How soon will a moneyless society change the way we percieve each other?

[cslagle]

All,

I think that a book by James Redfeild addresses this theory. It was his book, The Celestine Prophecy , that gave me hope for human evolution toward a greater good. With so many bad happenings in the world, the thought of a moneyless society is uplifting.

His theory was that in the next step of our evolution we will exchange thoughts as currency, instead of money. We will no longer have to work for food production, and other "hard labor" tasks, thanks to computers and new methods. This is evident, even from the last one hundred years, when was the last time you had to spend a few days hunting down dinner? So, we will have more time for the exchange of information, and ideas. We would become a sharing society, as was once the case, when it took a village...

Anyway, I digress. I believe that it is a lovely theory, and I would like to be one of the first to fully incorporate the ideas into my life and progress to this next stage of evolution.

Sincerely,

Carla

[TheBigDog]

All,

I think that a book by James Redfeild addresses this theory. It was his book, The Celestine Prophecy , that gave me hope for human evolution toward a greater good. With so many bad happenings in the world, the thought of a moneyless society is uplifting.

His theory was that in the next step of our evolution we will exchange thoughts as currency, instead of money. We will no longer have to work for food production, and other "hard labor" tasks, thanks to computers and new methods. This is evident, even from the last one hundred years, when was the last time you had to spend a few days hunting down dinner? So, we will have more time for the exchange of information, and ideas. We would become a sharing society, as was once the case, when it took a village...

Anyway, I digress. I believe that it is a lovely theory, and I would like to be one of the first to fully incorporate the ideas into my life and progress to this next stage of evolution.

Sincerely,

Carla

Good luck. The Celestine Prophecy, while an uplifting read, is a work of fantasy. Living life by dropping your impulse control and following strings of coincidences that are the divine path of our souls is a nice way to be a vagrant, but is no way to structure a society where we don't need to labor for anything.

 

How do you value a thought without some form of money?

 

Bill

[cslagle]

Good luck. The Celestine Prophecy, while an uplifting read, is a work of fantasy. Living life by dropping your impulse control and following strings of coincidences that are the divine path of our souls is a nice way to be a vagrant, but is no way to structure a society where we don't need to labor for anything.

 

How do you value a thought without some form of money?

 

Bill

While the Celestine Prophecy is a work of fantasy, the concepts in this uplifting read are based in science. Following strings of coincidences in my life has brought me to a fulfilling job, and great hapiness. This is far from vagrancy. The whole idea of a moneyless society seems to be based on utopia. A place where we value thought without some form of money would surely be utopian. If everyone where ready for this kind of thinking, we would not be having this disscussion. Believing it to be possible is part of what will bring this change about. I don't think it matters yet how we make the change, the fact that so many are considering this idea is enough for now.

As to how soon we will embrace this change. Many other people's thought processes will have to evolve, and I see that happening everyday.

[Cedars]

All,

This is evident, even from the last one hundred years, when was the last time you had to spend a few days hunting down dinner? So, we will have more time for the exchange of information, and ideas. We would become a sharing society, as was once the case, when it took a village...

Anyway, I digress. I believe that it is a lovely theory, and I would like to be one of the first to fully incorporate the ideas into my life and progress to this next stage of evolution.

Sincerely,

Carla

 

Technology has increased the output of the agriculture sector of society but just because you personally have not gone out and hunted down dinner doesnt mean someone hasnt hunted for you.

 

We just call them feed lots and slaughterhouses now.

[Buffy]

Anyone watch "Dirty Jobs" on the Discovery Channel?

 

Who'd wanna do *that*,

Buffy

[Peacemaker]

Anyone watch "Dirty Jobs" on the Discovery Channel?

 

Who'd wanna do *that*,

Buffy

 

Hi Buffy,

 

Fortunately there are people who are already prepared to do these jobs, otherwise we would be living in a world of chaos and disease. I think The Wise One's suggestion that we should all have a share of doing *that* sounds extremely fair and equitable. Perhaps if we all spent the odd day shovelling s**t it would keep us mentally grounded enough to appreciate the good stuff we can have.

 

I actually watched a programme this morning where volunteers were dredging rubbish from a filthy London stream on their days off, just to make it habitable for fish and other wildlife. VOLUNTEERS Buffy! Imagine that! People who actually choose to do *those* jobs for pleasure, and for the betterment of their area in their own time. You would probably consider these people to be saddoes and losers. I think they are the salt of the earth, and the type of people I would love to spend the rest of my life living among, and being inspired by.

 

Keep your nails painted Buffy,

 

Peacemaker

[Peacemaker]

All,

I think that a book by James Redfeild addresses this theory. It was his book, The Celestine Prophecy , that gave me hope for human evolution toward a greater good. With so many bad happenings in the world, the thought of a moneyless society is uplifting.

His theory was that in the next step of our evolution we will exchange thoughts as currency, instead of money. We will no longer have to work for food production, and other "hard labor" tasks, thanks to computers and new methods. This is evident, even from the last one hundred years, when was the last time you had to spend a few days hunting down dinner? So, we will have more time for the exchange of information, and ideas. We would become a sharing society, as was once the case, when it took a village...

Anyway, I digress. I believe that it is a lovely theory, and I would like to be one of the first to fully incorporate the ideas into my life and progress to this next stage of evolution.

Sincerely,

Carla

Welcome on board Carla, and thanks for your sentiments. I haven't read the book you refer to, and so can't really comment. I don't know which way evolution will take us mentally, or physically, once we get through the initial barrier I refer to, but I DO know that we will have the choice to follow the right path for our species, and that no power or financial inducements will exist to make us veer off that course. We just steer our course using common sense and practicality as our guides. They will be enough.

 

Best regards to you and yours, from me and mine.

Peacemaker.

[Buffy]

Fortunately there are people who are already prepared to do these jobs, otherwise we would be living in a world of chaos and disease.

The question is of course, "would they do it if it wasn't the only thing someone would pay them to do so they could earn a living?" You throw this one out, but its obvious that you see how transparent it is because you have to try to support it:

I actually watched a programme this morning where volunteers were dredging rubbish from a filthy London stream on their days off, just to make it habitable for fish and other wildlife. VOLUNTEERS Buffy! Imagine that! People who actually choose to do *those* jobs for pleasure, and for the betterment of their area in their own time.

How many of these folks do it full time--not just as a once a month/year, salve-to-their-conscience/ego-boost? This is hardly compelling data to show that large enough numbers of people would do it as an alternative to other things without any compelling force like poverty or societal rules.

 

Lastly you try the "it may not taste good but its good for you" argument:

I think The Wise One's suggestion that we should all have a share of doing *that* sounds extremely fair and equitable. Perhaps if we all spent the odd day shovelling s**t it would keep us mentally grounded enough to appreciate the good stuff we can have.

Sure it might be Fair and Equitable, but there needs to be some mechanism to get people over that hump of "evolution"...and again to justify this you must throw excrement at me because I dare to ask you how you're going to get there:

You would probably consider these people to be saddoes and losers. I think they are the salt of the earth, and the type of people I would love to spend the rest of my life living among, and being inspired by.

Lovely. Me too!

 

You continue to avoid saying how we're going to change human nature which is for the most part to avoid any undesirable tasks.

 

I know, I know, some smart psychologists will figure it out, you're just a big picture guy.

Keep your nails painted Buffy,

Keep your overall's on and your shovel handy, Peacemaker...

 

Apples and pies,

Buffy

[TheBigDog]

There is a giant difference in efficiency and and quality delivered by volunteers versus trained and practiced professionals. There are anecdotal situations of volunteers being superior, but it is just that, inconsequentially small anecdotal examples.

 

A society built on specialization cannot be run on a volunteer basis. It would lose all continuity and reliability, and soon nobody would seek specialists anymore. That brings us back to hunter gatherer society with no industry, and slow moving innovation and science. Part of specialization is job security. Devaluing professionals is the first step back to the stone age.

 

Bill

[kmarinas86]

The only way you can have have a moneyless society is when money becomes redundant. If you could get a Big Mac for 2 cents, travel to LA for 10 dollars, buy a house for 50 bucks, and buy a cruise ship for 3 grand - where the average personal income is $120,000 - then you can have a moneyless society run by volunteering. But until then, no way.

[Queso]

Money stabilizes our population.

It's inevitable, as weird as it is.

Gives us credit for our time

like wisdom

unlike wisdom

[Queso]

we're riding one of those into a crescendo :)

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

Peacemaker,

 

I would like to know how to receive a copy of the 65 page document that is in question?

 

But I am already in support. I would think everyone arguing against your proposal would hope for a world of such magnitude. To help encourage you, I would like you to know that this idea is being discussed more and more everyday. There isn't a day that passes that the truths of our potential aren't discussed around me. A new age of humans is already imerging. Realism and idealism are merging together to create a new for ideology. All it takes is time and effort. All we need is self-sacrifice and self-denial.

 

The biggest argument is a valid one, though. You can not make people want to do right by their fellow man. They have to want it. The saddest issue here is that it will work if we make it work. To say that it can't because we won't doesn't disprove the idea, it only creates a problem. And problems have solutions.

 

Money is the measurement of power one has. It isn't the only measure, but it is the greatest indicator. Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely. Humans created ways to measure quantity and quality in order to measure themselves, to feel better and therefore safer. We did this when we were still basically instinctual. It would seem that everyone would want to evolve farther, and we have to leave our animalistic side behind. We can not act on fear anymore. We come to point of trust. But how do we come to this point? Especially with people who only wish to prove that peace is not possible.

 

Non est vivere sed valere vita est.

Non mihi, non tibi, sed nobis.

Nisi credideritis, non intelligetis.

 

Einar Waldun

[Buffy]

I would like to know how to receive a copy of the 65 page document that is in question?

If you go to this post (#59) in this thread, you'll find that thanks to the contribution of InfiniteNow, there's a downloadable Word Document of the proposal.

 

Definitely an interesting read, and generated lots of controversy above!

 

How can anyone be against peace,

Buffy

[InfiniteNow]

Here's the properly formatted version:

 

http://hypography.com/forums/184209-post59.html

[Zythryn]

I think the biggest issue I have is the subject line has it backwards.

How soon will a moneyless society change the way we percieve each other?

This will never happen. Instead we need the way we percieve each other to change first, then a moneyless society could emerge.

Now, how you get the majority of the world to percieve one another with peace and brotherhood, that I just don't know:)

[Peacemaker]

I think the biggest issue I have is the subject line has it backwards.

 

This will never happen. Instead we need the way we percieve each other to change first, then a moneyless society could emerge.

Now, how you get the majority of the world to percieve one another with peace and brotherhood, that I just don't know:)

 

Hi Z

I have to differ here. The existence of money, along with the customs, practices and vices it has helped to engender in humanity is the main reason why humans view each other with mistrust.

 

In our modern society, there is no real reason why these prejudices and the misunderstanding and deep suspicions about other members of our race which we currently hold should continue to exist.

 

Remove money and property, and the laws designed to enshrine them in our existence and we remove the vast majority of the basic reasons for our current misery.

 

So I contend, as I originally did, that we have to get rid of these obstacles to our progress BEFORE the scales can fall from our eyes, and we can finally percieve each other as potential friends and lovers.

 

The point has been made, in many posts on this thread, that we will never achieve world peace under present conditions. There has to be a complete change in our philosophy to end the bad stuff we currently inflict on each other.

 

This philosophy now exists. I have formulated it.

 

Just because you don't understand how it works now, doesn't mean that you won't understand it when it happens. You didn't know how to read until someone showed you. This is a similar idea.

 

The trick is to present a universally acceptable philosophy to humanity that EVERYONE will benefit from. One that only curtails the right of humans to violate each other and our environment.

 

Does that sound like a difficult thing for you, personally, to achieve?

 

Please, get positive. Open your mind and have faith in humanity.

Peacemaker.