Right to Die

[OpenMind5]

Ok, i had a hard time figuring out the area for this post...its medicine and humanities...

 

In the United States here there is a case that has gone ot the Suprime Courts...and been..."rejected!" heres the story.....

 

On February 25, Terri Schiavo, 26, collapses in her home from what doctors believe is a potassium imbalance. Oxygen flow to her brain is interrupted for about five minutes, causing permanent damage. A court rules that she is incapacitated and her husband, Michael Schiavo, is appointed as her legal guardian.

She has been a "Vegitable" state for about 15 years! Her husband, says his wife would never want to be in a state like that...so he wanted to remove her feeding tube (Remind u she is basicly brain dead and SOME docs say she has no chance or no feeling of pain) and let her die. On the other hand...

Her parents DON'T want the tube to be removed...and they have been fighting in courts over it..finally the tube has been removed, but they are still fighting...(she is still alive)

 

So does this lady desirve to live? Or is it that she should die? Is it right for us to let her? Or what can science offer?

VERY INTERESTED IN RESPONES!

 

If you want more info...here is the story line....

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/03/22/schiavo/index.html

(you can find alot more side stories and "timelines" that are of this story...its a big thing...)

 

Op5

[Tormod]

Tough call since I only have the info I get from the news. But it seems like it's time to pull the plug and face the inevitable. She is for all practical purposes a dead person.

[Moonchild]

Yeah I've followed this. They shoulda given her an injection. At least it woulda been a quicker death. I am for putting her body and mind at rest, but I'll be darned if it's gotta be a painful experience for her!

[Queso]

plain and simple. let her die already, she's not coming back.

[C1ay]

According to the available information she told her husband, best friend, an uncle and brother-in-law that she did not want to be kept alive artificially. It's time her wishes are honored.

[OpenMind5]

So far it seems obvious, let her pass on...but the parents will not let them do this...they are fighting (and losing) but they have a "bush and a peck" of doctors that say she is aware, she does have hope...ect...

Are these just a bunch of "crack pot" doctors?

 

Op5

[IrishEyes]

I had this same discussion with some friends today. What it boils down to for us was this...

It sounds great to say "Her wish was not to live like this, so let her die". I'm all for that. I think that her husband has the right to determine what happens to her, legally. And I hope that, in this case, her tube is not re-inserted, as she has already spent 15 years too long here.

However, as a mother, I can't say for sure that I wouldn't do exactly what her parents are doing. I mean, if it weren't just some poor woman on the news, if it were my Em or Mags, or any of my older children, I'm not sure that I wouldn't do every single thing I can think of to keep them alive as well. That's a maternal thing, I guess. A mother should never be forced to bury her child. It just hurts me to even think of being in that position.

I'd love to be able to say that I would give up their lives with grace and dignity, and celebrate their lives with gusto, and honor their memory, but realistically, I think I might do the same thing as those parents are doing. I can't even imagine what they are going through. And before I condemn them as horrid people that aren't doing what she wanted, I have to stop and think about what I would do. I would fight, with everything that's inside of me, for a chance, any chance, to keep my child alive.

Of course, this just applies to my children for me. If it were my husband, I know the plug (or feeding tube, in this case) would have been pulled long ago. We have had that discussion many times, and we both know how the other feels, though we don't agree 100% with each other. Also, I would have no problem pulling the plug on a parent, if that was their wish. But it's a whole different story when you talk about my children.

I know that's not the popular answer today, but that's how I feel. Hope you will be kind in your responses, and know that I just spent an incredible time snuggling with my 'baby', and can't fathom any situation where I would agree to ending her life if I thought there waseven the most remote chance that she may one day be ok. That's my mommy voice, and that's all I can give on this one... :friday:

[Fishteacher73]

The idea of advanced directives is what we all need to remember. It is an easy and short legal document that you can have drawn up for very little (You might even be able to find templates on the web and then get them notarized). This is essentially instructions for what you want done if you are incapacitated and cannot voice the decision yourself.

 

This issue probabbly would not have gotten the media and court time had it not been for the Christian pro-life movement adopting this case to try to set precident. The husband has the legal right to decide. Florida courts have decided four times that this is the case. Even the questionable federal involvement has decided in this manner as well.

 

The saddest issue to me is that they are fighting on allowing this lady to starve to death because our current legal/medical system will not permit assisted suicide. Granted in Schiavo's state there really is no suffering in this method, it eems a bit barbaric to allow a person to waste away when we have a fully functional death machine in place for only ciminals... :friday:

[OpenMind5]

I agree, they are starving her, but they say she feels no pain...

Still the idea of assisted suicide seems to be the case here...

Should they? Is it murder or a cure?

 

Op5

[paradox]

Does She appear to be in a Vegitable state ?

 

I am pro euthanasia but Theresa should leave when she decides it is time, not a moment earlier

[Fishteacher73]

One must realize that the 30 seconds of video that constantly is shown is editted from over 7 hrs. of video taken over a course of about 10 years. Not to be disrespectful, but at this moment all she is is meat. I have seen personally the ability to manipulate the human body to make it seem that there is something there. (A good friend of mine is a mortician and has shown me how corpses can say, "brains" with a little pressure on the chest and manipulation of the jaw).

 

Aside from that I was also spoke about this to another friend whom is a critical care nurse. She said that there have been studies that even conscious individuals in heavy physical decline can hve feeding tubes removed and the patients do not notice any change or express any feelings of hunger; much less a vegitive patient.

[UncleAl]

Dr. Kevorkian allowed suffering terminally ill patients to voluntarily end their own lives thus Greatly Offending the State. Schiav-whatsherface (note derision) cannot make a rational decision (convenient) and has run out of money (hoo boy!). Nobody wants her alive if she cannot pay.

 

The primary purposes of geriatric and terminal care medicine are to rend the patient into insurance reimbursments and to use the meat as a malpractice-proof test bed for training new doctors and nurses. Administering adequate pain meds or allowing natural death are Sins Against Accounts Receivable. Yahweh gets a giggle out of suffering and death, but His priests generally don't enjoy a large coupling constant to the cashflow. Faith-based initiatives seek to solve that in trade for votes.

[OpenMind5]

Yes! Dr. Kevorkian had a cure for everything...

Maybe he had somthing going there....

 

Op5

[Michaelangelica]

Great TV show on ABC last night

It seems that our biggest drug pushers are 80-90 year olds.

It would be very funny if it wasn't so sad

Elderly Australians prepared to break euthanasia ba

Australian Broadcasting Corporation

 

Broadcast: 07/05/2007

 

Reporter: Tony Jones

 

A growing number of elderly Australians are breaking the law to secure a dignified death.

Transcript

TONY JONES: The Justice Minister Senator David Johnston has said tonight any elderly Australians willing to break the law to produce or traffic the banned drug Nembutal will be fully investigated and brought before the courts.

 

Tonight's Four Corners program revealed a backyard laboratory in the Southern Highlands south of Sydney that had successfully produced and distributed its first batch of the illegal drug.

 

The program said at least four other illegal laboratories were also ready to begin operating in Sydney, Wollongong, Melbourne and Perth with up to 800 people waiting for the drug.

 

BRON NORMAN, EXIT MEMBER: It's not illegal to end your life. Why is it illegal to have the drug that will do it?

 

TONY JONES: Members of the euthanasia advocacy group Exit Australia are alleged to be behind production of the illegal Nembutal, usually used by vets to euthanase animals

.

Lateline - 07/05/2007: Elderly Australians prepared to break euthanasia ban

[Jay-qu]

Its a tough area isnt it.. people can end their lives in many ways without the use of a drug - but this can often cause other people undue trauma. We sell guns, whats wrong with a pill?

[Michaelangelica]

Its a tough area isn't it.. people can end their lives in many ways without the use of a drug - but this can often cause other people undue trauma. We sell guns, whats wrong with a pill?

This was a very interesting and thoughtful programme; mainly interviewing people who would like to know they had an alternative to total dependence on the medical system in their old age.

The drug they were making was the pill. they couldn't see why a suicide pill was not avaible to them either. Thats why they started the civil disobedience of making their own. They were prepared to go to goal if necessary. (What judge would put a80-90 YO in jail??) Illegal in Australia but some had flown to Mexico to get it from "veterinary suppliers"

It will be interesting to see if this fascist government tries.

They had mostly discussed this with their families. They had attended seminars on suicide and dying.

They were sane; aware of the consequences of breaking the law by producing illegal drugs, and none were depressed.

They did not want to distress their families by hanging or shooting - pretty violent ways to die..

 

This is a growing movement in Oz as the population ages and age care and palliative care is underfunded. Most were intelligent professionals often from the medical fields surgeon (90)) swims every day gave himself 2 yaers,) nurses, physiotherapists etc

The NT passed a law allowing euthanasia but the right wing Howard Fedral Government vetoed it.

It is a hard area as many would like their families with them when they die but then the family member may be charged with "assisting a suicide' and go to gaol.

I think you can download the programme if you have braoadband or better.