Yet another reason Christianity makes no sense.

[alexander]

So, i am not one who often discusses religion with other people, but this had to be brought up. Reading the news today, stumbled across this article

Vatican welcome to Anglicans boldest move since Reformation | csmonitor.com

 

here's a direct quote of the gist of it:

Pope Benedict XVI gave his approval to a new framework to bring back into the fold Anglicans who oppose their church's liberal stance on gay marriage and the ordination of women priests and gay bishops

WTF, seriously

 

Exodus

 

Thou shalt not hate thy brother in thine heart. -- 19:17

 

Love thy neighbour as thyself. -- 19:18

 

Ye shall not therefore oppress one another. -- 25:17

 

Proverbs

 

Strive not with a man without cause, if he have done thee no harm. -- 3:30

 

Hatred stirreth up strifes: but love covereth all sins. -- 10:20

Ecclesiastes

If thine enemy be hungry, give him bread to eat; and if he be thirsty, give him water to drink. -- 25:21

 

Be not hasty in thy spirit to be angry: for anger resteth in the bosom of fools. -- 7:9

 

Isaiah

Execute true judgment, and shew mercy and compassions every man to his brother:

 

And oppress not the widow, nor the fatherless, the stranger, nor the poor; and let none of you imagine evil against his brother in your heart. -- 7:9-10

 

Matthew

Judge not, that ye be not judged. -- 7:1

Romans

 

Overcome evil with good. -- 12:21

 

Corinthians

Put away childish things. -- 13:11

 

Ephethians

Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another. -- 4:31-32

 

Thessalonians

Prove all things; hold fast that which is good. -- 5:21

 

James

Pure religion ... is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world. -- 1:27

 

Peter

Be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous: Not rendering evil for evil, or railing for railing: but contrariwise blessing; -- 3:8-9

 

 

So these are these and are as they are (and i skipped a lot of repetition), but let me voice my concern, for a religion that tries to teach love, not feeling anger, is against oppression and is above all for equality of all humans as being equal is calling for a conversion for Anglicans who hate gay and not think of women as equal to join their ranks, like "Yea dudes, that's what we are all about"... I don't recall any where in the bible where anything mentioned "love your neighbor as your brother, unless they are gay, in which case torch their house or something, let's just say god won't punish you for sins involving hurting gay people; and treat your wife like a dishwasher because she is not god-worthy, and clearly not equal to you. Also treat your enemy as your friend, unless they are not of your sect, in which case, it is also ok to single them out and since god doesn't like them either, you can just do whatever to them, for God"

Nor do i remember anywhere where it said anything about worshiping god being something different if the preacher has different sexual views of the world, or if they are female... Call me crazy, it's just not there....

[pamela]

Not sure I am following you here, Alexander.....

Are you concerned that the hate will permeate the Catholic church?

Seems like the Catholic church would want the hate to dissipate. I imagine though, the ultimate goal is too increase the numbers in the church for reasons other than love/hate and salvation

[Turtle]

So, i am not one who often discusses religion with other people, but this had to be brought up.

 

...[verbose list of christian contradictions redacted for brevity by turtle] ...

 

Nor do i remember anywhere where it said anything about worshiping god being something different if the preacher has different sexual views of the world, or if they are female... Call me crazy, it's just not there....

 

not crazy alex & your memory is fine.

 

Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burned, tortured, fined, and imprisoned, yet we have not advanced one inch toward uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half of the world fools and the other half hypocrites.

Notes on Virginia

Notes on the State of Virginia

[Moontanman]

from alexander: I don't recall any where in the bible where anything mentioned "love your neighbor as your brother, unless they are gay, in which case torch their house or something, let's just say god won't punish you for sins involving hurting gay people; and treat your wife like a dishwasher because she is not god-worthy, and clearly not equal to you. Also treat your enemy as your friend, unless they are not of your sect, in which case, it is also ok to single them out and since god doesn't like them either, you can just do whatever to them, for God"

 

Ummm, actually the Bible does indeed say these things, Put gay men to death, stone unruly children, and wives who don't obey. I think Deuteronomy is the source for much of this. The idea of killing anyone who is not of god pretty much permeates the entire bible not mention things like not mixing strips and plaids or something like that :phones:

[pamela]

Hey Moon, your statement is not entirely true.The Old Testament carries the brunt of killing and such, but not the New Testament. I do not recall your reference to stoning children, do you know exactly where in Deuteronomy this is?

[Moontanman]

Deuteronomy 21:18-21 (King James Version)

 

18If a man have a stubborn and rebellious son, which will not obey the voice of his father, or the voice of his mother, and that, when they have chastened him, will not hearken unto them:

 

19Then shall his father and his mother lay hold on him, and bring him out unto the elders of his city, and unto the gate of his place;

 

20And they shall say unto the elders of his city, This our son is stubborn and rebellious, he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton, and a drunkard.

 

21And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear.

 

 

Very few Christians dismiss the old testament out of hand when they are dealing with homosexuals but they seem to shy away from unruly children. Since most if not all Christians, especially fundamentalists, embrace the teachings of both books I include them both when i say Bible.

[pamela]

that was referring to an adult son, hence drunkard.Your statement had made me think of a young child. Can you cite the verse about homosexuality?

[Moontanman]

“If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death, their blood is upon them.” Leviticus 20:13

 

It must have referred to a young man since it had to do with him not obeying his father and mother but does that fact he is an adult make stoning him to death any better? :naughty:

 

You had better stop wearing those pants too pamela

 

22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the LORD thy God.

 

And you better not see your brothers *** either :eek_big:

 

22:4 Thou shalt not see thy brother's ***

 

Stop with the stripes and plaids too!

 

22:11 Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.

 

All these pears of wisdom brought to you by Deuteronomy

[Turtle]

Very few Christians dismiss the old testament out of hand when they are dealing with homosexuals but they seem to shy away from unruly children. Since most if not all Christians, especially fundamentalists, embrace the teachings of both books I include them both when i say Bible.

 

and jesus said, : Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. ~matthew 5:17

[pamela]

It must have referred to a young man since it had to do with him not obeying his father and mother but does that fact he is an adult make stoning him to death any better? :naughty:

the point wasn't about general stoning, which of course is horrible, i had thought you meant children and was taken aback

You had better stop wearing those pants too pamela

are you implying that i ascribe to old testament protocol? i wear the pants in this household;) and just for the record, dudes in kilts are hot!:eek_big:

 

 

And you better not see your brothers *** either :hihi:

now if he's a jackass, then i wouldn't bother

 

 

Stop with the stripes and plaids too!

stop messing with my clan dudes or there will be war

 

 

All these pears of wisdom brought to you by Deuteronomy

 

hey so whatcha think about

ruth and naomi

david and jonathan

daniel and ashpenaz

these were all rather intimate relationships

[pamela]

and jesus said, : Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. ~matthew 5:17

that was cherry picking one line turtle. It was preceded by the beatitudes and goes on to say do not murder:)

[alexander]

Seems like the Catholic church would want the hate to dissipate.

It would seem so, but how do you dissipate hate if you encourage the behavior passively? It's like if you know your kid in school is a bully, and you are like, it's ok, we'll just join you to a school where it's ok to bully...

 

Also for the record, i am not disputing anyone's personal beliefs, but this is just something that drives me up the wall, how can you stand for one thing, and do completely the opposite?

 

The idea of killing anyone who is not of god pretty much permeates the entire bible

 

Well, sure, by the hand of god, but we are not to decide who is worthy and who is not, all are equal before god (dont recall exactly where the quote is from)

 

I include them both when i say Bible.

thank you, so do I...

 

If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall be put to death, their blood is upon them.

i'm not reading anything there that it is up to man to do this, in none of that, this is how we have radicalist anythings in this world, that constantly take crap a step further. Another problem i find is mistranslation from Hebrew, every now and again you find some info on translation inaccuracies in the bible, and you can't help to think that there are people that follow that very thing wrongly, because of the mistranslation...

[alexander]

And you better not see your brothers *** either

well i keep my animals in the shed, you better not sneak in there just to look at my donkey, brotha :naughty:

 

yeah, you are coming in for a drink dammit, in pam's case, probably a few drinks then coffee, then sleep, then more coffee, then more drinks then more coffee, then more drinks then sleep again, possibly......

[pamela]

two chicks

Ruth 1:14, referring to the relationship between Ruth and Naomi, mentions that "Ruth clave onto her." (KJV) The Hebrew word translated here as "clave" is identical to that used in the description of a heterosexual marriage in Genesis 2:24: " Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh." (KJV

two dudes

Samuel 18:1

"...Jonathan became one in spirit with David and he loved him as himself." (NIV)

 

"...the soul of Jonathan was knit with the soul of David, and Jonathan loved him as his own soul" (KJV)

daniel 1:9

Now God had brought Daniel into favor and tender love with the prince of the eunuchs" (KJV)

 

don't see where these people were stoned and yes Alex, much has been changed from the original hebrew:)

[pamela]

well i keep my animals in the shed, you better not sneak in there just to look at my donkey, brotha :naughty:

 

yeah, you are coming in for a drink dammit, in pam's case, probably a few drinks then coffee, then sleep, then more coffee, then more drinks then more coffee, then more drinks then sleep again, possibly......

sleep?:eek_big:

[Turtle]

...Well, sure, by the hand of god, but we are not to decide who is worthy and who is not, all are equal before god (dont recall exactly where the quote is from)

 

erhm...not actually, or...well, not if god told you, or told your best bud or dad or someone you heard about, to do it and you decide that's good enough for you. didn't aaron loose his rod because he disobeyed what moses said god said and didn't kill some women & children of one of the tribes they were ordered by the big guy to wipe out? is that exodus somewhere? so much contradiction, so little time.

 

off with their heads! :naughty:

[Qfwfq]

Specific churches are often incoherent and in contradiction of their original sources, but how does this mean that Christianity itself doesn't make sense?

 

And you better not see your brothers *** either :eek_big:

Gee Moon, as well as the obvious fact that the *** in question is a חמור, I would note that by similar cherry picking one could even claim the Bible preaches atheism!:hihi:

 

Deu 22:4 Thou shalt not see thy brother's *** or his ox fall down by the way, and hide thyself from them: thou shalt surely help him to lift [them] up again.

 

don't see where these people were stoned

I might agree about the two chicks by what you say, except it seems very much like דבק means embrace in that instance. I'm a lot less sure about the dudes.

 

In the first case it's clearly a spiritual thing and besides, how could a dude do that naughty little kind of a thing with his own self, and even with his own soul?:naughty:

 

In the second, perhaps a castrate just doesn't count as a man?:cry: