Leviticus 11:20-32 and the number of feet on a grasshopper

[modest]

Moderation note: the first 43 posts of this thread were moved from Talk about God from a biology forum thread, because they are a discussion of a particular Bible passage, not the original thread’s discussion of the nature of God and relative superiority of religions.

 

Only the bible was in question here no other book or books. The idea was that why should we believe the bible or biology, which is true? The insinuation was that the bible is infallible and that biology is just what is being said at the time.

 

Since biology / bible is where this discussion started, I should elaborate on my grasshopper comment.

All flying insects that walk on all fours are to be detestable to you. There are, however, some winged creatures that walk on all fours that you may eat: those that have jointed legs for hopping on the ground. Of these you may eat any kind of locust, katydid, cricket or grasshopper. But all other winged creatures that have four legs you are to detest.

So, the bible gives some examples where insects have "4 legs" and "walk on all 4 legs". There are no 4-legged insects according to biology. This is a simple matter of counting to 6, but one source has it wrong.

 

Of course, there's no reason this has to be an issue. Unlike Craig's example above, the idea of which fictional insects are kosher is hardly going to hurt anybody. But, I was raised Baptist. I've been told over and over that every word of the King James bible is literal fact. This is recent. This is being taught with authority.

 

In my experience, most fundamentalists don't study the bible. They would have no way of knowing it contains such factually wrong statements. So when they hear their preacher say "we must follow the good book and scorn homosexuals" they are basing their decision to follow that advice on an idea of this book—an idea that it can't be proven wrong... when it can.

 

~modest

[Pyrotex]

...So, the bible gives some examples where insects have "4 legs" and "walk on all 4 legs"...

I think that goku should be asked directly, does he believe that insects have four legs?

I mean, seriously.

[modest]

I think that goku should be asked directly, does he believe that insects have four legs?

I mean, seriously.

 

Hear, hear

 

Goku, how many legs do a grasshopper and a cricket have? Is the bible correct that they have 4 legs and walk on all fours?

 

~modest

[Turtle]

that explains alot [Pyrotex], you don't know how many times i thought to myself he must be a liberal democrat

 

what about his question on insects having 4 legs? or do you need to consult with the elders to answer that? not answering direct questions is as bad behavior as your preaching here. :)

[Moontanman]

that explains alot, you don't know how many times i thought to myself he must be a liberal democrat

 

Goku, is there a problem with someone being a liberal Democrat? Some sort of special behavior you would expect from a liberal? Don't be shy let us know what you mean, guilt via insinuation is a very bad thing goku. I can name an ultra liberal human who is very important to you so tread lightly when you go there. Oh and by the way, do insects have four legs, six legs, eight legs, ten legs, or multiples of those numbers?

[C1ay]

what about his question on insects having 4 legs? or do you need to consult with the elders to answer that? not answering direct questions is as bad behavior as your preaching here. :)

 

Well.........there is the remote possibility that he doesn't understand the question and then not answering the question wouldn't necessarily be bad behavior. :shrug:

[goku]

Goku, is there a problem with someone being a liberal Democrat? Some sort of special behavior you would expect from a liberal? Don't be shy let us know what you mean, guilt via insinuation is a very bad thing goku. I can name an ultra liberal human who is very important to you so tread lightly when you go there. Oh and by the way, do insects have four legs, six legs, eight legs, ten legs, or multiples of those numbers?

 

no problem for me

who is the ultra liberal you're talking about?

 

insects? some of them have 100 don't they?

[C1ay]

insects? some of them have 100 don't they?

 

;)..............................

[Turtle]

no problem for me

who is the ultra liberal you're talking about?

 

insects? some of them have 100 don't they?

 

Your response is that of a coward.

[goku]

what is it about the insects?

i missed something

[modest]

Goku, how many legs do a grasshopper and a cricket have? Is the bible correct that they have 4 legs and walk on all fours?

 

The answer to the first question should be a number. The second should be yes or no...

 

~modest

[Moontanman]

no problem for me

who is the ultra liberal you're talking about?

 

Jesus Christ goku, surely you have heard of him?

 

insects? some of them have 100 don't they?

No goku, no insect has 100 legs, I would think that you, being the farmer you claim to be, would know more about insects than you seem to.

[pamela]

Suppose he meant centipedes?

[Moontanman]

Suppose he meant centipedes?

 

Centipedes are not insects and they do not have 100 legs. :naughty:

[pamela]

Maybe he was thinking"bug" in general and not thinking winged insect

I think most people take it for granted that a centipede has one hundred legs- just to clear up any confusion

 

 

from Wiki

Centipedes grow their legs at different points in their development. In the primitive condition, exhibited by the L, Scutigeromorpha and Craterostigmomorpha, development is anamorphic. That is to say, more pairs of legs are grown between moults; for example, Scutigera coleoptera, the American house centipede, hatches with only 4 pairs of legs and in successive moults has 5, 7, 9, 11, 15, 15, 15 and 15 before becoming a sexually mature adult. Life stages with fewer than 15 pairs of legs are called larval stadia (~5 stages). After the full complement of legs is achieved, the now post-larval stadia (~5 stages) develop gonopods, sensory pores, more antennal segments, and more ocelli. All mature apomorphic centipedes have 15 leg-bearing segments.[verification needed]

 

The Craterostigmomorpha only have one phase of anamorphis, with embryos having 12 pairs, and moultees 15.

 

The clade Epimorpha, consisting of orders Geophilomorpha and Scolopendromorpha, derived epimorphy. Here, all pairs of legs are developed in the embryonic stages, offspring do not develop more legs between moults. Interestingly, it is this clade that contains the longest centipedes; the maximum number of thoracic segments may also vary intra-specifically, often on a geographical basis; in most cases, females bear more legs than males. The number of leg-bearing pairs varies widely, from 15 to 191, but the developmental mode of their creation means that they are always added in pairs—hence the total number present is always odd.

[Moontanman]

Even if he was thinking bug in general centipedes do not have 100 legs and are not insects or bugs and have no bearing on the question at hand.

[pamela]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

I think that goku should be asked directly, does he believe that insects have four legs?

 

I mean, seriously.

From Modest

Hear, hear

 

Goku, how many legs do a grasshopper and a cricket have? Is the bible correct that they have 4 legs and walk on all fours?

I think the orginal question got lost back in the thread, so i have reposted it for Goku:)