I tried google but couldn't up with anything.

Any help appreciated.

[Janus]

Anyone got any ideas of how and why time dilation occurs?

The fact that it does happen is fine but why exactly? I tried google but couldn't up with anything.

Any help appreciated.

 

Time dilation occurs due to the nature of time and space.

[CraigD]

Time dilation occurs due to the nature of time and space.

Though I think this is correct, and a good, succinct answer, I suspect that kalesh is looking for a bit more of a “hands on” explanation :)

 

The usual introduction to time dilation involves considering a special device commonly called a light clock. This wikipedia article section gives a pretty good illustration.

 

Most students next wonder “OK, but why does this imply that everything – time itself – slows down for a moving object?” There are, I think, 2 easy answers for this question:

• Based on the postulates of special relativity. Basically, these say that if any accurate clock (that is, one that can’t be messed up by vibration, blue shifted cosmic rays, etc) runs slow, anything that can measure time runs equally slow. This includes everything clocks, the aging of a human being, etc.
  
• Based on particle physics. According to them, pretty much every action involving matter – fermions – works basically like a light clock. All fermions – the stuff everything is made of – interact through bosons (of which the photon, or “light particle”, is one), which all behave, on their respective scales, like the photons in a light clock.
  

Though different people will argue that one or the other of these is more correct, IMHO they’re equivalent. Whichever one makes the most sense to a new student of Special Relativity is, I think, the best one for them at that moment.

[kalesh]

Time dilation occurs due to the nature of time and space.

Why? how?

I have my own theory but I would like to get the views of others and of mainstream science before I try to explain my view.

Any physics proffessors on hypnography? maybe one of you could say something.

[arkain101]

For a quick reply,

 

For some strange reason you can't change the value of which processes occur in the structures that form time and space. This is known as the value of C.

 

Because this value can not change (in this case we can say the speed of light) All kinds of consequences occur. The way we know speed in comman sense does not apply to the structure of time and space the same way.

[Janus]

Though I think this is correct, and a good, succinct answer, I suspect that kalesh is looking for a bit more of a “hands on” explanation :)

 

 

Just trying to cut to the chase. The OP said he has already tried to google the answer, so I assume he has already come across the Light-clock and other explanations and found them insufficent. I have the feeling no "hands on" explanation will not leave him with asking "but why?"

[The_Right_Stuff]

Personally , I don't think that there is such a thing as Time Dilation.

 

The description " Time Dilation " is perhaps a backward way of looking at the actual situation.

 

It is very tricky to disclose the actual circumstances, because these are perceived as the " YOUR THEORIES ".

 

There is only one " TRUE " fact, therefore not theory, that explains all, but it in the minds of the many it is just another one of those theories that fits into the " YOUR THEORY " category, which is why as an unfortunate consequence, " THE TRUTH " is presently banned on almost all physics forums.

 

Therefore we must speak of truth in a hypothetical nature.

 

Imagine a theory that is extremely simple. The theory starts by examining reality from scratch and progresses in steps that can be no smaller, such that nothing is missed due to nothing having been stepped over.

 

Lets say that this eventually makes it clear that all objects in this reality are constantly in motion within the reality itself. If that constant motion was across Space only, then it would be recognized as being the speed of light. If the constant motion was not across Space, then it would be across the dimension of Time instead, and this would be the maximum possible speed of motion across Time.

 

In other words what we have is non stop motion of all objects that exist within Space-Time. Just like one can envision the open dimensions of Space, hence open space to move across, one also must envision the openness of time and thus perceive the openness of Space-Time itself of which all objects are constantly in motion across while within.

 

A simple geometric analysis of this hypothetical structure of reality, produces equations that are identical to the Lorentz-Fitzgerald Contraction equation, the equation that predicts the degree of slowing down of the rate of the ticking of time (Time Dilation equation), the Lorentz Transformation equations, and the Velocity Addition equation.

 

Based on this hypothetical idea, the dimension of time never changes. It simply exists, just as space exists. However, since all objects are constantly on the move, how fast time ticks for an object simply depends on what percentage of its constant motion is across the dimension of Time only, hence what direction the object is traveling in while within the openness of Space-Time.

 

If you have a train for instance, and it is at rest in space, then it extends across space and its entire motion is a cross time. Now think of that Train and its endless possible directions of travel across the four dimensions of Space-Time. If we now change its direction of travel in Space-Time, then not only does it begin to move across Space and have less movement across Time, but the entire Train is partially rotated and the Train itself now extends across a certain distance of Time rather than just extending across Space.

 

But most importantly, we begin to understand how clocks that are positioned at opposite ends of the train are no longer truly synchronized due to the Train now extending across the dimension of Time, and that if using the Train itself as a measuring instrument to measure the speed of light, these time offsets, in combination with that fact that both clocks are ticking at a slower rate, and the fact that the spatial length of the train has reduced, the end result always gives the impression that the speed of the light measured is always 300,000 km per second despite the fact that the relative speed between the light and the Train is not actually 300,000 km per second at all.

 

However, to those onboard the Train, the change of spatial length of the Train is completely unknown of, and so its original spatial length is taken into account when the train is used as a measurement instrument. This means that an actual variable, is perceived to be a constant, and in the long run another variable, being the relative velocity of light relative to a moving body, is perceived to be a constant even though it is not.

 

But for all of this to take place, light must be a constant relative to space, meaning that the velocity of light relative to space must always be 300,000 km per second.

 

Now if we continue to hypothetically think four dimensionally, and we picture ourselves throwing a ball as we are at rest in space, we see the ball moving across space at a particular speed. If however, we have been rotated in Space-Time, and we proceed to throw another ball, then it would move at a lesser speed across space in comparison the previous time, and the remainder of that application of force will result in the ball moving across time instead.

 

This also applies to Photons.

 

If a spinning body that is at rest in space throws off a photon, the photon will move across space at the c velocity. If however, the axis of the spinning body was rotated across time rather than it having simply a spatial axis, then if it throws off another photon, that photon will not have the same degree of spatial velocity but will have a lessor degree of spatial velocity, and a greater degree of time velocity. But meanwhile, the spinning object that has rotated, and hos thrown off that photon, already was in motion across space, and that spatial velocity is equal to the degree of motion across space of which the photon had lost. The end result is (( c - v ) + v = c ). Therefore, no matter what speed an object moves across space, if it releases a photon, that photon will still move across space at the c velocity.

 

And so, hypothetically speaking, it appears that " Time Dilation " may be not be the proper description of the event, but it may be similar to how man used to think of the direction of current in an electrical wire, which was caused by passing the wire through a magnetic field, was going in the opposite direction than it actually was and still is.

[Janus]

Why? how?

I have my own theory but I would like to get the views of others and of mainstream science before I try to explain my view.

Any physics proffessors on hypnography? maybe one of you could say something.

 

Okay, let's try a little analogy. Let's replace time with a physical direction and reduce all the other spacial dimenisons to one direction. We can lay this out like a map, with say North and South being the "Time" direction and East and West the Space direction.

This is the way time and space were thought to be before relativity. Everybody, no matter which way they were facing, would agree that two objects were the same distance apart along the Time direction (N&S) and the space direction(E&W). Here "way they are facing is an analogy for their velocity.) In this view, time and space are absolutes.

 

Upon the advent of Relativity this changed, Time and Space were no longer absolutes. It's as if we replaced North and South with front and back, and East and West with Left and Right. Now, no matter which way you are facing, time is measured by your] front and back and space by your left and right; two people facing different ways(moving with different velocities) will not agree on how far apart two objects are in time and space.

 

Okay, how this relates to time dilation:

 

Now imagine you have two people who start at the same point of spacetime , facing slightly different relative to each other. Each moves forward in his Time direction. As a result they will separate along the space direction also.

Now remembering that each views time as flowing the direction they are facing, what do they see happening to the other? The other is always "behind him in time" and falls further and further behind as both progress. IOW, the other person always progresses through time slower than they do. Since each person feels that his progression through time is natural, it appears that time slows down for the other person. This is time dilation. Time dilation happens because observers with different velocities measure time differently. All due to the fact that the nature of time and space makes their measurement relative and not absolute.

[kalesh]

First of all I would like to thank everyone for their replies.

 

My special thanks goes to The_Right_Stuff, who despite being a new member gave an excellent post. Most of your views are same as mine. However I am looking to see what reasons mainstream can give.

 

My special thanks also goes to Janus who has posted what I would say the best answer that there could be. Once again most of your views are same as mine.

 

Time dilation happens because observers with different velocities measure time differently.

 

Exactly what I was looking for. The entire theory is compacted in that sentence. I couldn't say it better myself.

 

Now that I know that the theory has a good chance of being in some serious discussion I will post it. It gets rather lengthy and its getting late so I'll post it tomorrow.

[Uclock]

The subject of time is a complicated one. Einstein viewed the arrow of time as the mind creating order yet he acknowledged that time dilation is a physical (real) phenomenon. He viewed space as metric a sort of three dimensional grid and time is given a separate dimension but space and time cannot be separated because they are like a coin with two sides, one time the other space. This is how physics views spacetime.

 

It was also Einstein’s view that high relative velocity in uniform motion between frames causes time dilation and this introduces the well known twin paradox because velocity is relative. If I am moving away from you at 6000 m s^-1 then you will note my clock as running slightly slower than your clock but from my frame you are moving away from me at 6000 m s^-1 and it will appear to me that your clock is running slower than my clock.

 

A gravity field is a distortion of spacetime so when an object is immersed inside a gravitational field its clock will beat slower than that of a clock in free space so it appears Einstein believed there are two causes for time dilation, one being high velocity the other gravitational fields.

 

IMHO he was right that gravity causes time dilation but wrong that velocity also causes time dilation because if time dilation is a real phenomenon it will take a force to dilate time and you feel no force when in uniform motion.

 

Tony

[Jay-qu]

Why? how?

I have my own theory but I would like to get the views of others and of mainstream science before I try to explain my view.

Any physics proffessors on hypnography? maybe one of you could say something.

proffessor.. no, but im on my way :(

 

One explanation is to say that you have an absolute velocity through space and time. As you increase your speed through space, your speed through time slows down (see attached pic).

 

Consider the three paths all seen from the same reference frame, the red would be an observer at rest only traveling through time but not space. The blue would be an object/person traveling at some sub c velocity, traveling partly through space, and partly through time (at a reduced rate). The green would be a photon, which only travels through space and doesn't experience any time at all!

[TheFaithfulStone]

Okay, so it's about Star Trek, but this is a very succinct and "lay friendly" explanation that I found helpful.

 

Boldy Go HERE.

 

 

TFS

[firecracker]

:)

Thank you for allowing me to comment on this. I personally feel that we all have been looking at dimensions in the wrong way.

If I were born before the age of reasoning (whenever that was), I would look at an object and see and sense it as I normally do. No dimension has been assigned to what I see. But if I want to analyze it, I might arbitrarily assign some co-ordinates. I could construct some sort of device to relate the object's height to me, and hopefully, I could use the same device to relate it's width and height. And, if I wished to establish scientific method to these aforementioned relationships, I would have to make all my measurements 'repeatable'. Furthermore, I would establish rules for these measurements to be followed by everyone who followed. I would label height arbitrarily as 'Z', width would be 'X', and thickness would be 'Y'. Now, as those who follow exercise their right to discuss these objects, we would all be talking the same language.

As my colleagueas and I engage in conversations about the objects, we find that many of them don't arrive at their conclusions when I or others do. I also notice that many breaths and heartbeats and sunrises and sunsets have invaded the promptness of my discovery; if I expend more effort, I can arrive at my home before the food is thrown to the animals. There must be a relationship between my thinking, my breathing, my arrival at home, and the thoughts of my colleagues. Let's call this relationship time, and even, perhaps assign some value to it. My colleagues and I discuss it and after months, even years of discussion, we finally concur that this should be called 'time' and define it as the scale (dimension) over which EVENTS are measured. It will have no beginning and no end.

Regarding dilation of 'time', the scale doesn't dilate! Its calibration marks are infinite in resolution. If dilation occurs, and it does, it occurs against the stationary infinitely resolved scale of 'time'

Hats off to JANUS, THE_RIGHT_STUFF, the responder who said "The way we know speed does not apply to the structure of X,Y,Z,T in the same way."

Imagine that there exists a guy like me whose physical foot is a trillion times larger than mine.(all other measurements are larger by the same amount, including the world upon which he lives.) His second of time is also longer than mine by the same amount. When he decides to make a measurement of the speed of light (in miles per second), he always measures 186,000 miles/sec. just as I do, and for the very same reasons. the light that he sees crossing his retina has wavelengths one trillion times longer than mine. I don't see his light and he doesn't see mine.

Time doesn't dilate, speed up nor slow down. Events do! (as measured on the fixed scale of time.) The scale of Time is non-linear, and better illustrated on log paper, having no beginning and no end.

Events can be recorded on film or digital cameras at high rates and displayed at normal rates to exhibit dilated time. People recovering from years of coma exhibit no experience of elapsed time. (Another form of time dilation.)

[The_Right_Stuff]

My papers describe the basic analysis of motion. The outcome produces a simple understanding of the structure of the mechanics of reality, and it also produces the equations known as the Lorentz-Fitzgerald Contraction equation, the Time dilation equation, the Lorentz Transformation equations, and the Velocity Addition equation.

 

With this being the case, it is highly unlikely that such a theory is in error.

 

See http://www.outersecrets.com/real/work_pdf_text.pdf

[Jay-qu]

 

With this being the case, it is highly unlikely that such a theory is in error.

 

Quite right, but without offering any further (new) insights it becomes rather pointless.. Is there anything your theory does that current ones cannot?

[coldcreation]

 

Time dilation happens because observers with different velocities measure time differently.

 

Exactly what I was looking for. The entire theory is compacted in that sentence. I couldn't say it better myself.

 

Now that I know that the theory has a good chance of being in some serious discussion I will post it. It gets rather lengthy and its getting late so I'll post it tomorrow.

 

This simple approach says nothing about time dilation when the observers are at rest. i.e., where clocks appear slower due to the curvature of spacetime, at different altitudes in a gravitational field, of say the Earth.

 

The time dilation effect was first noticed in 1964, by Irwin I. Shapiro.

 

 

Gravitational time dilation is a consequence of Albert Einstein's theories of relativity and related theories which causes time to pass at different rates in regions of a different gravitational potential; the higher the local distortion of spacetime due to gravity' date=' the slower time passes. Source

 

 

CC

[Uclock]

Whilst it is true mainstream physics states that high velocity will cause time dilation there cannot be any experiment on time dilation that does not involve an element of acceleration.

 

Tony