Perpetual motion does exsist

[kanuck]

Someone did make a perpetual motion machine. or a ball that is just decreasing in speed so slowly it's impossible to see with the naked eye?

 

just look up perpetual motion on youtube and you'll see a ball rotating on rails.

[freeztar]

Someone did make a perpetual motion machine. or a ball that is just decreasing in speed so slowly it's impossible to see with the naked eye?

 

If it's decreasing in speed, it is not perpetual. It will eventually stop due to friction, air resistance, etc.

[modest]

Someone did make a perpetual motion machine. or a ball that is just decreasing in speed so slowly it's impossible to see with the naked eye?

 

just look up perpetual motion on youtube and you'll see a ball rotating on rails.

 

kanuck, if you've read this thread you'll see the point made many times over that what you're saying ( like a clock pendulum) is not perpetual motion and certainly not a "perpetual motion machine". Such a machine would get useful energy perpetually, or from nothing. A "perpetual motion machine" violates the laws of thermodynamics and no one in the history of humanity has successfully made one - not even on youtube.

 

~modest

[kanuck]

I'm not making an argument, to be honest it was a rather useless post. I don't have enough posts yet to put up links for some reason. I was just wondering is the contraption I was speaking of was a perpetual motion machine, but I can't post the link....

[modest]

PM me the link so we can show why it isn't perpetual motion.

 

~modest

[modest]

YouTube - Perpetual Motion http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=us7YB7eiOeQ

 

Modification of a clock pendulum. Instead of moving hands on a clock face, he's moving a ball in a circle with magnets. Many parts here including the ball itself are subject to friction causing heat meaning this machine will not run perpetually (forever). *clocks have to be wound*

 

~modest

[kanuck]

I don't know much about thermodynamics, so this post may be useless, but what if this machine was somehow hooked up to use that little bit of heat production to aid in the continuous motion of the ball? would it still lose energy?

[freeztar]

I don't know much about thermodynamics, so this post may be useless, but what if this machine was somehow hooked up to use that little bit of heat production to aid in the continuous motion of the ball? would it still lose energy?

 

Yes. You can not use the lost heat with 100% efficiency, so the system would lose energy.

[modest]

I don't know much about thermodynamics, so this post may be useless, but what if this machine was somehow hooked up to use that little bit of heat production to aid in the continuous motion of the ball? would it still lose energy?

 

According to the second law of thermodynamics: "It is impossible to convert heat completely into work". So, the quick answer is that your proposition doesn't amount to perpetual motion. If there is any friction and no addition of useful energy from outside the system - then the apparatus will eventually stop.

 

~modest

[Element6]

©opyright ALL rights Reserved. Intellectual Property Laws and Copyright Laws do Apply both United States and International.

 

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Perpetual Motion MUST EXIST considering the following is true :

 

Energy can neither be created nor destroied.

 

Therefore it is a matter of efficency.

 

I know how. xP

[Jay-qu]

I think what you mean to say is perpetual motion 'can' exist by the laws of physics, it mearly requires 100% efficiency - something that we are not even close to developing a technology for. Even then with 100% efficiency extracting any energy to do something useful will eventually stop the perpetual motion.

[Buffy]

Of course if it were not for the world-wide international conspiracy of the oil companies, the Bilderburgs and the Trilateral Commission to suppress the works of Matthew F Egan ([email protected]), we would all know the simple secret to achieving 100% efficiency.

 

A neurosis is a secret that you don't know you are keeping, :phones:

Buffy

[lemit]

Entropy! Entropy! Entropy! Yeaaaa Entropy!

 

--lemit

[Qfwfq]

Gosh folks, there has long been a classification into perpetual motion of the first and second species. Lemit, entropy is relevant only for converting thermal energy into orderly forms. Dissipation can be made very very low in some circumstances. This of course doesn't mean we've solved the world's energy problem...:phones:

[UncleAl]

1) Time is homogeneous.

2) Noether's theorems.

3) Mass-energy is locally conserved.

4) No perpetual motion machines of the First kind.

5) Entropy, Carnot cycle, law of large numbers.

6) No perpetual motion machines of the Second kind.

 

Law of large numbers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Museum of Unworkable Devices

No perpetual motion machines

 

The Three Laws of Thermodynamics: You cannot win. You can only break even on a very cold day. It never gets that cold.

 

--

Uncle Al

UNDER SATAN'S LEFT FOOT

Vote a 10 for doing the experiments!

[Element6]

They also stated that the world was flat once.

 

Hmm. I would question your interpretation of the laws.

 

Wikipedia States

"... Entropy is central to the second law of thermodynamics. According to this law, the entropy of an isolated system can only increase, while the entropy change of a system at temperature T absorbing an infitesimal amount of heat δq in a reversible way, is given by . The second law in conjunction with the fundamental thermodynamic relation places limits on a system's ability to do useful work.[3][4]

 

The second law can also be used to predict whether a physical process will proceed spontaneously. Spontaneous changes in isolated systems occur along with an increase in entropy.

 

The word "entropy" is derived from the Greek εντροπία "a turning toward" (εν- "in" + τροπή "a turning").[5] ..."

 

AS I STATED :

 

99.999999999999999999999999% efficent is close enough for me to be perpetual. I'll just add a battery to make up the difference every 100 years kick off a 9v charge for 1 second.

 

By MAN this is not possible; by GOD all things are possible.

 

"ENERGY CAN NEITHER BE CREATED NOR DESTROIED" and since we know this is a TRUE statement; you must analyze the dissipation of energy normally in the form of HEAT, and since this can be over come it is a matter of configuration.

[Element6]

Uncle Al

 

Please excuse my ignorance, I have to ask you;

 

Why do things seem to get cold when you put a vaccum over your hand?

What happens to water when you compress it?

Why do hot things seem to get colder when you put pressure on them?

Why does a magnet become affected in hot water? and Why does it work better in cold water?

 

I think the answers to these questions is startling similar and perhaps may help make a very cold day.