Have we replaced our animal instincts?

[coberst]

Have we replaced our animal instincts?

 

We are also creatures “prone to anxiety, extremely helpless in his natural state, almost entirely devoid of instincts.” Therein lay the paradox. ”Instead of remaining free and broadly adaptive, the new symbolic animal immediately became ‘symbolically re-instinctivized’ almost as solidly as the other animals were physio-chemically instinctivized.”

 

Sapiens evolved into creatures with symbolic structured modes of behavior. Human consciousness extended wo/man’s reach to infinity—wherein infinity is within the extended reach of human imagination. We are creatures with the ability to create symbolically a virtual reality that extends out to the limits of our imagination.

 

Evolution has programmed the animal world to act automatically in certain ways under certain conditions. Humans have lost a good bit of these programmed responses because we have an ego that places our responses on hold until we have had time to reflect and construct a non-programmed response.

 

Humans create the world we live in; it is a virtual world constructed principally because of the neurosis we have developed in the first five years of our life.

 

If we try to think about a virtual world I think we must start with a natural world so that we have a starting point, something with which we can compare. What is a natural world? Is it what we ‘see’? Is it the ‘thing-in-itself that Kant tells us about? Depending upon which is a natural world I think we can begin to realize that the world we live in is a virtual world. We are creatures who create symbolic worlds that are more important to us than the world we ‘see’.

 

Water boarding is a good example of what we feel about death. Being sentenced to death for a crime is a good idea of what we think about the importance of death. The things people do to prolong their life one more day is a good example. We have been very successful about hiding these anxieties from our self that we have created an inferior culture in our pursuit after something that we do not allow our self to think about. Self deception is our greatest enemy and our closest companion.

 

I am claiming that the reaction we feel when water boarding or claustrophobia is that very fear of death. If someone asks me what is the fear of death I will say that if they can imagine the feeling of being water boarded they are feeling the fear of death. Our rather blaze attitude that we say we feel about dying is our self deception.

 

This fear of death that we work so hard to hide from our self is one of the major reasons that we have created a virtual realty and this virtual world we have created is going to kill us. Now ain’t that ironic?

 

Quotes from Escape from Evil by Ernest Becker

 

Do you think that humans have replaced the basic animal instincts with symbolic type instincts as the author notes?

[Buffy]

Shirley, you jest!

 

Modified slightly? Of course. Replaced? Hardly.

 

So we've "replaced" our instincts simply because we try to deny them?

 

Ever seen an alpha Chihuahua in a standoff with a Pit Bull? Happens all the time! Isn't Punto-ito similarly guilty of self-deception? Isn't he subject to the same shortened life-span that a similarly conflicted human would be?

 

Anthropocentrism is such an ugly thing....

 

Psychiatry enables us to correct our faults by confessing our parents' shortcomings, :)

Buffy

[coberst]

I would say that natural selection, i.e. evolution, has taken a dramatic turn since the birth of human consciousness. Natural selection produced the human species and the human species has derailed natural selection. World wide the species that survive, including the human species, depends upon human created meaning and no longer upon natural selection.

 

We have become meaning creating creatures and have developed a high tech society that overwhelms the process of natural selection. The selection of what species will survive in the future no longer depends upon the process of natural selection but depends upon the process of human meaning creation.

 

Who am I? Of what value is my life? The child, when asking these questions, is saying that s/he wants to be recognized as an object of value. S/he wants to know how well s/he measures up as a hero.

 

Freud saw that the underlying foundation for these feelings and ambitions was the “utter self-centeredness and self-preoccupation, each person’s feeling that he is the one in creation, that his life represents all life” he tallied all this up and labeled it narcissism. Nietzsche saw this healthy expression as one of the “Will to Power” and glory.

 

This represents the “inevitable drive to cosmic heroism by the animal who had become man.”

 

Culture provides the vehicle for heroic action directed toward strengthening self-esteem. The task of the ego is to navigate through the culture in such a way as to diminish anxiety, and the ego does this by learning “to chose actions that are satisfying and bring praise rather than blame…Therefore, if the function of self-esteem is to give the ego a steady buffer against anxiety, wherever and whenever it might be imagined, one crucial function of culture is to make continued self-esteem possible.

 

Culture’s task is “to provide the individual with the conviction that he is an object of primary value in a world of meaningful action.”

 

The cultural hero system whether religious, primitive, or scientific is “still a mythical hero-system in which people serve in order to earn a feeling of primary value, of cosmic specialness, of ultimate usefulness to creation, of unshakable meaning. They earn this feeling by carving out a place in nature, by building an edifice that reflects human value: a temple, a cathedral, a totem pole, a skyscraper, a family that spans three generations.”

 

How does the American culture perform its task?

 

I claim that the maximization of production and consumption is the principal means for the satisfaction of self-esteem for its citizens. It is through the active participation as a member of a community that strives constantly to maximize the production and consumption of goods that the American citizen best satisfies his or her drive for “cosmic action”.

 

We are all captives of our cultural systems. Whether the cultural system dictates the stoning of one’s sister for destroying family honor or a system that finds cosmic heroism through a process that maximizes the rate at which we consume our planet.

 

Our culture is constructed from the meaning that we create. The future of our species and of all life is dependent upon our comprehension of our self and how we use that comprehension in developing a better meaning structure than we have done so far.

 

Quotes from The Birth and Death of Meaning Ernest Becker

[freeztar]

I would say that natural selection, i.e. evolution, has taken a dramatic turn since the birth of human consciousness. Natural selection produced the human species and the human species has derailed natural selection. World wide the species that survive, including the human species, depends upon human created meaning and no longer upon natural selection.

 

That is incorrect. Humans, like any other biological life forms, are always subject to natural selection. We might have artificially moved the goal posts a bit, but when disease strikes a population of humans, all the meaning in the world is essentially meaningless.

 

I agree with Buffy that using the word "replaced" is inaccurate. We still have instincts that we share with every other animal, such as the instinct to eat, procreate, micturate, etc.

 

What's interesting to me is that the instincts are all still there, but they've been cloaked in subconscious disguise. For example, the competition for physical dominance has been transformed into many arenas including dating, careers, politics, etc.

[coberst]

Humans still have the biological instincts but the ego stops the impact of the instincts on immediate action. This gives time for conscious analysis before any response. The world is now moved primarily by the power humans have created in our technology.

 

Darwin informs us that the species that cannot adapt to the changing environment will quickly become toast. We presently cannot keep pace with our technology driven environment.

 

Can our civilization survive much longer if our citizens fail to become more intellectually sophisticated? Presently it is apparent to me that few citizens have any idea of the problems that we face. If the citizens do not comprehend what is going on they certainly will be unwilling to make the sacrifices required. I see CT as fundamental to increasing our level of sophistication.

 

We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented.

[freeztar]

Humans still have the biological instincts but the ego stops the impact of the instincts on immediate action.

 

I agree with this statement. So, perhaps the title of this thread is a bit misleading.

 

This gives time for conscious analysis before any response. The world is now moved primarily by the power humans have created in our technology.

 

Darwin informs us that the species that cannot adapt to the changing environment will quickly become toast. We presently cannot keep pace with our technology driven environment.

 

Can our civilization survive much longer if our citizens fail to become more intellectually sophisticated? Presently it is apparent to me that few citizens have any idea of the problems that we face. If the citizens do not comprehend what is going on they certainly will be unwilling to make the sacrifices required. I see CT as fundamental to increasing our level of sophistication.

 

We were born smart enough but we weren’t born intellectually sophisticated enough to handle this high tech world we have invented.

 

I don't know coberst. For younger generations, the latest technology is par for the course. It might be that technology will become our savior. It's at least a 50/50 split whether it will save or ruin us, imho.

[Thunderbird]

Critical thinking is clearly lacking in our educational system and effects greatly the choices we make as a democracy. You made this point on many occasions, and I agree.

My question is this. As an evolutionary ladder from primal instincts to self reflective ego, is critical thinking the evolutionary pinnacle that a man can attain ?

[Buffy]

Humans still have the biological instincts but the ego stops the impact of the instincts on immediate action.

I agree with this statement. So, perhaps the title of this thread is a bit misleading.

You can say that humans have that counter-instinctual ability, but it seems to me that coberst continues to go farther and say that this is a unique human trait, and I would argue that there is plenty of animal behavior data which shows that many if not most higher-order animals display evidence of ego and other "counter-instinctual" traits.

 

Anthropocentrism is one of the last big delusions in science, and while the poor little critters are not offended by this chauvinism (esp. dolphins and mice), it's a self deception that leads us to erroneous conclusions about the world to our detriment.

 

Oddly enough, anthropocentrism is, uh, instinctual....we just can't, um, help ourselves...

 

 

Don't worry T-bird, they're all about CT, but we have fun discussing them sometimes anyway.

 

The way his hooves just seem to glide,

Buffy

[coberst]

I agree with this statement. So, perhaps the title of this thread is a bit misleading.

 

 

 

I don't know coberst. For younger generations, the latest technology is par for the course. It might be that technology will become our savior. It's at least a 50/50 split whether it will save or ruin us, imho.

 

The title of the thread is to entice the viewer. Unfortunately many viewers are not readers and never read beyond the title. Still, the object of my post is to help the viewer to become conscious of an important idea. I am convinced that comprehension is like a pyramid with awareness at the base followed by consciousness (awareness plus attention) followed by knowing with understanding at the pinnacle of the pyramid. It all begins with awareness and consciousness of an idea.

 

The culture of the United States focuses too much upon the young because that is the way of consumerism. If the culture focused upon educating the young better then that focus would be OK.

[coberst]

Critical thinking is clearly lacking in our educational system and effects greatly the choices we make as a democracy. You made this point on many occasions, and I agree.

My question is this. As an evolutionary ladder from primal instincts to self reflective ego, is critical thinking the evolutionary pinnacle that a man can attain ?

 

I think that CT is a foundation for making good judgments but it takes second fiddle to curiosity and desire to learn. I suspect that our educational system, as designed by the Corporate America oligarchy, is designed to kill that curiosity and desire to learn and has proven successful in that effort.

 

Our young people graduate from our schools and colleges with severe learning handicaps.

[Boerseun]

Apparently, ovulating stripteasers get much bigger tips than their non-ovulating colleagues, who might be even more attractive than the ovulating strippers, and dancing only a few feet away. Instincts triggered by pheromones? You betcha.

 

Yep - I'd say we still have a fat bundle of instincts hidden away in the dark depths of our craniums.

 

As a matter of fact, the mere fact that more than 90% of men will agree that a particular girl is attractive, without being able to say why, points to more of the same.

[Southtown]

What can I say? My first devolutionary step off the path of instinct was referring to myself as we.

[freeztar]

Our young people graduate from our schools and colleges with severe learning handicaps.

 

In what manner?

 

Imho, any handicap for learning is self-inflicted (with the obvious exceptions).

 

How does one evoke the passion for learning? Is it qualifiable?

This seems the logical first step for the climb to CT.

[coberst]

Apparently, ovulating stripteasers get much bigger tips than their non-ovulating colleagues, who might be even more attractive than the ovulating strippers, and dancing only a few feet away. Instincts triggered by pheromones? You betcha.

 

Yep - I'd say we still have a fat bundle of instincts hidden away in the dark depths of our craniums.

 

As a matter of fact, the mere fact that more than 90% of men will agree that a particular girl is attractive, without being able to say why, points to more of the same.

 

You are filled with very valuable insighs!

[coberst]

In what manner?

 

Imho, any handicap for learning is self-inflicted (with the obvious exceptions).

 

How does one evoke the passion for learning? Is it qualifiable?

This seems the logical first step for the climb to CT.

 

 

As I remember, Aristotle noted that humans have a desire to know. I suspect that we might have the curiosity of the kitten when we begin school and by graduation we display the curiosity of an old cat sleeping on the couch.

 

The desire to learn is, I suspect, an emotion with which Mother Nature has given us. This passion for learning seems to have been axed by our American educational system, thus handicapping our young people for life.

 

I think that the only way out is for those of us who recognize this severe damage to make this damage clear to the young person and to encourage that person to read Emerson on self-reliance and to suggest that they try to find something about which they care and to create questions about that matter and then to begin the search for answers.

 

A good place to begin this healing process is for the young person to find something or someone in history that excites them and to head for their nearest college library in search for books that will lead to answers. This worked for me many years ago when I decided I wanted to learn more about the American Civil War. I went to a local college library and for a $25 yearly fee I became a “Friend of the Library” and could borrow books from what seemed like an infinite supply.

 

For two years running the librarian said that I was the busiest customer she had for borrowing books.