Regarding The Death Sentence And Prison

[JoeRoccoCassara]

It is in fact my humble belief that No man can be held accountable for a crime no matter how ungodly because any man is just that, a man. Men can be broken, we need to face the fact that we are not in control of our fate, some that deserve life receive death, and some that deserve death receive life. Through my experience, my own world can be serene and normal one second, or it can be shaken beyond reconnection another, and I have done things in my life that make me sick because of this.

 

Yes, people can be isolated as to minimize the potential threat they bare, or they can be killed in the same manner as to neutralize potential damage when there is no other option. But they should not be treated as slaves, or sub-human things in prisons. Policemen, families, and all of us tend to whine about what happens, and tend to use our power to "make it right". Making it right can be giving a human being a second chance at life, or it could be injecting poison into them even though they pose no harm to anyone.

 

The first one is great for this person, but it doesn't help those who were effected by his crime. The second one is pretty self explanatory, bad for the person who committed the crime, bad for his victims. Now I say bad for his victims because what happened to them wasn't undone, but instead they fulfilled a bloodlust of the sorts, they experienced someone they despised being killed for no more of a reason than entertainment.

 

We should not take any rights that don't need to be taken away, away from criminals. This quote explains how policemen do just that and more, it's from the film entitled Cool Hand Luke, "You run one time, you got yourself a set of chains. You run twice you got yourself two sets. You ain't gonna need no third set, 'cause you gonna get your mind right." In this way wardens or law enforcers hide behind the fact that they must take aggressive action as to harm criminals that might pose a threat to do more malicious things.

 

My point is, our society is extremely crewed up, less so than any other in history yes, but still pretty bad, but then again, we are only human.

[Moontanman]

It is in fact my humble belief that No man can be held accountable for a crime no matter how ungodly because any man is just that, a man. Men can be broken, we need to face the fact that we are not in control of our fate, some that deserve life receive death, and some that deserve death receive life. Through my experience, my own world can be serene and normal one second, or it can be shaken beyond reconnection another, and I have done things in my life that make me sick because of this.

 

Yes, people can be isolated as to minimize the potential threat they bare, or they can be killed in the same manner as to neutralize potential damage when there is no other option. But they should not be treated as slaves, or sub-human things in prisons. Policemen, families, and all of us tend to whine about what happens, and tend to use our power to "make it right". Making it right can be giving a human being a second chance at life, or it could be injecting poison into them even though they pose no harm to anyone.

 

The first one is great for this person, but it doesn't help those who were effected by his crime. The second one is pretty self explanatory, bad for the person who committed the crime, bad for his victims. Now I say bad for his victims because what happened to them wasn't undone, but instead they fulfilled a bloodlust of the sorts, they experienced someone they despised being killed for no more of a reason than entertainment.

 

We should not take any rights that don't need to be taken away, away from criminals. This quote explains how policemen do just that and more, it's from the film entitled Cool Hand Luke, "You run one time, you got yourself a set of chains. You run twice you got yourself two sets. You ain't gonna need no third set, 'cause you gonna get your mind right." In this way wardens or law enforcers hide behind the fact that they must take aggressive action as to harm criminals that might pose a threat to do more malicious things.

 

My point is, our society is extremely crewed up, less so than any other in history yes, but still pretty bad, but then again, we are only human.

 

I think it needs to be asked, "How would you propose that people who break the law be punished?" There is lots of precedents for punishment in religion, cut off the hand of someone who steals, an eye for an eye, Death by stoning for adultery or homosexuality. Or in our society you give money to thieves so they can keep their summer homes as long as the crime is too complex to blame on one person and or the amount of money stolen is big enough to hurt lots of people. To really discuss this we need to agree on punishment for crimes, classes of crime and allow some leeway in each class for how ever bad the crime was.

 

Personally I think the death penalty is too good for most murderers, but that's just my slant. Possibly violent crimes should be punished by sterilization of the criminal and everyone who shares at least half of his genetic material? This sterilization would cut crime in two ways, if you had a close relative that was breaking the law you would be motivated to make them stop, it would also clear genes that caused violent behavior from our genome.

[pamela]

are you serious, Moontanman? Sterilize? The offspring who share the genetic material? There are many things that can generate violent behaviour. For example, Intermittant Explosive Disorder. This originates in the part of the brain where seizure activity occurs, similar to the misfiring of transmitters to the receptors. Sodium nitrate, found in processed meat can trigger an episode that results in violence if consumed. Should we consider that the child or adult, who exihibits such behaviour as genetically inferior and toss them away? Or, do we make strides to understand and come up with modifications and/or treatment to correct the violence?

[Moontanman]

are you serious, Moontanman? Sterilize? The offspring who share the genetic material? There are many things that can generate violent behaviour. For example, Intermittant Explosive Disorder. This originates in the part of the brain where seizure activity occurs, similar to the misfiring of transmitters to the receptors. Sodium nitrate, found in processed meat can trigger an episode that results in violence if consumed. Should we consider that the child or adult, who exihibits such behaviour as genetically inferior and toss them away? Or, do we make strides to understand and come up with modifications and/or treatment to correct the violence?

 

No I wasn't being serious, I was telling some things I'd read about punishment and crime. These things are no better than stoning adulterers to death or cutting off the hand of a thief. Real world solutions to crime are far more complex and very little if any crime can be cured by eugenics.

[pamela]

I obviously missed your sarcasm.......

I am not aware of this type of Old Testament punishment going on today in the US, but, i imagine some countries may still be doing this. You would need to look at the source of the crime and all factors before determining a death sentence.Would I, in vigilante justice qualify for the death sentence, if i shredded and mauled a criminal who had raped and killed my son?

[Moontanman]

I obviously missed your sarcasm.......

I am not aware of this type of Old Testament punishment going on today in the US, but, i imagine some countries may still be doing this. You would need to look at the source of the crime and all factors before determining a death sentence.Would I, in vigilante justice qualify for the death sentence, if i shredded and mauled a criminal who had raped and killed my son?

 

I would give you a medal, I'm not sure the courts would agree. many people want to forgive crimes of passion, decades ago a man who caught his wife in bed with another person :evil: could usually get by with killing his wife and sometimes the other person as well. This loop hole in the law was used many times to allow a man to kill his wife and then claim he caught her in bed with another person. Of course often the other person got away and was never seen or known. I think each crime is unique in most instances but things like rape and murder for the simple fun of it should be subject to the possibility of extreme prejudice. Serial killers or rapists should be subject to the worst possible punishments.

[pamela]

well for those serial rapists who managed to escape the wrath of mom, there is a simple solution.;) Even if they get parole, they lack the tool to further their insanity. And of course, justice is served sweetly by their roommates who share incarceration.

Karma............literally, what comes around, goes around

[JoeRoccoCassara]

I think it needs to be asked, "How would you propose that people who break the law be punished?"

 

I don't think they should be punished at all, especially after seeing some of the things that go on in prisons to people that obviously can't stand their lives as it is. More should be put into preventing crime than punishing "criminals", a name I hate to use.

 

There is lots of precedents for punishment in religion, cut off the hand of someone who steals, an eye for an eye, Death by stoning for adultery or homosexuality.

 

People seldom understand each other, or people in general, especial back then.

 

Or in our society you give money to thieves so they can keep their summer homes as long as the crime is too complex to blame on one person and or the amount of money stolen is big enough to hurt lots of people.

 

Everyone should feel the effect of a crime, they need to suck it up.

 

To really discuss this we need to agree on punishment for crimes, classes of crime and allow some leeway in each class for how ever bad the crime was.

 

Just like the level of abuse or mental instability of the poor criminals themselves, egro, the worse they are on their own, the worse their punishment will be. But tell me, why punish someone in the first place, do you think you'll put a dent in crime, teach a criminal a lesson, or make the punishment balance out the crime?

 

Personally I think the death penalty is too good for most murderers,

 

Oh really? It's too good? Well if you want something bad for murderers, why not enslave them, make their manual task pointless and redundant, with no real goal, or end, have them work until they are sterilized as it were, except without wasting money, they would be code, they would be broken to be ideal citizens. That outta show 'em!

 

but that's just my slant. Possibly violent crimes should be punished by sterilization of the criminal and everyone who shares at least half of his genetic material?

 

Oh, so you want to change their personality in a more expensive method then the way I write above? Because people who commit crimes just have to have some sort of genetic disorder don't they!

 

This sterilization would cut crime in two ways, if you had a close relative that was breaking the law you would be motivated to make them stop, it would also clear genes that caused violent behavior from our genome.

 

Violent behavior is natural and human.

[pamela]

hey gardamorg, in your opening statement you suggest prevention-how would you go about that?

and if there is no form of punishment, what is going to prevent the behaviour from repeating itself? Did you have some sort of behaviour modification in mind?

[JoeRoccoCassara]

hey gardamorg, in your opening statement you suggest prevention-how would you go about that?

 

I was just saying that we shouldn't waste time on punishments, because no matter how you cut it, an official punishment, decided by courts, is just a high and mighty way to get back at someone.

 

and if there is no form of punishment, what is going to prevent the behaviour from repeating itself? Did you have some sort of behaviour modification in mind?

 

I won't presume to try and make society or humanity perfect, because no one can, that's the message of this topic.

[pamela]

I am not sure if i am following you....

do you think the court system is being mean? high and mighty? are you saying that the jury/court decision is an act of retaliation? and not about the consequence of action?

[Moontanman]

Guardamorg, do you really think crime should go unpunished? a serial killer should just be allowed to go about his fun with no one doing anything about it? Do you not think at the very least a criminal should be isolated from the general population to make sure they do not repeat their crimes? If some one close to you was killed do you feel like the person responsible should go free with no consequences?

[JoeRoccoCassara]

I am not sure if i am following you....

do you think the court system is being mean? high and mighty? are you saying that the jury/court decision is an act of retaliation? and not about the consequence of action?

 

A smaller or different level of severity doesn't make punishment a simple Godly justice.

[pamela]

now, you have really lost me..;)

are you looking for godly justice? and what might that be?

decisions for incarceration should be based upon morality and not upon a set of rules dictated by religion.

did you mean "playing god" by taking away life?

please elaborate

[C1ay]

I am a reformed death penalty supporter. IMO there is absolutely no sense in society spending $5 - $10 million to secure a death penalty for a killer that could be housed in maximum security for 50+ years for around $2 million.

 

Secondly, genetic testing is setting people free left and right that didn't even commit the crime they were convicted of. Me thinks it would be pretty hard to set free a dead man. The system is not perfect enough to be error free and that should be a prerequisite for capital punishment.

 

Most of my opinion can be found in the existing thread Capital Punishment: Is it right?

[HydrogenBond]

The death penalty is made complicated because of time. Time alters who we react to reality. If someone broke into your house, and was about to kill a loved one, and you had a gun and had to make the choice, either you kill the thug or he kills your loved one, the death penalty is a no brainer. He didn't even do anything yet, but just what would have happened is enough to act. You protect the innocent. For everyone murdered, if someone just so happened to be there at the right time, the death penalty would be acceptable, if it came down to this choice, which would allow the potential victim to live.

 

What happens is this original reality, in terms of justice, it is lost over time because the defense attorneys' job is to create reasonable doubt. One of the arguments is what happens if we put an innocent person to death? The answer is, that is why we are here in the first place. Think back to the time when an innocent person was being sentenced to death, but in a way that was not even humane. There was nobody there for them. If there has been someone there at the right time time, we would not be feeling sorry for the thug.

 

I believe we should use truth drugs to get to the truth. Forget about all those games designed to alter reality. You have the thug there on truth drugs being cross examined by his lawyers and the DA in front of a Judge. Within a day or so we decide. This won't distort the original reality by lingering too long in time.

[belovelife]

this is a very touchy topic

exe. ,my cousin just got charged and found innocent of rape

he waspartiing and the girl said she wanted him

well she woke in the morning sober and called rape

(regardless i gave him a huge talking to)

it went to court and the girl was found guilty of pergery

 

on the other hand

some sic ****s get off on that ****

i think they should have their balls cutoff like a dog to prevent them from having testosterome in their body (you know the reversable one)

let them live a few years to reprogram thier mond to think in a different way

then give them the option of having the revesal

how well would this work

idon't know

but it would save the effect of the girls that got hurt

in tern from the damage done to them, a mental disease being spread of fear

and misunderstanding,

 

now as long as there is less testoerone in the body

you are alot more docile right

i know alot may say we don't have the right to nueter humans

but it makes more sence then the death penalty

 

i think intensive reprogramming is in order

you know

 

as far as prevention

i think that the longer the internet is availible the less of that **** will happen (i hope), because the general amount of time most spend on the net actually become part of peoples reality

i which case

mainly on the net very negative connotations are given to many concepts

 

although those really sic ****s will still do ****ed up ****

but then we just hit the reformat button

 

sorry this is a gnarly topic

and i am not neccisarily for the death penalty

but man some of the worst, should at least be given something that makes them weaker than anyone, like a pill that weakens bones or something

i don't know

just shttlkin