What Exists? No, Really.

[arkain101]

I'm surprised by the long term memory of this thread and grateful for the amazing contributions.

 

I think I may have had other things in life that took me away from the forum, so I forget where the topic ended up going.

 

It's sad to hear that thunderbird passed away.

 

What beautiful minds we have in this community.

 

 

I have been busy with life and I think firing this topic back up again would be a great idea.

 

I have tons of fresh new insights to discuss.

 

I think that... these pursuits awaken the mind, and bring awareness to aspects of reality that many people may never reach in their lives.

 

Just as a child progesses into an adult and the person goes through a process of developing awareness; this topic and its insights may push the very frontier of the awareness.

 

well I must run.

Edited August 18, 2013 by arkain101

[sigurdV]

What is this "science of mind" of which you write?

 

:P

 

1 I wrote in plural "scienceS" not "science" in singular! (That!

is a case for daydreaming :)

 

2 Im not sure i can count them (Sherlock sighs, this is a case for CraigD) "Psychoanalyses, psychiatry ...I probably meant "neuropsychology", and im sure i did not mean scientology!

[bravox]

Would anyone share my opinion that the question "what exists" is essentially meaningless and amounts to little more than an attempt to define what the word "exists" mean?

 

There is a subtle aspect that can be missed in this type of discussion. People think of existence as something beyond words, yet those discussions attempt to reduce existence to a series of statements... with words.

 

How can someone communicate that which is beyond words using... words??? It would be like blind men trying to understand what colour is; the discussion is restricted to what the words 'red', 'green' and 'yellow' mean.

 

(notice that blind people know the meaning of those words as well as we do)

Edited February 28, 2012 by bravox

[Rade]

Would anyone share my opinion that the question "what exists" is essentially meaningless and amounts to little more than an attempt to define what the word "exists" mean? There is a subtle aspect that can be missed in this type of discussion. People think of existence as something beyond words, yet those discussions attempt to reduce existence to a series of statements... with words.

 

How can someone communicate that which is beyond words using... words???

 

To answer your last question, see here how to 'communicate that which is beyond words using words':

 

http://www.deltanetwork.org/skills/nct.htm

 

To your first question, no, I do not agree with your opinion that the philosophic question "what exists" is essentially meaningless, and the reason is because the only way to answer the question is via use of rational definition of the concept "exist", and placing definition on concept is never meaningless. And yes, as shown in the above link, existence can TAKE THE FORM of a THOUGHT of something beyond words, but this not mean that existence also cannot take another form as WORDS that can then be communicated outside the mind having the THOUGHT.

 

Consider what Aristotle had to say on the topic (On Interpretation, Chap 2:16).

 

"Spoken words are the symbols of mental experience and written words are the symbols of spoken words."

 

Notice that Aristotle does not say written words are the symbols of what 'exists', neither are spoken words. Both are symbols of 'mental experience'. Thus logically it would be 'mental experience' that is the symbol of 'what exists'.

 

Why then would it be meaningless to ask a question: How can what exists be a symbol of mental experience ? How we answer this question does not seem like something meaningless to me.

Edited April 10, 2013 by Rade

[Anchovyforestbane]

Allow me to introduce, pseudosolipsism; the recognition that one's self is the only thing they can truly know to exist. You may, on occasion, have heard the words "I think, therefore I am". This summarizes nicely the answer to your question as well as the definition of pseudosolipsism; in order for one to experience perceptions and make observations, they must exist on some level. Even if nothing else exists, and thus existence to this entity is nothing like what it appears to be, this entity must exist somehow, otherwise there would be nothing to interpret these perceptions and observations. It ought to be noted that this is separate from traditional solipsism; it is not reasonable to believe that any of this is the truth. But regardless, it is impossible to argue the possibility.