Fate vs. Freewill

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

In your opinion, do you believe believe in destiny, freewill, or both?

[Zythryn]

Freewill. There would be no reason to live if not for freewill (imho).

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

Does having the choice to do what you want negate the possbility that you were destined to make that choice? And even if it your choices are fated, would that make them any less important? If it was fate then it would actually be more important because an entire future is dependant on what occurs before it.

[Queso]

This is one of my favorite philosophies.

I think that free will didn't exist until we were able to think about our own thoughts.

Even now, as I choose which words to type, it was an inevitability all along.

Or was it?

[Queso]

It's as if free will comes with awareness.

It's probably just an illusion,

but what isn't?

[Zythryn]

If you were destined to make a certain choice, then you really never had the choice. You may have the illusion of choice, but there never was a true choice.

 

While the choice is still important, the individual becomes meaningless. And that, I refuse to believe. I am significant and I can make a difference.

 

And yes Orb, I agree this is a very fun topic:)

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

But every choice you make is determined by the experiences that occured before that choice. The choice you make is carefully calculated using different variables, and is done so consciously and sub-consciously. No choice is created independently from your experiences and the way you process theses occurances. Cause and effect.

[Queso]

yup

[secnarf]

ah the big one........fate vs freewill!

fate is a little harder for me so ill start with freewill.

what is freewill?the ability to make decisions, choose courses of action, specify a preference?

we all live within and ethnocentric mindset. this directly affects our own freewill. its our choice to walk to work not drive?its our choice to have a 'holiday' and pick its destination(of course being subject to our financial situation). can you see a picture forming?do we really have a choice to work or not, we all need money. we've all "chosen" this materialistic modern western world, yeah?

dont get me wrong freewill seems like a great idea i just sometimes wonder if its just a concept to keep the masses thinking that their making all the real decisions in their life .

is it me or does that sound cynical?

[Racoon]

If its fate, I'd still prefer to live a life thinking it was free will...

 

Fate happens for most people due to their continual pattern of free will choces.

[Zythryn]

But every choice you make is determined by the experiences that occured before that choice. The choice you make is carefully calculated using different variables, and is done so consciously and sub-consciously. No choice is created independently from your experiences and the way you process theses occurances. Cause and effect.

 

 

Absolutely correct. All of our adult behavior (and most of our juvinille behavior) is shaped by past experiences.

However, it is not limited to that history.

People, on occasion, change their behavior.

Behavior is shaped by past experiences, not limited by it.

[CraigD]

In your opinion, do you believe believe in destiny, freewill, or both?

Both.

 

To quote from a previous thread:

My personal conception of free will is a pragmatic one – even if our behavior is completely deterministic, we practically have free will if no other entity can predict our behavior with sufficiently accuracy to gain advantage. If no one can know what you’ll do next, your choice of what you do next can’t reasonably be attributed to anyone but you.

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

Because we have freewill, we are destined to make the decisions that we do. People can change, but now by themselves. A person will never change unless there is an occurance that makes them do so. And that occurance is a direct effect of the occurances that occured before it. Anything that is done is an effect and therefore dependent.

[Zythryn]

A person will never change unless there is an occurance that makes them do so.

 

Many would say just the opposite. That you can't MAKE someone change unless they want to change themselves.

[Inter.spem.et.metum]

But why would they want to change unless a particular variable(s) is processed in a manner to make them do so? You do not always control the information that is put before you, and you can not control the way you process it. And if you can control the way you process information, then there was a cause for you to do so. Cause and effect.