The Department of Positive Out of Body Possibilities

[Tim Brewer]

To whom it may concern,

 

If machines like BrainGate can get electrical thoughts to operate machines and computers, then why not use it toward out of body experiences.

 

They already have patients that are doing experiments already, why not take it to the next level?

 

what if we find out that afterlife, is nothing more than an extension to OBE's.

 

Please feel free to reply,

Thank you,

Tim

[InfiniteNow]

To whom it may concern,

 

If machines like BrainGate can get electrical thoughts to operate machines and computers,

For those who may not be aware of the technology to which Tim refers, BrainGate is a neural interface that has broken a lot of ground, allowing paralyzed patients to impact the environment through thought alone. The majority of experiments about which I am aware were "mouse-like" movements, where a very basic computer "game" was fashioned and the patient was asked to move the "pong-like" bars by thought alone.

 

The research has also been done (prior to human tests) on monkeys with similar results, and the US Air Force has put funding into the technology as well, showing that pilots can fly a plane with no physical inputs... just thought (and significant training beforehand).

 

This WIRED magazine article is a good primer on the technology:

 

Wired 13.03: Mind Control

The BrainGate Neural Interface creates a direct link between a person's brain and a computer, translating neural activity into action. Matthew Nagle, without use of his limbs but fitted with a BrainGate, can now play a videogame or change channels on TV using only his mind. Here's how it works...

 

With greater detail available at the following Brown University website regarding the researcher and their work which was presented in the journal Nature:

 

06-002 (BrainGate)

• movement signals persist in the primary motor cortex, the area of the brain responsible for movement, long after a spinal cord injury;
  
• spiking from many neurons – the language of the brain – can be recorded and routed outside the human brain and decoded into command signals;
  
• paralyzed humans can directly and successfully control external devices, such as a computer cursor and robotic limb, using these neural command signals.
  

 

As interesting and promising as this technology is for patients with various physical disorders, it is also promising for telepresence and mechanically assisted telekinesis. However, I am not sure I can follow Tim's logic when he states:

 

..then why not use it toward out of body experiences.

 

I agree with Tim's point that much more can be done with this technology than has been achieved thus far, and that the possibilities offered with this technology are only limited by the imagination. Tim makes a similar statement when he wrote:

 

They already have patients that are doing experiments already, why not take it to the next level?

 

However, I do take issue with the assumptions that are implied here,

what if we find out that afterlife, is nothing more than an extension to OBE's.

...and would like some further information on both his meaning and intent for the claims regarding out of body experience and afterlife. I struggle to understand how those two very unscientific concepts apply to this promising technology.

 

 

 

Since this is very real science, and exciting in what it involves, you might find interest in the Nature article referenced above:

 

Is this the bionic man? : Article : Nature

 

The prototype implant has wires that penetrate the skull and skin, but this carries a risk of infection. Wireless signal transmission will at some stage address that particular issue.

 

A more truculent problem may be the observed tendency for the ability of microelectrodes recording from neurons to fall off over time, for reasons unknown. Individual responses to the implants also vary sharply: a second patient in Donoghue's experiment was unable to achieve the same degree of control as the first. And there are further issues to be faced: if scientists were to succeed in restoring limb function, they would have to work out how the body tells the brain where its limbs are positioned in space, through a little-understood sense called proprioception (see page 125).

 

A sign of how far the science of neuroprosthetics has come is that most of these difficulties are now engineering challenges, rather than problems of principle. In applauding this valuable work, it is worth noting that it was made possible by two of the bêtes noires of modern biology: commercial interests and animal research.

[Moontanman]

I would be up for trying out a computer interface to allow out of the body trips. I used to work al night and sleep in the day time. I did this for 25 years and when I slept during the day I often had out of the body type experiences. I could get up and look back at my body laying in bed and walk through closed doors and float around the town where I lived. Several times I saw people I knew and when I would see them in the real world I would ask them if they had been at a particular place and often I would be right even down to describing the clothes they were wearing. When I went through a door it felt cold as I passed through it. I have to also say I wasn't always right about seeing people so it is possible it was just a dream and I simply guessed correctly about the people I had seen but it certainly felt real. In case you are curious, no I have never been abducted by aliens or anything like that. I have wondered why since OBE is often associated with seeing aliens. I am not completely sure if the experiences were real but I did have some startlingly accurate observations while I was out of my body.

 

Michael

[Tim Brewer]

dear InfiniteNow, Thank you so very much in how you how well you did your reply, I find comfort in the presence of professionals.

 

I am only as good as what I have to work with, so I welcome your help with my topic.

 

Please feel free to inform me on what you know about out of body experiences and near death experiences?

 

Please fill free to look my topic up on the Internet, if you want to find more questions to ask me.

 

 

I would love to be a part of that engineering challenge!!!

 

Thank you,

Tim

[Tim Brewer]

Dear Moontanman,

 

when did the experience feel real?

While you were coming out of your body, going back into your body, or waking up outside of your body?

 

Did your thought feel like they were working, just like they are now, or did you fee you were more into your right brain or left brain, did you other out of body people, could you hear?

 

Please feel free to respond if you like.

 

Thank you,

Tim

[Queso]

Hey tim I like your style.

 

I've quite a bit of experience with dream travel. I like to induce sleep paralysis on a regular basis. There's an algorithm...do you know about it?

Sleep 4-6 hours, wake up, go back to sleep [anywhere between immediately and an hour (sometimes if youre lucky longer)] you can lay there and your body will freeze up and you'll be left just a mind, with infinite possibilities....

 

Although there are always things already being played out.

All of the time.

It is our own will that decides whether or not we want to play.

 

This is really one of my favorite topics!

I kind of believe that this soul//mind//energybody thing that we're slowly starting to realize and control

is our next ascension.

 

I wonder if it is possible for the human to step out of the body.

How is consciousness going to evolve?

 

Oh, and also.

I believe that all of this is tied in with DMT.

Entering sleep paralysis is as intense as a mild rush of DMT.

(Loud, Clear, Unpredictable)

 

One thing is certain:

Psychedelics force awareness.

 

I believe that DMT has been implemented in our bodies/brains to force us to see the truth. (And of course, everywhere else in nature)

 

At high doses....many people say they see other beings...resembling elves, and aliens.

 

That explains alien abduction.

 

When I was a child I swear I always felt the presence of aliens...

Some nights I swear I saw them and would draw them and show my momr she just never believed me so I didn't believe me but

 

how all of this ties in

 

weaves in and out

 

is truly fascinating.

 

I could go on and on I am obsessed with the mystery.

[Tim Brewer]

Dear Orbsycli,

 

Please feel free to go on and on about it, because that is what this topic is there for. I'm just glad to see that I ain't the only person who could go on and on about it.

 

Thank you,

Tim

[Moontanman]

Dear Moontanman,

 

when did the experience feel real?

While you were coming out of your body, going back into your body, or waking up outside of your body?

 

Did your thought feel like they were working, just like they are now, or did you fee you were more into your right brain or left brain, did you other out of body people, could you hear?

 

Please feel free to respond if you like.

 

Thank you,

Tim

 

The experiences felt quite real from stto finish, of course that doesn't make them real. I made some astonishing hits while floating around out side my body but i also made some real misses as well. Also as I said i did this when I was young sleep, deprived, and working night shifts. I'm not sure I can bring abotu the same conditions today.

 

michael

[Tim Brewer]

Were you still having normal thoughts?

 

did they just happened every time. or did you try and help them become a reality?

 

could you remember if you could hear or not?

 

How would you describe the form of your body?

 

Do you remember if you were scared?

 

If afterlife was like that, do you see a need to try and communicate with them, or at least give them the best tools to try and communicate with us?

 

Thank you for feeling free to talk about it,

[Moontanman]

Were you still having normal thoughts?

 

I'm not sure i understand what you mean by normal thoughts. It seemed ok other than the bazarre nature of ther experience.

 

did they just happened every time. or did you try and help them become a reality?

 

I had to help them become a reality

 

could you remember if you could hear or not?

 

No sound, complete quiet.

 

How would you describe the form of your body?

 

I looked the same as far as I could tell, but when you are awake how much of your body are you aware of? I could see or detect no more no less than normal of myself. the fact I could float or fly didn't seem to make me feel any difference.

 

Do you remember if you were scared?

 

No completly confident.

 

If afterlife was like that, do you see a need to try and communicate with them, or at least give them the best tools to try and communicate with us?

 

No apparent dead people, just the living at that current time and places.

[Tim Brewer]

----- Original Message -----From: Jeff Wagg, James Randi Educational Foundation

To: Tim Brewer ; Alison Smith

Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 1:52 PM

Subject: Re: Communications

 

 

I don't know what "advance thinking and action driven electrical thought out of body afterlife people" is or are.

 

Are you saying you can make the contact buzzer work without touching it?

 

Jeff Wagg

JREF

 

On 5/20/07, Tim Brewer <[email protected]> wrote:Dear Jeff Wagg,

*It is not a buzzer, but a light that comes on,*and that is only because I have only tried it with a light, but I suppose you could set it up to be used with a buzzer as well, and yes, I have had it work before, I just didn't think you were concerned about past events with*my experiments, so I tried not to bring that up.Science base their input in the fact that energy can not be made, destroyed, it can only*change form, so with that being the case. I want to prove that humans after they die, do have the ability to contact us through devises like this, but it can only work if we can educate them first on this*possibility. I once watched**one of your challenges were*a man tried to prove that he could alter a compass with thought alone, I would like to think my challenge is better, just because it is based on the fact that I do not even have to be anywhere near the machine when it works the way I say it will work. I would like the opportunity to have a monitor near by, only as a way to continue to send messages to the afterlife, as instructional information only.**

Please feel free to ask more questions if you would like.*Thank you,Tim*

I'm not accepting anything, I just wanted to be clear on what your claim was. You may apply now, and if you meet the criteria, your claim will be accepted.

 

Jeff Wagg

JREF

Thank you Jeff Wagg,*I appreciate your help in this matter, and now I will start getting things in order to be in a position to meet the criteria, and the challenge as well.*Thank you,Tim

[Tim Brewer]

To whom it may concern,

Just to make sure I am on the right page with the rest of you.

 

Please answer these two questions for me;

 

1) why do you feel it is not possible?

 

2) If it was possible to communicate with future afterlife out of body people, would you want it to happen or not, and why?

 

 

Thank you,

Tim

[Tormod]

1) why do you feel it is not possible?

 

As long as the term "afterlife" is used, I don't believe any of this is possible. Either there is life, or there is none IMHO. If a machine is able to "extend" my experiences, then that's nothing other than an enhanced neural network in a sense.

 

2) If it was possible to communicate with future afterlife out of body people, would you want it to happen or not, and why?

 

Seen from a sci-fi standpoint, it would be nice to be able to "reinstate" personas and have a chat with them. Would I want that persona to be me? Don't know.

[Tim Brewer]

Hello, my name is Tim, and thank you for taking an interest in this topic up to this point so far. I hope you find these new thoughts just as interesting. For some other people just want to argue about the possibility, I did set up a topic on one site called The Department of Negative Possibilities, so feel free to go their if you like as well.

 

What you are about to read is nothing more than directional fantasy, to possibly help jump start this topic's positive possibilities and nothing more.

 

Just something to think about, talk about, as we think through things that happen through out our lives. If for any reason this topic might make sense to you at any point during that time, please fill free to update your OBE level status on this site, and I will talk more about the different levels of OBE's later, at least one quick way we should think about them anyway.

 

I am sorry that nobody through out history, or even after 2005. I believe that was a very important year, with the emerge of Brain Gate. I am surprise others don't see the connection to this machine as I do; the simple connection of machines and afterlife thought, as a tool to advance this topic even further. I guess it is hard to move something further, when it was not even moving to begin with. A tool that can be modified to what ever possibility we see that needs to be done in this field, because that is exactly what this field is, a wide open field to anybody with an imagination. Just as much as you have the ability to create something worthwhile in this field, so too does that show you that scientist can not say for sure it can't be done, because they have not studied this field half as good as all of us can do, because it is in the numbers, just like we went with this one oil to run a car, when with a little more effort, we even found other fuels that could do the job just as well.. I am not afraid to talk to anyone about this field, because I know just from the short time I have been in it, there is so much more work need done in this field.

 

If you pay close attention, you will notice the closer we get to making this a reality, the louder some people will be about not wanting it to happen. All I ask, is that you keep an open mind when this occurs. Don't be fooled by what they will say to try and scare you, but what they are not saying, the real reason they don't want it to happen. This will be a clear smoke screen to what there main agenda is all about, and we will discuss that later on, if that worst scenario keeps presenting itself.

 

Others will try and blow it off as I am some kind of ex-Woodstock religious freak on drugs who thinks he is Einstein, when I am nothing more than a messenger who wants to tell different people's these thoughts, just in case it turns out, that it is really possible..

 

Through out history people have been able to accomplish things, regardless of different obstacles, and this topic should be the same as well. I believe the out come of this topic will be no different. Measuring it the right way, as Edison would, trying everything, until we find the right thing. Edison achievement was putting all the right pieces of the puzzle all in one place, so the positive result could show itself, and that is what I am asking in this topic as well.

 

One of the advantage of this topic is the Murphy law effect. This topic opportunities could change at any second of the day, depending on so many different factors.

 

Example: Imagine scientist do not want to try my theory because they don't buy into it, but five minutes from now, somebody like Oprah, has an OBE; a level five like I had, and is so taken in by the experience, that she decides to check it out on the Internet and comes across my topic on one of the forum boards like the Near Death Experience ones ; not only does she believe in it as me now because of her new experience, but she is also amazed that she has been written in to the solution as well; as one of the possible positive scenario's as I am laying out to you right now. She sees what I want her to do, and maybe she will actually do it, or at least put me in a position to talk face to face with people in that field that can set me straight on the possibilities. She might decide to buy one of the machines and teach people in one of her schools on how to make it happen.

 

Now the chances of something like this happening is probably one percent of the ten percent of people expected to have this experienced at some point in their life. and this percentage could go up, depending on other factors as well, and we have the Internet to thank for that. because this topic is in a position to be seen by anybody who wants to find it. Yes this one positive possibility that just might happen, another might be that she gets wind of this topic by somebody who is reading it now, gets a chance to meet her, gives here the topic to explore one day, and she actually does. then a lot of the thanks would go to the person who told her about it. I believed that scenario would only work if she really did have a Level five OBE, since then she might be in the right mind set to take it under consideration. This is what would be considered a pre-meditated possibility, based on luck and so many other variables, but it certainly could cause positive results.

 

I believe if we look at different percentages of Murphy law, this is where we are at:

 

If five percent of people who have level five OBE's, decide to search more about this experiences on the internet, and at least three percent of them come across my topic, and at least one percent of them are in a position to make it possible, either through private money, or Government money, then this possibility could happen regardless of explaining anything more about it at this time.

 

In other words, I do not have to prove anything, I just have to have this thought in a position to be seen by others, who can make it happen by either their wealth, media presents, or ability to make it happen. So what we really should be doing is finding those people now that can do this and start to wait for them to have this experience, so they can make it happen.

 

Will it be Oprah, Donald Trump, Bill Gates, Hillary Clinton, Michel Fox, the Pope, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Tom Cruise, or maybe somebody else like you!

 

Time will tell

 

What you might ask these people now is this question

 

"If it did happen to you, and you honestly believed it was real as Tim does, do you know how to find this topic?

 

Ask them what level are they now, and if they would public-ally announce if that status ever chances.

 

I do not think that is a bad question to ask anyone, and it really is kind of fun, if you think about it. It's one of your status points in life.

 

Example:

 

I have a driver license

 

I wear glasses

 

I'm a 2OBE, use to be a 1OBE

 

This could start being added to people's info on their "My Space" for example. You could wear different color plastic wrist bracelets. It would consist of six different colors.

 

Before long, people will want to make sure we are doing everything we can to make sure we have the best communication in place for every Level OBE out there.

 

I once joined the ROTC in school because they promised to let us go up in a plane during the school year, and I would not be apposed to going to some school and getting more training in this area as well, especially if they promised me training on Brain Gate as well in this field of positive possibilities. Maybe our great country would help with government grants in this field, since they say they don't want to leave any of us behind.

 

I believe this is as much possible, as a policeman on a motor cycle, writing a seat belt ticket to somebody in a big yellow Hummer.

 

If the government is so concerned about keeping us alive now, with the intent to get your tax dollar longer; just think of all the money they could make if they could measure us in the afterlife world.

 

I know it might be hard for level 1OBE to understand all this because they can not see it now, like they can see a Wal-Mart being built; but just keep in mind their is a lot of other things that you can not see as well, but they are out there.

 

Some people believe afterlife can talk, and they believe that EVP will do that for them, I for one do not from my own experiences from having an OBE.

 

I believe that OBE's ,are clues to afterlife OBE's; because I feel they are early returns from death, and you can see that from their vital signs at the time and how long they had the unexpected experienced as well.

 

What I recommend we do to make this communication a reality is no different than other things we have tried in the past with other experiments in other fields, like the light bulb.

 

Do you think every experiment NASA has tried in outer space has always been a success, or that they were able to measure it correctly before they were able to take the experiment to outer space, I would have to say no, but on the same hand, experiments that they thought might work one way, probably turned out to work totally different than they expected early on, and then they just adjusted their approach for future experiments, you can also see that in just different things they have done over the years just to make it safer, but even with all that said, they still know it is risk, but at this time, they still feel it is worth taking..

 

Example: They say that an atom in a lot of ways is like it's own little solar system, and that it shares it's space with other atoms making it a very crowded little universe. So small, but yet so far away, and if that is our worst scenario, then we cannot expect them to communicate any better than we could expect from our self's.

 

If you don't believe me, just go out side and yell at outer space, and see if they can hear you down here, probably the best you can expect, is that your niebor will call the police, for disturbing the piece.

 

Now on the other hand, if everybody on earth would be quiet for a few seconds, and the people on the space shuttle had the correct equipment, maybe they could hear you, but your chances of making that happening would probably be harder than actually communicating with afterlife, so in one way that is a good thing.

 

Imagine you have been trained on Brain Gate, you are connected to Brain Gate right now, and we wanted you to do something in the space shuttle in outer space

 

right now, how could we do that?

 

It all comes down to what other people want to do, and they are in a position to do it.

 

A sign of how far the science of neuroprosthetics has come is that most of these difficulties are now engineering challenges, rather than problems of principle. In applauding this valuable work, it is worth noting that it was made possible by two of the bêtes noires of modern biology: commercial interests and animal research.

 

How can we do this, how can we do that, and what if we looked at it this way or that way, and what if we took this and put it with that before we do this again and so on. I could list all type of things we have not done, just to hear from other people on what proof do I have?

 

Because I believe it to be, and it is natural to science laws.

 

Because my out of body experience to me was not a dream and it came to me when I had no reason to want it to be real. For some reason the government did not want me to be left behind in school to a point, so I knew the importance of history, that better things can be learned from other people mistakes.

 

Imagine for a moment that there is only one person on earth, and this person can not talk or hear, even though once they did. On the other hand, you are in an orbit outside of earth and you need to communicate with that person, and one of the tools you have available with you in outer space is a Brain Gate machine, what might be your best way of using it with that person back on Earth. the first thing you must do is let them know what your intentions are and then the best way to do that problem, is post signs in outer space, that can be seen on earth, the next thing you must do is listen for vibrations, so you might need to magnify your efforts for that signal, while trying to drown out any other wasted noise, and this is where it gets harder, because there is not only one person on earth, as there is not only one afterlife in space, and unfortunately they all make vibrations.

 

Think about this for a moment, I believe every afterlife takes up space, just like you do, and how many that is, can only be a guess. If it is an animal, human, or anything else with energy thought, then you add in how many years they have been around, how many different strange movement of atoms in a curtain amount of space, then multiply that by all atom space, and that should at least give you a good honest number for now; and I would have to think that would be about one percent of all atoms. Now you might think that is a lot, but it really is not, when scientist believe only three percent of space is filled with atoms to begin with.

 

I once heard we sent signals into outer space, hoping that somebody else might hear them, and on the surface that sounds find, but once again it somebody like Einstein is floating out in outer space in his afterlife, he could not hear this message, because once again, he can not hear in his new handicap position..

 

I do not believe we need to reinvent the wheel, but we do need to put the wheel in the best position for success. We need to paint better pictures to afterlife, and we might need to put Brain Gate in the best position for success.

 

Hear me out on this thought. Lets train future patients of Brain Gate for the worst scenario on this topic, and build off of that, just like we do in other area's of life.

 

We need the best one on one situation that can be done, and that place might be in a pocket in space where dark energy is at. A place where one potential afterlife atom might need to go, to get away from all the white noise of all other afterlife here on Earth.

 

A place that is vast with nothing, but one atom and one Brain Gate machine, one on one like I was saying..

 

Think of afterlife as a stadium of noisy people, all trying to be heard for now, and you are trying to communicate with a Brain Gate machine at the same time; sounds impossible, but what if you could float away from this environment and find a quiet place in outer space, that has been selected just for you, with all the bells and whistles. A place where you might be heard; then your chances for success might be much greater.

 

So what we will need is a satellite, that will be prepared to take a modified Brain Gate machine and other potential afterlife energies up in outer space, to explore this possibility, and then fly to a dark energy place in space and see what happens.

 

This theory in my opinion could be done, and it would also cover some of the worst scenario for getting it done. Scientist have already shown that some things seam to work better in outer space, so do you think they have ever tried this one before, I didn't think so either. This would also cover situations, where some people think once you are cut off from your old body, you take off toward outer space anyway.

 

A lot of people believe in the real world that most things can be measured, but in the afterlife, they are happy with the possibility that they go to a place that can't be measured, and I do not agree with that.

 

A lot of people do not like to talk about anything to do with human death, because they associate it with pain, and your thoughts are always programmed to take you out of pain and into pleasure.

 

 

 

This is so far my Rating system for out of body afterlife

 

Level Zero: It has never happened to you, and you find it hard to believe it could happen to anybody else as well.

 

Level One: You had a dream or dreams of having an OBE's, at least it gives you something to talk about on this topic.

 

Level Two: You trained yourself to have one, the number does not matter, and it is all based on the fact that you wanted it to happen, and your thoughts did everything it could to make it as close as the real thing as you wanted to comprehend of it.

 

Level Three: You had one, but you experienced it through your right brain, because your left brain thoughts could not comprehend the experience, so your right side thoughts entertained you in limbo, supplying you only with what thoughts it feels you could handle at the time

 

Level Four: an OBE's that has some right brain activity, during some parts of the experience, but also some left brain activity at times as well; helping to keep you a little more level to the experience as well, but still sounding a little over the top when trying to explain it to others, even though they could see that you were showing signs of being dead at the time, and any machines connected at the time was proving it as well. Some machines were showing you as brain dead.

 

Level Five: Your body signs are showing you dead, you wake up by the ceiling and remain a wake through the rest of the process, you are in total control of your thoughts, and you can remember re-entering back into your body, by steps you did to make that a possibility.

 

Level Six: Out of body afterlife = still waiting for the correct communication devises to be in place for this one.

 

So if you are a level Zero, you do have a lot of options, but just remember what came around to us, might be coming to you later today. As far as I am aware right now, there is no proof all people that have an OBE, are nuts and have some kind of drug problem. If that was the case, people like Winston Churchill would never have got elected to his position in power. Just because you have never experienced it yet, or if you ever do, does not mean you should be ignorant to the possibility, just in case their is a possibility.

 

My thoughts tell me that one day in the near future, somebody like Oprah, Donald Trump, or even Tom Cruise will have a level five experience, then they will research the topic on the Internet, come across this topic, and then they will use their abilities, from their position, to supply the tools and support that will be needed to advance research in this field, so we can find out once and for all if it can be a reality. Now will they type into their computer the name of my topic and find it, probably not, but hopefully they might go to one of there forums and see it there. That is one of the advantages of a bulletin boards. Unlike the fact, that George Washington might of slept here or there, no one really knows, because there is no proof, but if your topic is still present, when big wheels come around, it's chances of being seen become so much greater. Depending on that big wheels ability to turn thought into action.

 

Some people ask me to explain how Brain Gate is going to make this happen, and we both would be kidding our self's, since I have never been any closer to that machine than you, but something inside me tells me that I should at least be given a chance to at least go to one on a field trip, just to interact with them and see what comes out of that. I believe everybody should be given one opportunity every year to do this until we die, or science prove it can't be done first in a way that can be measured. Why should I be allowed to do this? Because they might explain to me why it can't work, then I will be glad to report those findings, or they might give me challenges to over come, and then I will have a natural year to slice up those challenges, post them on this site as you can do as well, until all those challenges are gone.

 

I would like to find some place that could take all of my papers on this topic, and come up with some way of filing it for anybody to read for years to come, if they choose to do that. maybe what we need now is The Department of Positive out of Body possibility Museum topic, because at some point in history, people are going to want to know where we are at on this topic.

 

I understand if you are a level Zero, and that all of this sounds so impossible to comprehend and it might sound like right brain thinking, but just like anything else in life, you have to start somewhere; and it is always awkward at first, regardless of what ever it might be. Learning to crawl, or ride a bike, is always strange at first, but over time it gets easier, like other new things we learn everyday. Focus new change has always been a part of our life's anyway.

 

But as your number goes up as you move up in number to what piece you are, Some people for example that might be a seven in management, does not want fives, to become eights, because they feel threatened about their position, and probably income situations, that might be the case, but I always welcomed any number above me, because I honestly believed I just made us better as a team. I always tries to get ones to threes and so on, and maybe they could not become a three at this time, but they are ready to begin to be two's anyway.

 

 

 

I do not like to criticize, condemn or complain about anybody until they can not communicate anymore, so I guess I want to prove once and for before I die, one way or the other, if this is possible or not.

 

So maybe I am crazy for the fact hat I could be doing all type of other things than what I am doing now. All I can say about that is this. I understand the importance of being three dimensional in most areas of life, and I also understand what it is like to tune a curtain station on the radio.

 

I have the experience of having a level five OBE

 

I make a constant effort everyday, to try and see this topic from all angles as possible, while still keeping in mind that might not be possible.

 

I believe I am honest, reliable, creative, willing to listen, willing to learn, the ability not to cave in to unfounded citizen, based on their opinion that I am the sole provider for having to prove right now, how this can be a reality or not.

 

I understand if you are a level Zero, that this seams impossible, and since you are not vested in this as I or maybe other level fives, that the best we should do is come to terms with the way you are thinking, and maybe in time that will be the case, or others who might believe or hope as I do, but really don't think it can happen.

 

On that level, maybe it is good for all interested parties involved that my possibility should be a Yard stick for all false realities, and it must be measured only in our hearts because such a reality in it self might sound to hard to comprehend, for those all I can say, is it will be one person at a time, and all that will come down to timing. I assume that most people would not want to train for something until they see it work first, and I do not have a problem with that, as long as we put our selves in a position to have it work first.

 

_______________

 

This modified Brain Gate machine needs some hits in a way that it was never made to do before, but the bottom line is, it needs some tries.

 

I feel the more I try and explain this topic the better I get, and hopefully the better you get as well, and I believe with every potential hit the machine might receive in the future after the machine is modified, the interchange we have for success.

 

I would rather list all the different things we tried, so other people can read that , and then hopefully somebody will read it and see what other steps to the puzzle is out there.

 

like to relationship then keep believing what you are believing for now, and maybe you will always by all means do not believe it is possible, with out proof six proof.

 

There is a movement that is going on all over the world about this topic. People just like you, who have experienced a level five OBE, are coming to sites like this one, are getting important information about this topic.

 

Even though some people might miss-lead you hat this topic is as dead as the music in the song American Pie, you now know different, this possibility will be possible as soon as Murphy law shoots an electric arrow into the right person.

 

Through out life, different people have been influenced by these thoughts, but they were never in a position like you to make it a realty, so that is the question you must always ask yourself at different times in your life. Are you in a position to make it a reality? If the answer is yes, what is sopping you. If your answer is any of these, I have different comments for them, then it is your choice if you want to do it or not.

 

I'm scared - A great President once said, we have nothing to fear but fear itself

 

what would my friends say? Well, if you make it a reality, you can talk to your friends about it then.

 

Can I take my money with me, by putting in my will that I want to keep my money in a Pay pal account, in case they make it a reality in the future? - I personally do not see a problem in that, as long as a percentage was used every year for more research in that area. It would kind of like donating it to a cause, that might pay back big dividends in the event you are reached at a later date. the whole time your money is put into accounts that is growing in interest every year, unless science at some point can prove it is not possible, then you go to the next line in your will and you put it somewhere else.

 

Why don't the Government just work hard on making this a reality on there own? - Maybe they would, if they were not so busy giving amnesty consideration to all the criminals that are inside our borders. then when we do catch the million or so bad ones in the bunch, then we can us our tax dollars to keep them locked up for years to come.

 

You will never have a effect on this topic, until you have a cause, and that is what I am trying to explain, to the best of my ability today.

 

If you got to go o something else, please fill free to do that, but please find the time to help by keeping thoughts like these alive.

 

I believe one of the reasons this has not become a reality yet. is based on so many factors, but I also believe it is possible based on so many factors.

 

Some people would lead you to believe, that it is a waste of time to discuss this or anything else, because everything that can be said, has been said, or that everything that can be discovered has been discovered about this topic, so don't waste your time, and you will be considered a nut if you do.

 

Think for a second as though this topic is a song, some people might not like it, and that is fine, all I have to do is leave it playing for a while and see if some body might come along and listen to it as well, and decide to build a new machine to play it on.

 

This has already has happened in our past. Thanks to advancement in machines. They can take old tapes and albums of people like Hank Williams, Elvis Presley, and so on, and recreate their music in all type of formats for years to come.

 

Now some might say that everything that can be said, has already been said before. Now I don't know if that is true or not. I do know at this time, that my topic on the Internet, is the only one posted like it anywhere.

 

Is this topic truly just a simple twist of fate, only time will tell and it isn't talking at this time , as far as anybody can truly understand.

 

I will not lie, there are times in my life that I believe in happy endings, and I believe my topic is the closest thing I know to such a reality.

 

I am banking my topic on the possibility of somebody in an important position, such like in the media profession on having an OBE as well at some point, and the experience makes them want to explore the Internet for other experiences as theirs and they come across this topic, and depending on their influence, or financial backing, they take

 

Maybe they have access to machines like Brain Gate, because they had come down in price, or they are cheaper than gas at the time, what ever the reason, but they get the word out, they have the ability to sway people's behaviors. or they just like the idea of taking their money with hem and sees this as a good opportunity to do that, because nobody wants to be communicating in the afterlife, with out money. Research can only take you so far, at some point, the general public, private sector, or afterlife sector will have to help split the bill.

 

Some people worry about the thing called the world order, I believe it is to early to rule out that possibility, for all type of reasons. I believe the world order will perform at higher standards than anything you can imagine now.

 

Some people worry about Big Brother watching us, and then complains when they have to wait for other government programs as well. If having one all Big Brother, who is devoted to making my life easier, sounds a lot better than, what we have now, where different brothers are fighting and dying all over the world.

 

Have I finally planted the seed tactually created something,

 

that is bigger than life as we know it, only time will tell.

 

is it something all together different , or how things truly come around and go around, when it concerns The Sting Theory when it ran into The Department of Positive Out of Body Possibilities.

 

I am quite aware that different people have different opinions about this topic, and some do not even like talking about it at al, unless scientific prove is given up front, before any type of testing can be explored, but I also believe after reading other people positive replies, that there might be other ways of making this a reality, and that is luck.

 

Let me give you an example. Let's say that somebody in a very powerful position has an OBE at some point in their life, and they might have the ability to make this a reality as well. Maybe somebody who is so powerful in the media present, that they can build schools, provide equipment, build wings to hospitals, or even builds colleges as well.

 

but if I remember right, they are a lot like me. If I yawn they yawn, we both put on our shoes on at a time, and we both could have an OBE. Now when I had mine, back in the late seventy, early eighties, you did not hear anything about it, and you surely did not have the internet, but now, if you had one today, you can jump on the Internet, and you might come across my topic, and if that is the case, I would like to think I am providing a service, especially if this scenario might happen.

 

What you are about to read is nothing more than fantasy at this time.

 

The year is 3535

 

Hello, my name is John Doe and I am eighty years old in human life, but now I am an out of body afterlife person with no password to prove who I am. Nobody ever thought of giving you a password for my type of situation when I was alive because, it just wasn't something you talked about when I was alive, People were too scared to talk about dying, and that type of thinking at that time was just too far over the top.

 

I guess the biggest break through in this field came shortly after Oprah had her OBE's herself, and she decided to provide research in that field and made it a reality. None of this would not of happened if she did not have here experience, and some guy by the name of Tim, hadn't put this topic in a position to be read by her.

 

Tim realized that you can't make anything a reality if you don't believe in it first, and then have the ability to make it a reality second. Tim realized that he was average, but he also knew other people will have this experience, and they might be above average, and if they could work together, the chances of this working would be no different than Bernie Toblin and Elton John working together, with the goal of making music..

 

Tim believed that Afterlife are doing quite fine, but they are handicapped, and need to be treated as though, instead of being ignored by all type of false belief's that give the impression to people that it can't be possible, when in fact, it has never really been studied correctly, since Thomas Edison studied it years earlier.

 

Now on the other hand, I have this friend name Jane Doe who has had a password for quite some time, because she had the insight to make it a reality, following her unique experiences through out life. She was already handicapped, and her mother had an OBE a couple of years earlier, and made the connection to Jane, so she helped Jane get qualified with Brain Gate, just so she could live a better life on earth as a handicapped person, but never forgetting to motivate Jane in the future possibilities if Tim is indeed right. Her mother worked on Jane's placebo thoughts, telling her to focus strong because you might be doing this for a very long time. After Jane started getting good on the Brain Gate machine, her mother worked with her on a password, just in case things work out as Tim Believe they might.

 

It was not long after Jane was totally focus on the possibility, that complication from other health issues with her took her life. Jane's mother went to Capital Hill looking for more funding in this area, but was turned down do to lack of evidence, fortunately Jane's mother talked about the experience under the Department of Positive out of Body Afterlife possibilities topic umbrella, so other people in the puzzle had access to the information as well.

 

 

 

She also got training on the machines at a much earlier time, so she had special advantages when the first modified black market Brain Gate machine came on the market. Also after Brain gate began to become public, curtain radio stations bought time shares on the machine, so people could like Jane's mother could try and contact with her daughter. Her mother was always a strong willed person herself, so this all made sense to her, even though other people were not so sure in the possibility.

 

 

 

As I was saying, Jane's mother put her in a potential positive position, and now that it worked out, Jane is returning the favor back to her mom and everybody else as well and she is respected and admired for what she has done, and also the fact that they had the hind sight to have a password put in place, even though they did not need one at the time, and that password can be used anywhere American Express or Visa is taken. She did not have a lot of things when she was alive, but now with here afterlife job, and her low maintained afterlife style, she has piled a lot of money up on all type of different Pay Pales. When she was alive. before she got injured in a hit and run car crash, she was a teacher, and now in her afterlife she is still teaching. She teaches a class on the Internet called "How to live your dreams the right way." She has also written a lot of different books about the topic as well. Maybe you have heard of them before:

 

"Don't forget your Password" this book talks about other passwords you can use, if you did not have one recorded with Brain Gate before, and they are making great strides in communicating with people from other centuries as well, come to find out, they have been getting smarter while in an out of body experience thanks to some people who use big screen TV's when watching the news, and the fact that the put the words on the screen, when the news guy is talking. I guess the most famous person they have talked to is Thomas Edison, who replied "I told you so."

 

other books she has written as well.

 

"Don't stay connected to every wave that comes your way"

 

"Victim attitude is a waste of time, take control of your energy"

 

"How to un-retire in the Afterlife"

 

What I know about the crosses you bear, and what I am allow to say on a privilege communication device"

 

She has been a strong advocate in this field for quite some time. She once told me a story about this guy named Tim, who was probably one of the first people to bring this topic to the for front, just to be ridiculed about it all through out is last years as a human. They say he never did get trained, or given a password while he was a human, and nobody has ever heard from him again in the afterlife, I imagine he went off into outer space somewhere, or he is a bigger introvert than I gave him credit to be. Now when I say he went off into outer space, that does not necessarily mean outer space.. Scientist have been claiming for quite some time now, that some people when they cross over, never come out of their right brain thoughts, they believe at the time of changing form, that some people experience such a reaction mentally to it, that there thoughts take them out of pain, which is the reality side of it, and puts them in the make believe side of their thoughts, where they are left dorm ad. They say that some afterlife have been like this for billions of years. Scientist are just now starting to see the advantage now of having high spirits at this time, because even if this energy is small in size to a human body, they still do have the ability to alter other energy around them with a strong afterlife will. They just caution to some afterlife not to get to excited that they caused defects in some devices back on earth.

 

I guess one of the biggest break through was after they got their first successful hit on a old Brain Gate Machine, that Tim helped modified way back when. Now that they had confirmation with the modified sensor, all they had to do after that was read the area in question.

 

I forget what type of substance they discovered we were, I don't remember if they said we were a special type of static electricity, the kind that can move around in between waves, or that we were some type of micro, but in any case, they found us. Thanks to people like Jane Doe, who provides extra money for people like me to get access to talk to people like you.

 

I guess the only big difference I see now on Earth, is how so many business are catering to people like us now. Trying to take advantage of our purchasing dollar. I know the other day that Jane told me she was thinking about buying her own sensor, that was painted like a pink flower. To me all sensors are the same, what ever floats your boat.

 

Now looking back on it, it's hard to believe how many years they kept arguing about even doing research in that area.

 

I guess on one hand, even though you know one day you will be put in that situation, you still don't want to think about it. I'm was surprised by how many people at the time, did not want to know more about it, and then found them self's in the same situation I am in. Even though They have now made it possible for people like me to communicate, it is still hard to find a good career you can do, because they are never really sure I am who I say I am. Not like people like Jane Doe, who planned out her whole life, and afterlife. She knew while she was alive at the time, that they did not have the ability to do it, but she knew she loved to communicate, be it on the internet, or on her cell phone, that if the possibility did ever present itself, that she could save a lot of time, by having the training and the confirmation, by getting a her password certified in the National data base, at the World order training center in India, They actually call the building Gandhi' Place. Now Jane was trained in 2010, and they actually had there first inner astral naught success in 2050. So after they started understanding how to do it better, they decided to explore all the past people that had been trained on it first, and that is how Jane got in on the ground floor. At first they would ask her and others to try different experiments, just to see what type of challenges they might be experiencing in their environment, and they also paid them while they were doing this. You would be surprise how much money they are getting from different companies in the private sector.

 

Tim had a dream, but he thought it was a real, so now he thinks that we can communication with out of body afterlife; the only problem with his strange thought is that we can't prove him wrong, on the dream or the theory. We can expect him to prove it though, since he came up with the thought. He will be expected to take ownership of the thought, since he came up with it, and he needs to understand that. Now we are not apposed to the fact that other people might believe in it as well, and they are all more than welcome to make it a reality, or help Tim as he tries to find a way to make it happen.

 

.This example below, is hopefully will not be what comes out of this in the future. I would not have a problem with it, if it is example (2)

 

Imagine about fifty years from now, one of you might be telling this stories around a fake campfire, since real fires will probably be against the law by then anyway, because of global warming, and you bring up this topic at that time.

 

1) Back in 2007, this guy on the Internet, thought we could communicate with ghost, and he said that one day he would contact us again through a old machine called Brain Gate, and find the person who took his big toe"

 

(2) Back in 2007, the year we started focused on the heavens, this guy who thought we could do it, was also one of the first people to actually communicate back with us, and the first thing he communicated back after entering in his password was, "who took my big toe."

 

Thank you once again for reading my thoughts, and please include yours, and I will read and try and understand them as well as you are trying to understand mine.

 

I find through out life, things seam to work so much better, when it is a good deal for all parties involved.

 

Thank you,

 

Tim

[InfiniteNow]

Hello, my name is Tim, and thank you for taking an interest in this topic up to this point so far. I hope you find these new thoughts just as interesting.

 

Tim,

 

Your post above hurts my schedule. Can you please summarize the key points, perhaps in bullet-point form? You referenced in your opening post a technology in which I'm incredibly interested. However, I've chosen not to participate much since then as the conversation has focussed more on the experiences of those who lack the neurobiological understanding to describe them in tanglble terms. I'd like you to engage the scientific audience of Hypography a bit more "on their terms."

 

Hence, condensed posts. Clear topics of conversation. Support of claims, and expression of new ideas without ignoring existing knowledge.

 

No easy request. That I know. So, perhaps you can start by pulling out the main points of the chapter you wrote above?

 

 

Off to another meeting... :confused:

[Tim Brewer]

Tim,

 

Your post above hurts my schedule. Can you please summarize the key points, perhaps in bullet-point form? You referenced in your opening post a technology in which I'm incredibly interested. However, I've chosen not to participate much since then as the conversation has focused more on the experiences of those who lack the neurobiological understanding to describe them in tangible terms. I'd like you to engage the scientific audience of Hypography a bit more "on their terms."

 

Hence, condensed posts. Clear topics of conversation. Support of claims, and expression of new ideas without ignoring existing knowledge.

 

No easy request. That I know. So, perhaps you can start by pulling out the main points of the chapter you wrote above?

 

 

Off to another meeting... :)

 

 

Dear InfiniteNow,

 

Since we are both too busy for long explanations, I hope to explain my idea based on other people mistakes, by using inductive reasoning in the weeks to come. My goal is to give each one I find a number, explain them, then we can add them up and see what we have at the end.

 

I really don’t think these things up, they just come to me naturally.

 

Inductive reasoning

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

(Redirected from Induction (philosophy))

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Inductive reasoning is the complement of deductive reasoning. For other article subjects named induction, see Induction.

Induction or inductive reasoning, sometimes called inductive logic, is the process of reasoning in which the premises of an argument are believed to support the conclusion but do not ensure it. It is used to ascribe properties or relations to types based on tokens (i.e., on one or a small number of observations or experiences); or to formulate laws based on limited observations of recurring phenomenal patterns. Induction is used, for example, in using specific propositions such as:

 

This ice is cold.

A billiard ball moves when struck with a cue.

...to infer general propositions such as:

 

All ice is cold.

All billiard balls struck with a cue move.

 

Thank you,

Tim

[Tim Brewer]

To whom it may concern,

From Transformer,

Hoax Forum | The Department of Positive Out of Body Possibilities

As someone who has just read through this thread from start to finish in one sitting, I must say:

My understanding of your theory thus far:- You have had a left brain SOBE.

- You want to prove that the possibility of having a left brain SOBE means that human thought can exist outside the human body.

- This includes that human consciousness or thought can exist post-death.

- You believe that the Brain Gate machine offers a new potential way to test this.

- You have also developed a simpler method to test this which relies on a touch sensor, and a light.

- Based on your personal experience, you have come up with needed additional equipment to bypass what you see as obstacles (not being able to hear, not being able to read things which aren’t large and easy to read).

- You have posted your theory in the same manner as you have here in multiple forums.

- You believe that for someone to successfully communicate with the physical world we all know when they are not in their body, they need to believe in the possibility, and train to do it, during their physical life.

- You are not easily deterred from your goal, truly believe in your idea, and believe that if it can be proven in a mathematical theory, the results will benefit all of mankind.

Your communication skills are good in the sense that you can write coherently and eloquently, however you seem to be having problems putting your thoughts into a format that others can understand.This is something that I deal with every day working in the training field. Preparing training materials is essentially finding a way to tell someone how to do something, however the key to doing it successfully is to do it in a way that your target audience can understand and identify with. I have worked with many extremely intelligent and knowledgeable professionals who exhibit the same issue that I see with you; you understand your theory and what you are trying to prove, but fail to translate it into terms and concepts that can be clearly understood by all. You tend to over-elaborate details and advanced concepts related to your theory, when the basic concepts remain to be understood by the audience.

In simple terms, you are failing to “dumb down” the information you are presenting, so that people can understand your basic concepts and ideas before you go onto discussing the advanced, or still uncertain parts of your idea. If my synopsis above is a good basic definition of what you have been trying to communicate all along, please feel free to use it moving forward. You should also consider how your explanations and posts compare to the synopsis I have provided and see if you can envision a way to “translate” you thoughts into similar statements moving forward.

1) Present your overall hypothesis. Keep it simple and easy to understand. Present it in terms familiar to those who you want to inform.

Example: Your title for the thread has a “fantastic” feel to it and leads to disbelief from the start. “Proving that human consciousness can exist outside the body” would be much simpler and to the point, and people would understand what you want to get across right from the start. This sets the tone for you to then explain in detail what you believe and how you wish to prove it. I understand that for you, this started with an SOBE, but your theory goes beyond that and the SOBE was simply a “eye opening experience”.

2) Present your goal. Right from the start, let people know what exactly you want to prove.

3) Present the “tools” you will use to test your theory. Explain what each tool will do, and why clearly and concisely.

4) Explain what led you to come up with your hypothesis. A personal experience is a fine way of coming up with a theory or idea (think Newton and the apple, even if it didn’t really happen great ideas really do start in similar ways) but it shouldn’t be the primary focus of your entire communication.

5) Present any open questions you have, or alternate possibilities you may have thought of. Once you have done the first four things, people will be ready to receive this information in the right context. This would include eventual results you might expect as a result of proving your goal.

6) Present what you need to continue testing and working on your theory. If you are requesting assistance, detail what that entails. One of your posts mentioned great cost associated, this may scare people off. I now have the impression that anyone can help you test your theory at a basic level using a touch sensor, a light or buzzer and a large-screen TV, along with a clear understanding of what your methodology for testing is. This simple setup is definitely something people may be interested in testing, mention the Brain Gate as another “optimal” test you can see, but don’t focus so much on it as it is clearly a lofty goal.Again, this is just a suggestion, but hopefully you will see the value. I think you have some interesting ideas and they just need to be presented in a different manner to get a different reaction. You still won’t get everybody on your side, but you’ll more likely get some curious and interested parties.

Please don’t get me wrong Tim, I’m not saying you’re a genius (although you could very well be) and I’m not saying you’re completely blinded and wrong. What I am saying is that you are indeed failing to accept some very real possibilities when it comes to your theory.

Basic fact is that as others have stated, it is COMPLETELY POSSIBLE that your SOBE experience was more of a dream-like state. People CAN be influenced while dreaming, this is proven. People CAN think they are awake while dreaming, this is also proven. The truth is that despite your belief that you had a true and pure SOBE, it is entirely possible that you didn’t and were dreaming. You are convinced that it was an SOBE, but that doesn’t necessarily mean it was beyond the shadow of a doubt.

It was not a dream, it was reality.

That said, there is nothing wrong with you truly believing that this was an SOBE, and the theory that you have come up with as a result of it could very well prove true. As long as you insist that is absolutely was an SOBE beyond the shadow of a doubt and that “nobody can understand”, however you will fail to interest anyone who doesn’t already believe in SOBEs. If you can’t interest these people, then you will never be able to prove your theory for a theory proven only by people who already believed it to be true, will hold very little value to the scientific community. It will also prevent you from enlisting the help of people who could help you to prove (or disprove) your theory in the long run.

It could, if it was treated like a customer service issue.

Example: If one person gets sick eating at a restaurant, nobody really takes the time to care, and it is considered an isolated situation, maybe they were already sick from something else, but if more than one gets sick at the same time, at the same restaurant, it is considered an epidemic, and action should take place to fix the problem. We are dealing with thousand of people who have had the same experience as I, so that would make it a epidemic. We all do not need to get sick to know that there is a problem.

This is what happened and I am pretty sure it’s exactly what happened and it was real, BUT I can’t be 100% certain until it is proven.”

Now take this theory that you have which resulted from an experience while you are still alive, and expand it to that it can happen post-death.

I would say first prove an SOBE can happen when someone is alive, focus on this as it is the heart of your theory and your personal experience. Once this is proven, then you can make the next step and say that if someone can exist outside their body, they can potentially exist as energy once they die in the same way. .

You’ve covered a lot of bases (testing different sensors, etc.) but you just need to present it properly, and define an order to your theory.

Presenting it as one big jumble of misaligned pieces just isn’t going to cut it if you truly want to see this worked on, or looked at by anyone who doesn’t already believe in SOBE thus isn’t already biased.

Also, please read what people write carefully. It is painful to see you misinterpret sarcasm and people poking fun at you as people trying to help you. Perhaps their sarcasm and poking is indeed helping you to further develop your theory on your own, but it is important to realize whether it was their intention or not. Otherwise you will find yourself wasting a lot of energy writing to them.

All right, that’s it. Hopefully this will help you to present your theory moving forward in a way people will be more willing to accept. I personally think your experiments sound interesting and would like to see them actually happen so that we can see what the results are.

If you want to be taken seriously, you need to work within the scientific methodology and ensure that you do not set the results before the experiment takes place. You also need to take each step of your theory one at a time and prove it individually.

Thank you Transformer,

from Tim