Newtonian Bowling

CraigD · June 12, 2007

Thanks for the stickification, Mercedes.

I would play along, but it doesn't seem like something I would be good at. :D

Absent detailed calculation, intuition, persistence, and luck count in this game. Keep in mind that if 111 monkey tried, at random one should get a strike – maybe more, as monkeys do have pretty human-like mechanical intuition. :(

Jay-qu · June 12, 2007

Can you put spin on the ball :friday:

ok modification to my guess:

position (4,2)

velocity (.2,1.5)

CraigD · June 13, 2007

Can you put spin on the ball

Not yet, though it would be interesting to create a body type with angular momentum and a gravity-friction coefficient. It’s on my todo list. :friday:

ok modification to my guess:
position (4,2)
velocity (.2,1.5)

Left the 4, 7, and 10 pins (a classic split, in real bowling terms):

   c                               d

              f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d






               f
                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.75045160074368274

  c                               d







              f     1

             2        3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:2.274619258730680725

  c                               d







              f
                     1
             2        3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:2.492754863526280855

  c                               d







                           1

               f

          4       5    3  6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:3.947538702882081719

  c                               d







                            1


               f
          4       5       6
                       3
      7       8      9        a

  e
Sim T:4.32288138685061816

  c                               d







                             1


               f
          4       5       6
                        3
      7       8      9        a

  e
Sim T:4.606723954709696068

  c                               d






                                1




          4   f   5       6

      7      8      9    3    a

  e
Sim T:5.252464113102110217

  c                               d











          4   f   5       6

      7      8      9     3   a

  e
Sim T:5.630775829456034979

  c                               d











          4        5      6
               f
      7                       a
                   9       3
  e
Sim T:6.333922984969319646

  c                               d











          4        5      6
               f
      7                       a
                   9
  e
Sim T:6.433163198212796601

  c                               d











          4         5     6

      7        f              a

  e
Sim T:7.814896747684310909

  c                               d











          4           5   6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:10.13426662809773641

  c                               d










                          6
          4             5

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:12.74276834571026973

  c                               d








                               6


          4

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:26.93818364451137871

  c                               d











          4

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:31.91081658739413835

freeztar · June 13, 2007

Building off Jay-qu's results:

position (4,2)

velocity (.13,1.5)

CraigD · June 13, 2007

Building off Jay-qu's results:
position (4,2)
velocity (.13,1.5)

Leaves the 3, 4, 6, 7, and 10 pins:

   c                               d

              f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d






               f
                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.950928691036618315

  c                               d







               f  1

             2        3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:2.197907995854913325

  c                               d







                    1

                f     3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a
          2
  e
Sim T:3.532699333660073598

  c                               d







                    1

                f     3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:3.711481229400547556

  c                               d







                     1

                      3
                f
          4               6
                    5
      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:4.320681805059865239

  c                               d







                        1

                      3

          4     f         6

      7      8    5           a
                           9
  e
Sim T:5.677890374760305092

  c                               d







                         1

                      3

          4               6
                f
      7      8                a
                  5
  e
Sim T:6.257024212402047323

  c                               d







                          1

                      3

          4               6

      7         f             a
           8
  e
Sim T:7.067046335083775568

  c                               d







                            1

                      3

          4               6

      7          f            a

  e
Sim T:8.336194591971233124

  c                               d







                              1

                      3

          4               6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:9.7114979906330351

  c                               d









                      3

          4               6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:100.1891241304918385

freeztar · June 13, 2007

Leaves the 3, 4, 6, 7, and 10 pins

This is too cool Craig! I love scrolling the ASCII!

Next ball:

x=5.1

v=(.01,2)

I don't think I could bowl if we didn't have uniform acceleration. It's quite challenging already. (especially without the MUMPS) :friday:

Jay-qu · June 13, 2007

Building off Jay-qu's results:
position (4,2)
velocity (.13,1.5)

building ey? you went backwards :phones:

Ill wait for the results of the your last one before making the next guess :D

CraigD · June 13, 2007

Next ball:

x=5.1
v=(.01,2)

Left the 2, 7, and 8.

   c                               d

                  f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d





                  f

                 1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.129151581334108686

  c                               d






                  f


              2       3
                 1
          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.660583098910104342

  c                               d







                   f

              2       3
              1
          4               6
                    5
      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:2.111042843782550941

  c                               d








                   f
              2       3

          41              6

      7       8         9     a
                   5
  e
Sim T:2.507936633072608453

  c                               d








                   f
              2       3
         4
           1              6

      7       8         9     a
                   5
  e
Sim T:2.525317322457848671

  c                               d








                   f
              2       3
         4
           1              6

      7       8         9     a

  e
Sim T:2.642141732752977068

  c                               d









              2   f     3
       4
                          6
                              a
      7  1    8             9

  e
Sim T:3.270748603422506357

  c                               d









      4       2
                  f       3
                          6
                                a
      7       8             9
       1
  e
Sim T:3.780938409812005104

  c                               d









      4       2
                  f       3
                         6
                                a
      7       8             9

  e
Sim T:3.866924101807587732

  c                               d









     4        2
                           3
                  f      6

      7       8
                            9
  e
Sim T:4.138466973406817131

  c                               d








  4
              2
                             3
                         6
                  f
      7       8

  e
Sim T:4.955453089700254796

  c                               d









              2
                              3

                         6
      7       8   f

  e
Sim T:5.26440506719893168

  c                               d









              2


                         6
      7       8
                 f
  e
Sim T:6.236267419670890565

  c                               d









              2


                         6
      7       8

  e
Sim T:6.243812159622428016

  c                               d









              2



      7       8

  e
Sim T:9.206268540570421616

Jay-qu · June 13, 2007

I would like to use the low mass ball, 1.75

position - (4.5,2)

velocity - (.2,3)

CraigD · June 13, 2007

I would like to use the low mass ball, 1.75
position - (4.5,2)
velocity - (.2,3)

Left the 7 and 10 pins. Notice that the lighter ball exited via the left gutter, not the usual back one:

   c                               d

                f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d





                f

                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:.777919545042750755

  c                               d






               f

                    1
              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.088831401225141388

  c                               d







              f

              2        3
                   1
          4      5        6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.359682199698044096

  c                               d







              f

             2           3

          4      5  1     6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.536127986081857928

  c                               d







              f

             2            3

          4     5         6
                     1
      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.67789928576067876

  c                               d







             f

                             3
             2
          4   5           6
                     1
      7       8               a

  e
Sim T:2.089191257551762255

  c                               d







             f

                             3

          4  2            6
             5       1
      7       8               a

  e
Sim T:2.145426340628022034

  c                               d







             f

                             3

          4  2            6
             5       1
      7       8               a

  e
Sim T:2.149602697649281967

  c                               d







             f

                             3

          4  2            6
             5       1
      7       8               a

  e
Sim T:2.151491758845930496

  c                               d








           f
                                 3
            2
          4          1    6
           5
      7                       a

  e
Sim T:2.740346050039052469

  c                               d








           f
                                 3
           2
         4           1    6
           5
      7                       a

  e
Sim T:2.741579721949027997

  c                               d








           f

           2
         4           1    6
           5
      7                       a

  e
Sim T:2.757726307339755415

  c                               d









       f
           2
     4                 1  6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:4.480659557197903538

  c                               d









    f
           2
  4                    1  6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:5.831707787566365708

  c                               d









   f
           2
                        1 6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:6.062693986860683766

  c                               d










   f       2
                        1 6

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:6.330721046784307345

  c                               d










           2              6
                        1

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:7.061848126602352592

  c                               d








           2


                        1

      7                       a

  e
Sim T:19.53002450574772863

           2

  c                               d













      7                       a

  e
Sim T:113.6839091067619267

  c                               d













      7                       a

  e
Sim T:1426.408598822751046

freeztar · June 13, 2007

Left the 7 and 10 pins. Notice that the lighter ball exited via the left gutter, not the usual back one:
...
Sim T:1426.408598822751046

Look at that sim time! ;)

The next longest was only 31.xx!

Ok, I'll try again (and again and again I'm sure). Actually, I'd like to compare two different approaches this time.

1.

Ball mass=1.7

x=5.1

v=(.13,1.5)

2.

Ball mass=1.7

x=8

v=(.75,3)

CraigD · June 14, 2007

Look at that sim time!
The next longest was only 31.xx!

That is odd – looking at the internals, it appears that the event for the collision of the 2 with the top gutter got lost, due to a bug in the code!

:sheep:

OK, one ugly fix later (from an efficiency perspective – rather than restructure to prevent the bug, I added a few redundant calculations to fix it when it occurs – accuracy is unaffected), the gutter-skipping problem is fixed, so the sim time when the last pin collides with a gutter is about 113.68.

It’s past my bedtime. I’ll recheck the previous games tomorrow, and redo my statistics.

Ok, I'll try again (and again and again I'm sure). Actually, I'd like to compare two different approaches this time.

1.
Ball mass=1.7
x=5.1
v=(.13,1.5)

Left the 2, 4, 5, 6, and 10. (which emphasizes how unlike actual bowling with tall, skinny 3-d pins this game is, as this seems nearly impossible in that game):

   c                               d

                  f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d





                   f

                 1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.541871524786457375

  c                               d







                      f

              2       3

          4  1    5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:3.11373549115469273

  c                               d







                      f

              2      3

          4       5       6
             1
      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:3.18672765140654457

  c                               d







                        f

              2
                     3
          4       5       6
          1
      7               9       a

  e
Sim T:3.932504301279100623

  c                               d








                          f
              2

          4       5  3    6
       1
     7                9       a

  e
Sim T:4.737356205666750719

  c                               d








                            f
              2

          4       5       6
       1            3
   7                  9       a

  e
Sim T:5.594343221034535679

  c                               d








                             f
              2

          4       5       6
       1            3
                      9       a

  e
Sim T:5.918824235004200073

  c                               d









              2                  f

      1   4       5       6

                 3            a

  e
Sim T:7.982483888007819619

  c                               d









              2

      1   4       5       6

                 3            a

  e
Sim T:8.046090915781519419

  c                               d









     1        2

          4       5       6

                              a

  e
Sim T:12.24047467539547201

  c                               d









              2

          4       5       6

                              a

  e
Sim T:39.90734327008380854

2.
Ball mass=1.7
x=8
v=(.75,3)

left all ten pins – a true “gutter ball”:

   c                               d

                              f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d







                  1
                                 f
              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.25

  c                               d







                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.333333333333333343

CraigD · June 14, 2007

OK, one ugly fix later (from an efficiency perspective – rather than restructure to prevent the bug, I added a few redundant calculations to fix it when it occurs – accuracy is unaffected), the gutter-skipping problem is fixed, so the sim time when the last pin collides with a gutter is about 113.68.

It’s past my bedtime. I’ll recheck the previous games tomorrow, and redo my statistics.

I made an additional code change to un-uglify it, eliminating the redundant calculations, posted the fixed code were the unfixed appeared in post #1, and reran it for the previous contest submissions. Programmers luck smiles upon me, but with irony, and there were no differences in any previous results except for the example I gave in post #1, which I fixed. :doh:

So, after 8 days, we are still waiting for a first winner! To summarize the competition so far:

(example, doesn’t count): ball mass 3, x=1.5, (h,v)=(.87,1) -> 2 left: 4, 10

Jay-qu: ball mass 3, x=4, (h,v)=(.25,1.5) -> 2 left: 4, 7

chendoh: ball mass 3, x=1.5, (h,v)=(.86,1.3) -> 6 left: 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8

chendoh: ball mass 3, x=5.5, (h,v)=(.2,1) -> 6 left: 1, 2, 4, 5, 7, 8

Janus: ball mass 3, x=3.5, (h,v)=(.3,1) -> 5 left: 3, 4, 6, 7, 8

Jay-qu: ball mass 3, x=4, (h,v)=(.2,1.5) -> 3 left: 4, 7, 10

freeztar: ball mass 3, x=4, (h,v)=(.13,1.5) -> 5 left: 3, 4, 6, 7, 10

freeztar: ball mass 3, x=5.1, (h,v)=(.01,2) -> 3 left: 2, 7, 8

Jay-qu: ball mass 1.75, x=4.5, (h,v)=(.2,3) -> 2 left: 7, 10

freeztar: ball mass 1.7, x=5.1, (h,v)=(.13,1.5) -> 5 left: 2, 4, 5, 6, 10

freeztar: ball mass 1.7, x=8, (h,v)=(.75,3) -> 10 left: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10

So, YOU can still be the first to win this game of pure Newtonian mechanics – but only if you play. Bring your algebra and arithmetic, your iterative technique, dazzling intuition or blind luck, and play! :)

June 14, 2007

I made an additional code change to un-uglify it, eliminating the redundant calculations, posted the fixed code were the unfixed appeared in post #1, :doh:

:)

If I understand correctly, the code box in post #1 is new and improved, so, get rid of the code I have been using, and plug-in the new and improved?

CraigD · June 14, 2007

If I understand correctly, the code box in post #1 is new and improved, so, get rid of the code I have been using, and plug-in the new and improved?

Yes – though “new and debugged” would be a better description.

:)

Repeating the procedure you followed to load and save the original code do the job.

Though the bug doesn’t appear to affect many simulation runs of the “bowling alley”, it effects enough of them that you should mistrust results obtained from the old code.

All of life is a beta test … :doh:

June 14, 2007

Yes – though “new and debugged” would be a better description.
:)

My apoligies, old slang....That belongs in the "Do you remember"

thread......

Now where's that scorecard?

freeztar · June 15, 2007

left all ten pins – a true “gutter ball”:

   c                               d

                              f





                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:0

  c                               d







                  1
                                 f
              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.25

  c                               d







                  1

              2       3

          4       5       6

      7       8       9       a

  e
Sim T:1.333333333333333343

I forgot the minus sign. :spam:

Let's try it again...

Ball mass=1.7

x=8.5

v=(-1.5,3)

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