Sunspots and stable nuclear fusion reactors

[blain1]

Nice pictures but neither one of your links support the idea of nuclear fusion occurring in a solar flare.

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

Eyewall! Eyewall! Eyewall!

Nuclear fusion reactions occur in eyewalls of the sunspots, not in solar flares and CMEs.

[Moontanman]

Hi, Moontanman.

 

Eyewall! Eyewall! Eyewall!

Nuclear fusion reactions occur in eyewalls of the sunspots, not in solar flares and CMEs.

 

None the less you have not presented any data that supports your assertion that hydrogen fusion occurs anywhere in a sun spot eye wall or anywhere else.

[blain1]

None the less you have not presented any data that supports your assertion that hydrogen fusion occurs anywhere in a sun spot eye wall or anywhere else.

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

Pinch! Pinch! Pinch!

In above posts, I have already pointed out that the eyewalls of sunspots have huge amounts of the circular electric currents (1,000,000,000,000 Amperes for middle size circular sunspots), so plasmas in eyewalls of sunspots will pinch and will be in high temperature (above ten million degrees Kelvin) high density state, so stable nuclear fusion reactions can happen in eyewalls of sunspots.

Z-pinch fusion experiments are done almost every day; do you not believe these experiments?

Z-pinch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Moontanman]

Hi, Moontanman.

 

Pinch! Pinch! Pinch!

In above posts, I have already pointed out that the eyewalls of sunspots have huge amounts of the circular electric currents (1,000,000,000,000 Amperes for middle size circular sunspots), so plasmas in eyewalls of sunspots will pinch and will be in high temperature (above ten million degrees Kelvin) high density state, so stable nuclear fusion reactions can happen in eyewalls of sunspots.

Z-pinch fusion experiments are done almost every day; do you not believe these experiments?

Z-pinch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

 

So do you usually post links to data that have nothing to do with your assertions? So far Z-Pinch has not achieved fusion and there is no listed connection between z-pinch and sunspots. You can claim sunspots are fusion as many times as you want but the idea is supported only in your mind.

[CraigD]

In nuclear fusion experiments such as Z-pinch experiments, hollow cylindrical plasmas (a long solenoid) with large circular electric currents will pinch and form high temperature high density hollow cylindrical plasmas, and nuclear fusion reactions will happen in these plasmas.

So, strong stable magnetic fields of the sunspots just mean that there are stable nuclear fusion reactions in the sunspots.

Pinch! Pinch! Pinch!

In above posts, I have already pointed out that the eyewalls of sunspots have huge amounts of the circular electric currents (1,000,000,000,000 Amperes for middle size circular sunspots), so plasmas in eyewalls of sunspots will pinch and will be in high temperature (above ten million degrees Kelvin) high density state, so stable nuclear fusion reactions can happen in eyewalls of sunspots.

Z-pinch fusion experiments are done almost every day; do you not believe these experiments?

Z-pinch - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Blain, although you link to the wikipedia article “Z-pinch”, I believe you have either not carefully read this article, or misunderstood it.

 

According to this article, and other popular and technical description of z-pinch systems, no such system involving electrical currents in hydrogen/helium plasma has successfully produced clear signs of hydrogen or other light element nuclear fusion. All successful z-pinch systems pass very high currents through fine metal wires, which are quickly and destructively heated into plasma, which is then “pinched” to very high temperature, emitting very high energy x-ray photons. These photons then heat and compress a small container of H-2 and H-3, resulting in nuclear fusion due to the same inertial confinement mechanism that occurs in a large nuclear fission/fusion bomb.

 

So, unless sunspots contain constantly created fine wires and precisely positioned containers of heavy hydrogen, they’re not fusing hydrogen like a z-pinch system.

 

Because they destroy the wires necessary to generate their brief burst of x-rays, z-pinch systems cannot produce sustained fusion. They’re not intended to, but rather to allow research into how a more sustainable x-ray source might be used to.

 

Although not directly relevant to Blain’s idea about fusion in sunspots, I think it’s important to note that the fusion produced by z-pinch systems does not release as much energy as the system consumes, so, even if they were able to produce sustained fusion, they wouldn’t be useful power sources.

[blain1]

So do you usually post links to data that have nothing to do with your assertions? So far Z-Pinch has not achieved fusion and there is no listed connection between z-pinch and sunspots. You can claim sunspots are fusion as many times as you want but the idea is supported only in your mind.

 

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

In above posts, I have already pointed out that a hurricane is governed by a centripetal force, it is obviously that this centripetal force is the strongest in the eyewall of the hurricane.

In the same way, whole plasmas structures and motions of a circular sunspot is formed and driven by a centripetal force, and this centripetal force is the strongest in the eyewall of this sunspot, so the nuclear fusion reactions can only happen in the eyewall of this sunspot. But this centripetal force is not strong enough to ignite nuclear fusion reactions in the eyewall of this sunspot, it need help of other forces.

 

Z-pinch fusion experiments reveal an efficient compress and heat mechanism-pinch mechanism, with which plasmas in these devices can be easily compressed and heated to a high density and high temperature (easily above a few million degrees Kelvin) state. This pinch mechanism is what a circular sunspot wants to find.

 

So the centripetal force of a circular sunspot amplify the local seed magnetic fields, and produce necessary electrical currents in the eyewall of this sunspot; in this way, pinch mechanism can work now, and the plasmas in the eyewall of this circular sunspot will be compressed and heated to the necessary high density and high temperature (above 10 million degrees Kelvin) state by the centripetal force and pinch mechanism, so nuclear fusion reactions can happen in the eyewall of this sunspots.

 

Why do you think that Z-pinch fusion experiments have nothing to do with sunspots?

Sunspots need pinch-mechanism; some people will reject pinch mechanism if it is not proved by Z-pinch fusion experiments.

 

There are different kind pinch devices, electric currents in these pinch fusion devices are pulse kind, so the nuclear fusion reaction rate is low; some people think that they detect the nuclear fusion reactions in their devices, some people do not believe the results, there will be endless debates about it.

 

Hurricanes cannot be formed if there are no rains.

In the same way, sunspots cannot be formed if there are no nuclear fusion reactions in their eyewalls; the magnetic fields, Evershed flows and low temperature of sunspots all need huge amount of energy.

 

It is certain that some solar flares and CMEs are produced by sunspots; plasmas in solar flares are in high temperature low density state, plasmas in CMEs are in high speed low density low temperature state, so there are no nuclear fusion reactions in solar flares and CMEs; but the plasmas temperature of some solar flares are very high (above a few even 10 million degrees Kelvin), and plasmas of these solar flares are ejected from eyewalls of the sunspots, so plasmas temperature in eyewalls of the sunspots are certainly above 10 million degrees Kelvin, so the nuclear fusion reactions can certainly happen in eyewalls of the sunspots.

 

The nuclear fusion reaction rate is very low in eyewalls of sunspots; because plasmas in eyewalls of sunspots move at high speed (the velocity of Evershed flows is 1 – 9km/s).

[blain1]

Blain, although you link to the wikipedia article “Z-pinch”, I believe you have either not carefully read this article, or misunderstood it.

 

According to this article, and other popular and technical description of z-pinch systems, no such system involving electrical currents in hydrogen/helium plasma has successfully produced clear signs of hydrogen or other light element nuclear fusion. All successful z-pinch systems pass very high currents through fine metal wires, which are quickly and destructively heated into plasma, which is then “pinched” to very high temperature, emitting very high energy x-ray photons. These photons then heat and compress a small container of H-2 and H-3, resulting in nuclear fusion due to the same inertial confinement mechanism that occurs in a large nuclear fission/fusion bomb.

 

So, unless sunspots contain constantly created fine wires and precisely positioned containers of heavy hydrogen, they’re not fusing hydrogen like a z-pinch system.

 

Because they destroy the wires necessary to generate their brief burst of x-rays, z-pinch systems cannot produce sustained fusion. They’re not intended to, but rather to allow research into how a more sustainable x-ray source might be used to.

 

Although not directly relevant to Blain’s idea about fusion in sunspots, I think it’s important to note that the fusion produced by z-pinch systems does not release as much energy as the system consumes, so, even if they were able to produce sustained fusion, they wouldn’t be useful power sources.

 

 

Hi, CraigD.

 

I am certainly familiar with different kind pinch devices.

 

So, unless sunspots contain constantly created fine wires and precisely positioned containers of heavy hydrogen, they’re not fusing hydrogen like a z-pinch system.

 

Sunspots certainly do not need fine metal wires; sunspots use high temperature plasmas directly. Scientists use metal wires in Z-pinch device, because metal wires can be manufactured easily, and experiments are simple, they do not need plasmas confine equipments and vacuum equipments.

Sunspots are stable, but plasmas in Z-pinch devices are not stable.

 

In above posts, I have already pointed out that a hurricane is governed by a centripetal force, it is obviously that this centripetal force is the strongest in the eyewall of the hurricane.

In the same way, whole plasmas structures and motions of a circular sunspot is formed and driven by a centripetal force, and this centripetal force is the strongest in the eyewall of this sunspot, so the nuclear fusion reactions can only happen in the eyewall of this sunspot. But this centripetal force is not strong enough to ignite nuclear fusion reactions in the eyewall of this sunspot, it need help of other forces.

 

Z-pinch fusion experiments reveal an efficient compress and heat mechanism-pinch mechanism, with which plasmas in these devices can be easily compressed and heated to a high density and high temperature (easily above a few million degrees Kelvin) state. This pinch mechanism is what a circular sunspot needs.

 

So the centripetal force of a circular sunspot amplify the local seed magnetic fields, and produce necessary electrical currents in the eyewall of this sunspot; in this way, pinch mechanism can work now, and the plasmas in the eyewall of this circular sunspot will be compressed and heated to the necessary high density and high temperature (above 10 million degrees Kelvin) state by the centripetal force and pinch mechanism, so nuclear fusion reactions can happen in the eyewall of this sunspots.

 

Although not directly relevant to Blain’s idea about fusion in sunspots, I think it’s important to note that the fusion produced by z-pinch systems does not release as much energy as the system consumes, so, even if they were able to produce sustained fusion, they wouldn’t be useful power sources.

 

Why do not you think that Z-pinch fusion experiments are directly relevant to fusion in sunspots?

Sunspots need pinch-mechanism, which are proved by Z-pinch fusion experiments.

 

It is certain that some solar flares and CMEs are produced by sunspots; the plasmas temperature of some solar flares are very high (above a few even 10 million degrees Kelvin), and plasmas of these solar flares are ejected from eyewalls of the sunspots, so plasmas temperature in eyewalls of the sunspots are certainly above 10 million degrees Kelvin, so the nuclear fusion reactions can certainly happen in eyewalls of the sunspots.

 

According to this article, and other popular and technical description of z-pinch systems, no such system involving electrical currents in hydrogen/helium plasma has successfully produced clear signs of hydrogen or other light element nuclear fusion. All successful z-pinch systems pass very high currents through fine metal wires, which are quickly and destructively heated into plasma, which is then “pinched” to very high temperature, emitting very high energy x-ray photons. These photons then heat and compress a small container of H-2 and H-3, resulting in nuclear fusion due to the same inertial confinement mechanism that occurs in a large nuclear fission/fusion bomb.

 

There are different kind pinch devices, electric currents in these pinch fusion devices are pulse kind, so the nuclear fusion reactions rate is low; some people think that they detect the nuclear fusion reactions in their devices, some people do not believe the results, there will be endless debates about it.

 

The nuclear fusion reaction rate is very low in eyewalls of sunspots; because plasmas in eyewalls of sunspots move at high speed (the velocity of Evershed flows is 1 – 9km/s).

[Moontanman]

Blain, i am not knocking your idea because I think it's silly or out of some desire to follow the main stream but your connection of hurricanes and sun spots is not spot on. I have experienced many hurricanes from the stand point of being on the ground as the eye wall passed over head, this does not make me an expert on hurricanes or what makes them happen nor does your assertions of similarities make you an expert on either one.

 

I have searched the web and have found nothing to back up your assertions other than your assertions. Temps in sunspots are high but the pressures are not, pressures inside the sun at it's core play a key role in fusion, at least as important as the temps. just because a hurricane looks like a spiral galaxy doesn't make them contain similar phenomena, the eye walls of hurricanes are a wild thing to see but i see no reason to say fusion occurs in sunspots because they are shaped by similar forces that hurricanes are, I'm not even sure the shape is all that similar or the forces.

 

I know that there are two spirals in a hurricane, one above the and one below going in opposite directions. I honestly do not see how shape defines similar forces in either one any more than a galaxy's shapes defines a connection or shared origins. One thing is sure, fusion in sunspots is not a cut and dried phenomenon like you have tried to assert, i see no reason to think fusion occurs in sunspots any more than I think there is a black hole at the center of a hurricane. or that galaxy's are made up of two spirals because hurricanes are.

 

BTW, the pressure in the eye wall of a hurricane is the lowest pressure of the storm not the highest even though the centripedal forces should be highest there.

[blain1]

Blain, i am not knocking your idea because I think it's silly or out of some desire to follow the main stream but your connection of hurricanes and sun spots is not spot on. I have experienced many hurricanes from the stand point of being on the ground as the eye wall passed over head, this does not make me an expert on hurricanes or what makes them happen nor does your assertions of similarities make you an expert on either one.

 

I have searched the web and have found nothing to back up your assertions other than your assertions. Temps in sunspots are high but the pressures are not, pressures inside the sun at it's core play a key role in fusion, at least as important as the temps. just because a hurricane looks like a spiral galaxy doesn't make them contain similar phenomena, the eye walls of hurricanes are a wild thing to see but i see no reason to say fusion occurs in sunspots because they are shaped by similar forces that hurricanes are, I'm not even sure the shape is all that similar or the forces.

 

I know that there are two spirals in a hurricane, one above the and one below going in opposite directions. I honestly do not see how shape defines similar forces in either one any more than a galaxy's shapes defines a connection or shared origins. One thing is sure, fusion in sunspots is not a cut and dried phenomenon like you have tried to assert, i see no reason to think fusion occurs in sunspots any more than I think there is a black hole at the center of a hurricane. or that galaxy's are made up of two spirals because hurricanes are.

 

BTW, the pressure in the eye wall of a hurricane is the lowest pressure of the storm not the highest even though the centripedal forces should be highest there.

 

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

Atmospheres in a hurricane are in motions (certainly except for atmospheres in eyes of hurricanes).

NWS JetStream - Tropical Cyclone Structure

Tropical cyclone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Gases in mushroom clouds of nuclear bombs are in motions also.

.:SonicBomb:. - Content

Mushroom cloud - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Glasstone S. & Dolan P. J. (eds.), 1977 The Effects of Nuclear Weapons, 3rd Edition, United States Department of Defense and the Energy Research and Development Administration, Washington.

 

In sunspots, plasmas are in motions (Evershed flow) (certainly except for plasmas in umbra, the eyes of the sunspots) too.

Evershed effect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

It is obvious that these motions need some causes and reasons, or in Newton’s word, these motions need some kind of forces.

In fluid mechanics, scientists think that all fluid motions are caused by pressure forces, friction forces etc.; in above posts, I have already pointed out that this is not a good idea.

Then what kinds of forces drive above motions if we do not use pressure forces?

Newton met the same kind of problems in 1665-1666, 345 years ago; Newton wants to know what kind of forces drive planets move around the sun.

Young Newton solves the problems, he find that it is gravity that drive planets move around the sun, or Newton derives a gravity force from the motions of planets.

Our problems are very simple if Newton were alive.

 

A motion with an eye and an eyewall such as hurricanes and sunspots is a standard kind of motion; the force, which drives this kind of motions, is a centripetal force.

 

So, we can derive a centripetal force from the fluid motions of hurricanes, and it is obvious that this centripetal force is produced by heats.

 

In Newton’s word, we can derive a centripetal force from the fluid motions of hurricanes, and then we can use this centripetal force, and magnetic forces, to demonstrate the plasmas motions of the sunspots.

 

BTW, the pressure in the eye wall of a hurricane is the lowest pressure of the storm not the highest even though the centripedal forces should be highest there.

 

The pressure in the eyewall of a hurricane is the lowest, because the speed of atmospheres in eyewalls of a hurricane is the fastest.

 

Temps in sunspots are high but the pressures are not, pressures inside the sun at it's core play a key role in fusion, at least as important as the temps.

 

Scientists think that it is the gravity not pressures that play a key role in nuclear fusion reactions in sun’s inner core; pressures are caused by sun’s gravity. Scientists think that nuclear fusion reactions in sun’s inner core are maintained only by sun’s gravity; but nuclear fusion reactions in eyewalls of sunspots are governed by the centripetal force and electromagnetic forces, their mechanism are different.

 

In sunspots, the centripetal force is the final cause, magnetic fields, Evershed flows, low temperature, and pressure distribution are effects. The centripetal force is the main actor, pressure forces are not important.

[Moontanman]

Seriously blain, so far all you have is comparisons that say nothing about fusion inside sunspots. Similar shapes and motions do not fusion make, i see no reason to assume fusion in sunspots, the magnetic fields explain the energy of sunspots quite nicely.

[blain1]

Seriously blain, so far all you have is comparisons that say nothing about fusion inside sunspots. Similar shapes and motions do not fusion make, i see no reason to assume fusion in sunspots, the magnetic fields explain the energy of sunspots quite nicely.

 

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

In solar physics, it is very very difficult to explain the origin of the magnetic fields of sunspots.

Who produce the magnetic fields of sunspots if there are no nuclear fusion reactions in sunspot?

It is the nuclear fusion reactions in eyewalls of sunspots that produce the magnetic fields of the sunspots.

Sunspots cannot have magnetic fields if there are no nuclear fusion reactions in eyewalls of sunspots.

 

All phenomena of sunspots such as magnetic fields, Evershed flows and low temperature are caused by nuclear fusion reactions in eyewalls of sunspots.

 

Sunspots are just stable nuclear fusion reactors.

[Moontanman]

Bain, just stating something as a fact without any supporting evidence is against the rules at hypo, please provide something other than your own personal claims. It's up to you to prove your claims not up to us to show them not to be true.

[blain1]

Bain, just stating something as a fact without any supporting evidence is against the rules at hypo, please provide something other than your own personal claims. It's up to you to prove your claims not up to us to show them not to be true.

 

 

Hi, Moontanman.

 

We must study charged particles move in magnetic fields (almost every plasma physics and space physics book will discuss this topic) and dynamo theory, if we want to know the origin of magnetic fields of sunspots.

Dynamo theory - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

Copper coils must be driven to move in magnetic fields by gasoline engines or turbines, if we want to generate electricity. In the same way, plasmas must be driven to move in magnetic fields by some kinds of forces, if we want to generate electric currents in plasmas.

 

Atmospheres are driven to move in helical orbits in eyewalls of hurricanes by the centripetal forces. In the same way, plasmas are driven to move in helical orbits in eyewalls of the sunspots by the centripetal forces. Then how these helical motions of plasmas in eyewalls of the sunspots produce electric currents and magnetic fields of the sunspots?

 

Ions and electrons, which move at uniform magnetic fields, will drift in same direction, if they are acted by an electric field at same time.

Ions and electrons, which move at uniform magnetic fields, will drift in opposite direction, if they are acted by gravity forces or centripetal forces at same time.

 

Plasmas are made up of ions and electrons.

In the eyewalls of the sunspots, it is obvious that there are magnetic fields; Ions and electrons of plasmas in eyewalls of the sunspots, which move at magnetic fields of sunspots, will drift in opposite direction, and produce the electric currents, because they are acted by the centripetal forces at same time. And these electric currents will produce the magnetic fields of sunspots.

[Moontanman]

None of this demonstrates nuclear fusion in sunspot eye walls dude!