Shutting down a democracy

[Queso]

VERY interesting lecture here:

YouTube - Talk by Naomi Wolf - The End of America http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc

 

Mussolini created the blueprint (with inspiration from Lenin), Hitler elaborated on it, Stalin studied Hitler...

 

Here's how it works (Every time)(notice how many Bush & Co. is using now.):

 

1. Invoke a terrifying internal and external enemy

 

2. Create a gulag

 

3. Develop a thug caste

 

4. Set up an internal surveillance system

 

5. Harass citizens' groups

 

6. Engage in arbitrary detention and release

 

7. Target key individuals

 

8. Control the press

 

9. Dissent equals treason

 

10. Suspend the rule of law

 

 

 

Hear . . any . . echoes . .?

[Queso]

I think this is very important information.

You can see what's happened in the past

happening all over again.

 

I, for one, will not allow such iniquity.

Homeland security my ***.

[HydrogenBond]

Both political parties engage in this. The Republicans tend to focus on control when it comes to issues of national security. The Democrats like to control when it comes to free enterprise and individual liberties, if any of these are seen as a type of risk. The two combined are big brother and big mama. Big brother is trying to protect the family from all the bullies in the world. Big mother is trying to baby everyone.

 

The Constitution is suppose to limit the role of govenment, with protecting the citizens one of its permissable roles. The Republican interpret that to mean national defense. The Democrats interpret that to mean anything that can pose a risk to anyone or anything. The latter is far more intrusive and causes the role of govenment to esculate into areas the founder fathers never even dreamed of. If we compare the ten steps to removing democracy they both scores points.

 

1) internal and external enemy; Rep; terrorists, Dem; big business.

2)gulag; neither

3)Thug caste; Rep; homeland security, Dem; activism

4) internal surveillance system, both

5)Harass citizens' groups, Dem; equal rights, civil liberties, political correctness, etc.

6)arbitrary detension; neither

7)Target Key individuals; Dem; constant fishing trials.

8)Control the press; Dem; main stream press and hollywood

9) Dissent equals treason; only for poltical advantage

10) suspend rule of law, neither. Dem=esculate rule of law.

[Buffy]

Both political parties engage in this.

<Whine>"But they do it too!"</Whine>

 

Keep those blinders on! It sure is hard to find Republican examples for the last five items, huh? :evil:

 

And of course just to emphasize: its really important to recognize the examples for 1 imply quite clearly that Democrats are not against terrorists, but they work hard to purposely kill off all big businesses!

 

A cookie for anyone who can come up with the name of the last major Democratic political leader who advocated nationalizing any companies in America!

 

For those of you who are interested: this talk is from Naomi's latest book The End of America: Letter of Warning To A Young Patriot http://www.amazon.com/End-America-Letter-Warning-Patriot/dp/1933392797/. I only recently started it, and its the usual lucid, down-to-earth Naomi: Go buy it today!

 

Its a warning to all: A lot of reasons why Democrats are unhappy with many of their representatives these days, although if you really believe in the Constitution and what the Rule of Law means, its pretty hard for any but the hard core partisans to call "their" party "perfect and above blame for anything." All I can say is look where the middle is these days....

 

CIA rendition goons, Blackwater and Norman Podhoretz, Oh My, :evil:

Buffy

[REASON]

Excellent lecture Orb. Thanks for sharing it.

 

Poltically, I consider myself an Independent, left-leaning moderate. And from my vantage point, it is important to isolate and marginalize the ideological element within, or in use of the GOP that is primarily responsible for this overt and seemingly unrestrained hostile takeover of the executive branch of our government.

 

The Neocons. :evil:

 

It is generally not the traditional Republicans or Conservatives at work here. These Neocons (or Neo-Jacobins) were sitting around in their think tanks throughout the 80's and 90's awaiting the opportunity to sieze power and implement their hegemonic, imperialist plans. I believe, based on what I've read, that the depth of their motives is far deeper than the general public has a clue about. They are able to operate out of the notion that a majority of Americans will refuse to believe it is possible what they are really up to, because our democratic government would never do such a thing.

 

Well, it's time to stop standing around like a bunch of sheep because they're doing it; right under our noses.

 

Here's an example: I would not be surprised one bit if something major happens next summer, allowed or contrived, that causes Bush to declare a national State of Emergency using his recently acquired executive powers, that forestalls the presidential election for an indefinite period on the basis that to elect a new president would destabilize our government in the midst of a national crisis.

 

 

Now consider your initial response to that theory.

 

Naomi is right on the money!

[InfiniteNow]

Is the US becoming more of a fascist state? I'd say yes, for all of the reasons shared and then some.

[Queso]

What is going to happen when we can't ignore it?

I wonder if they're going to do this differently(than fascists in the past),

I wonder if anyone with power, and a voice, will be able to steer this countries intentions in another direction.

'Cause what is a hippy like me supposed to do except spread the word and learn to survive in the wilderness? For real. I have visions of this. It's not that I want to run away and hide, I am not afraid, but I'm afraid that someday, maybe someday soon, that I will be.

The Earth is so quiet right now.

This is the calm before the storm.

Right now.

I feel like I need to do something, but I don't know what.

 

What an amazing position these bastards have in this chess game we all might be forced to play.

 

Here's an example: I would not be surprised one bit if something major happens next summer that causes Bush to declare a national State of Emergency using his recently acquired executive powers, that forestalls the presidential election for an indefinite period on the basis that to elect a new president during this period would destabilize our government in the midst of a national crisis.

 

It's foreshadowed.

You know...the maya call this next period of time (about a year) starting on november 17 of this year "The fifth night"

 

You can look at McKenna's timewaves and you can look into the past during previous "night" periods and see a pattern.

The last night just happened to be WW2.

I know, it's an obscure observation, but it's a vision that seems to fit.

 

I really, really hope not...but the echoes are everywhere.

[Dobin]

One small difference i can spot between America and someone like Hitler's rise to power.

 

Hitler was extremely popular among voters before seizing power, as apposed to Bush's quite terrible approval rating.

[Queso]

One small difference i can spot between America and someone like Hitler's rise to power.

 

Hitler was extremely popular among voters before seizing power, as apposed to Bush's quite terrible approval rating.

 

Thank GOD.

I hope WE THE PEOPLE are collectively smart enough to see this happening.

[REASON]

One small difference i can spot between America and someone like Hitler's rise to power.

 

Hitler was extremely popular among voters before seizing power, as apposed to Bush's quite terrible approval rating.

 

Bush was actually the one that was quite popular during his rise to power. Hitler never achieved a majority approval rating. As with Hitler, Bush's approval rating dramatically diminished as it became strikingly apparent where his leadership was heading. :evil:

 

Paul Craig Roberts, Senior Research Fellow at the Hoover Institute and former Assistant Treasury Secretary during the Reagan Administration, describes our situation from a July column, here. It is worth reading more of his editorials as well, found here.

[Pyrotex]

I knew things were bad, but I didn't know they were this bad. I had always thought that the beauty of democracy was that we could disagree and yell at each other, but there were never any knocks on the door in the middle of the night. But now we got Blackwater. We got to do something, but folks, I gotta admit I don't know what to do. My entire family just loves Bush (mother, cousins, brothers, etc) -- I'm the only dissident.

Thanks Orby.

Thanks Buffy.

:evil:

[Queso]

mine too. It's so weird~~~~~~~~~!

Are they testing us?

This guy alex jones did some documentaries about blackwater and how in Texas they just show up (sometimes without even cooperating with local police at all) with helicopters and explosives and blow up the inside of a certain abandoned building, run around and fire guns and even parachute in. There's videos of this, and of police chiefs who are absolutely appalled these things happened in their towns.

Next day they hired painters and people to board up the windows and they just bounced.

The people didn't even seem that affected.

How weird is that??

 

I'm wondering what they're up to now.

Just waiting for another disaster.

Self inflicted, or natural.

 

?

[Queso]

They also set up a mock disaster camp in Oakland...

there's footage of people being ID'd and put behind barbed wire or something with a bunch of guys with guns guarding them and they're told to demand food and shelter or something.

IT WAS SO FREAKY.

I don't understand that at all. It's documented on video! Youtube alex jones (He's insanely passionate...i know. some of his stuff's real good footage. other times he's putting words into peoples mouths. either way, it's entertaining in a spooky sortofway.

 

Scary how a fool like Borat could bring such racism out of some Americans.

 

I still have faith in evolution.

I feel like I'm at war, or, about to be, but

wow, you know?

America seemed so stable back in the day....

we were alive for that. we're alive right now

and it's changing in front of out eyes...morphing...shapeshifting we can see it's bones....

but into what?

[TheBigDog]

She is a very impassioned speaker, but her logic is no more compelling than the Bible's predictions of the apocalypse. She is in fact taking several of the steps she cautions about in her rhetoric, her method, and her stated purpose. But she is the good guy, so that is all right. :)

 

Beware! Slippery Slope Ahead!

 

Bill

[IDMclean]

In my opinion, by this time, we are hard pressed to reverse nearly 70 years worth of growing systemic damage. My inclination is to reset the constitution (and the government that it serves as the foundation for); convene a special assembly of the people of the United States and retool the government. There has been much learned in the last 3000 years and we have unprecedented functional access to and communication of that body of information. The Assembly, like with the formation of the original constitution, would take place over months--possibly even years--, both online and in person.

 

The most valuable things to come from this would be annealizing our slowly fractioning nation, deconsolidation of inappropiate powers into new branches of governance, a system-wide citizen's education in the governing of the United States, and hopefully a retrofitted constitutional government designed to address specific modern day issues and general, timeless, issues such as life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

 

of course, this is perhaps radical in the face of alternative approaches but this is my favored corrective scenario. I believe that a citation from the Declaration of Independence proves rather apt for expressing my stance:

That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed.

 

Re: Pyrotex - This is just one course of action that could be taken in face of the growing evidence of a corrupted, disfunctional, and--frankly--dangerous government. Another course I consider worthwhile is the plain dissemination of information to the general populus in functionally accessible and aesthetically pleasing forms like movies, games, books, music and amuseums[math]^1[/math] that are built on relevant and usable foundations. This is the one I am seriously pursuing by way of career choice, education, and social participation.

[Turtle]

mine too. It's so weird~~~~~~~~~!

Are they testing us?

This guy alex jones did some documentaries ...

 

 

I'm listening to Alex Jones right now on radio. He has a stunning grasp of facts and the sources to back them up. :)

 

Here's his new documentary >> Alex Jones' Endgame

 

Alex Jones' web page >> Alex Jones' Infowars.com :: There is a War on for Your Mind!

[Cedars]

I was going to watch it twice before posting. You always pick up stuff you missed the second time around.

 

One thing she missed was its also "all about the children". The propaganda that were not doing it to adults, were doing for the children of the future.

 

Many of the things she spoke about occurred during the vietnam war also. Agents infiltrating peace groups, the lists, creating strife to get the cameras focused in on how bad these people (traitors), people losing jobs over their activities. And that wasnt the first time.

 

She never mentioned all the things put into place via the drug war.

 

Lists at airports. Thats been going on for years. I know of lists going back to at least 1984. Someone I know is was on a list because he reported a certain type of crime attempted against him. Anyways, thats what we think put him on the list.

 

One thing that surprised me was her advocating the 2nd amendment. Good for her! But its not republicans that are trying to shred that protection is it? (see its all about the children comment above)

 

Beware! Slippery Slope Ahead!

 

Yep, I thought about that too.