Blind ignorance

[zephyrus17]

I personally have tried to convince Christians to see the "bigger" light in things, many times. [Note, I have nothing against the faith, but just feel empathetic for them..] Such as there being no actual proof in God's existance and such.

But one matter really made me a bit agitated at their, shall we say, ignorance.

 

Our school has this after curriculum (spelling?) activity where everybody has to attend one session of Yoga for exercise. Many Christians, then wrote to the principal to appeal out for the Yoga lesson. Why?

 

"Practicing Yoga requires you to empty your mind, thus allowing the chance for the devil[satan] to possess you."

 

"When practicing Yoga, one enters the realm of the devil and may become Satanistic."

 

"Look at all the statues and figures of the Indian Gods on their Temples! The positions in Yoga are just like those postures."

 

 

This is insane! I then asked them if they knew anything about Yoga other than the Satanistic aspect, they knew none.

[For those who don't know, Yoga is a form of meditation/exercise developed by the Indian spiritual teachers (gurus). Those "weird" positions they do Yoga in are actually ways to circulate the inner spiritual energy of a person to the 7 major chakra points of the body. Something like the concept of chi(qi) for the Chinese. This promotes health, increases vitality, improves memory, and has many other wonderful benefits.]

 

Being devoted to their religion, to me, is fine. But not choosing to do Yoga, (or an exercise/meditation developed by any "other" religion) is just simply too much for me to bear. I don't see the reason why, to Christians, the practices/rituals/activities of other religious groups are seen as unorthadox, or even to a large extent, evil. Especially when they have no idea at all about the practise, and just judge it because they were influenced by the ideals of others or "think" they know what's going on.

 

What's wrong with learning a new form or exercise? Does it defy the Ten Commandments? Christianity seemed to have(to me), developed from a good religion into something like a clan sort of thing. It's like either you're a Christian, or not; one of us, or not; good, or evil.

 

And one more thing, I've just noticed that, well, Buddhists have their enlightening scrolls and scriptures and wonderful Shaolin Martial Arts; Taoists have their wonderful Book of Changes(I Ching), meditative skills and are to be thanked for their invention of acupunture; Hindus have played a crucial part in Eastern Philosophy, and, of course, Yoga. Many other religions have had their ways to develop the spirit and mind of their people, and I just feel Christianity has a great lack in this. Of course, they have the decisive Bible, which is to be much respected, but what else do they have to suppliment their religious spirit? Gospels? Prayer sessions? Chants? Singers with produce a CD album to take chance of the capatialist gains? Christianity has gone far from being just another religion among all the other religions in the world, it's been trying to, shall we say, take over. The recent death of Pope John Paul II affected me greatly. I really respect him. Truely. Why? Though he was Catholic, he embraced all other religions, and didn't just stick to saying Catholicism (Is it called Catholicism?) is the way, or, it's the only proper "way" to be a good person. Respects, to the late Pope. May he rest in peace where ever he may be.

 

This are just my thoughts. Any comments? I'm open for discussion. And thanks for reading through.

[Queso]

wow! i never knew people linked YOGA to satanism...isn't that like the complete opposite?!!?!

totally, unbelievable, stupid. nice post zephyr.

[Fishteacher73]

Being devoted to their religion, to me, is fine. But not choosing to do Yoga, (or an exercise/meditation developed by any "other" religion) is just simply too much for me to bear. I don't see the reason why, to Christians, the practices/rituals/activities of other religious groups are seen as unorthadox, or even to a large extent, evil. Especially when they have no idea at all about the practise, and just judge it because they were influenced by the ideals of others or "think" they know what's going on.

 

Would you prefer to opt out of a prayer meeting? I undestand your position to a degree, but think you are over reacting a bit. Yoga is an aspect of a religion, and IMO should in no way be pressed upon someone that does not wish. To me it is no differet than an Ouji board. A usless piece of plastic on some cardbord, but some see it as an occultist tool. Should someone be force to participate? No.

[ldsoftwaresteve]

It's a judgement call. That is, religion in my mind is a way to judge oneself against an ideal. I am not religious but find the discussion very interesting.

 

I will say that if the ideals or practices lead to a person leading a productive healthy life and bring joy, then more power to it. Healthy views should be life enhancing.

 

I don't believe in either inflicting pain or receiving it and find any practice that ennobles such a thing simply revolting.

 

It's a judgement call, literally.

[Stargazer]

One might say that religious dogma might close your mind to such things as critical thinking, skepticism, common sense, etc. It makes you believe in things that aren't there.

 

Seriously, the Dark Ages of religion and superstition should be over by now. At least the catholic church recently apologised for the treatment of Galileo Galilei, they have acknowledged that the Earth is round and not the centre of the universe, and even evolution is ok with them. Though extremely slowly, things are moving in the right direction...

[UncleAl]

Religion is a pestilence. The universe doesn't care what you believe. Religion is about politics, power, and money as it has ever been. Its mission statement is poverty, disease, famine, and mountains of dead babies; extortionate threats and promised post mortem escrow; and lots of blood. The less you have the better religion looks.

 

Judaism got ethics, Christianity got morals, Islam got what what remained. Bloodshed increases to the right. A billion starving Buddhists worship a fat man who extols the virtues of poverty. "Peace-loving" Hindus and Muslems stare at each other with bared fangs, India and Pakistan. Arabs and Jews are indistinguishable in a lineup. Northern Ireland has been killing itself over imperceptibly different doctrinal issues of the same muddled polytheist god for hundreds of years.

 

If you want a promise of eternal bliss (vs. threat of eternal damnation) in trade for everything of value you own now plus your childrens' futures, go for religion. if you want a working flush toilet this afternoon, get a plumber. **** will arrive either way - but only one venue removes it.

[Fishteacher73]

I think public institutions should be devoid of any religious activity. I doubt anyone would really appreciate having to stop a football game to pray toward Mecca, so why should they be amazed that there are some that do not wish to pray before the game? It is not the state's job to be a church and therefore any extension of the state should be free of any religion. I think it should be noted that free of religion is not atheistic. It simply means that they follow the Constitution and neither detract nor promote any religion.

 

If you want a Christian theocracy, go somewhere else and start one. There are plenty of theist states in the world. There are not many that are truly free from religious influence and law. The Us is about the onl;y one that I know of. (There are sopme countries that probably are technically less influenced by religion in law, but have a state religion none the less).

[Stargazer]

I agree. Waging entire wars, carrying out massacres and persecution, torturing and killing people just because one happens to think that one's own imaginary friend is better than the one worshipped by the other side, is simply mindless, barbaric, stupid and wicked. But since this is so ridiculous, I think it's possible that religions are used as some sort of excuse to eradicate others. What good has religion done for us, that couldn't be done better in other ways? It gave us the Dark Ages with the oppression and murders, it gave us the Muslim fundamentalism, crusades and jihads, anti-science...

[Stargazer]

If you want a Christian theocracy, go somewhere else and start one. There are plenty of theist states in the world. There are not many that are truly free from religious influence and law. The Us is about the onl;y one that I know of. (There are sopme countries that probably are technically less influenced by religion in law, but have a state religion none the less).

I'm surprised by this. I was under the impression that religion is really important for the leaders in the USA, and that this influence them.

[Biochemist]

I personally have tried to convince Christians to see the "bigger" light in things, many times....

I would like to offer that Christians are remarkably heterogeneous in both practice and philosophy. It is an unreasonable to say that "Christians think...." as it is to say that "Americans think...".

[Biochemist]

...Religion is about politics, power, and money as it has ever been. Its mission statement is poverty, disease, famine, and mountains of dead babies....

Hmmm, UA. Mine isn't. It seems to me that you regularly associate false thinking to theists becasue of the tendency of the downtrodden, uneducated and angry to cling to God. These folks do indeed have some unreasonable behaviors. That God accepts these folks does not mean He accepts their behaviors.

[BEAKER]

I personally have tried to convince Christians to see the "bigger" light in things, many times. [Note, I have nothing against the faith, but just feel empathetic for them..] Such as there being no actual proof in God's existance and such.

Ignorance is a funny thing. What appears to be ignorance by some, is seen by others as insight. Who's right? Of course each side will tell you they are, and have reasons to back-up their position; even if only personal. Trying to convince another person of the error of their ways may be like..."casting pearls before swine". But still, it may be worth a try.

 

On the other hand there may be more weight to the other persons position than they themselves are able to adequately convey, and not being abe to present a sufficient argument does not invalidate their position; except maybe in the mind of the opponent.

 

As far as religion goes, I'll grant you that horrendous attrocities have been done in the name of God. Does that men that God intended those terrible events to happen? No. Does that mean that the men who performed those deeds felt that they were guided by God? In many cases yes. Does that make God a bad God? Not if He sees

"the "bigger" light in things",

and gives men the freewill to make their own decisions.

 

Religion is a man-made concept where all the do's and dont's are neatly spelled out for everyone; with or without proper justification; but that doesn't mean that God is behind everyone of them, neither does it mean He's not.

 

Loving God is the ultimate goal for those who practice varrious forms of religion, at least it should be; unfortunately this lofty goal is many times forgotten as the fine art of doing the do's and avoiding the dont's becomes the focus. - That is of course if you believe there is a God to love. But even if you don't, that doesn't change the reality of His existance, in spite of lack of proof.

 

I wouldn't spend too much time empathizing for the poor pathetic Christians who don't see things your way. Some people won't find out until they're dead whether or not they were actually right.

 

As for yoga, I agree with Fishteacher; no one should be forced to particiate in something they don't agree with, even if others just can't understand why or feel personally offended because they believe in it themselves, and it equates to a personal attack on them. - Besides the obvious religious implications of such a practice that you would say shouldn't be part of a school curriculum anyway.

[Fishteacher73]

I'm surprised by this. I was under the impression that religion is really important for the leaders in the USA, and that this influence them.

 

 

Religion can be an important part of the constituant population as well as the leaders, and in practice the cleavage of church and state is imperfect, but there is a reasonable voice that has been backed by the Judicial branch to secure the gov't as a secular existence.

[lindagarrette]

I would like to offer that Christians are remarkably heterogeneous in both practice and philosophy. It is an unreasonable to say that "Christians think...." as it is to say that "Americans think...".

I agree it is unreasonable to say that "Christians think..." Christians may have a lot of differences but the key commonality is their irrational belief in Biblical myths and superstitions, not thinking.. .

[Fishteacher73]

To not promote a religion is not to promote atheism either. There are aspects of science that are in disagreement with various theological views, but most are taught in the forum of science and have a good factual foundation; it is reality and education should reflect that. But just as I do not want god thrust upon me, it is not my place to deprive them of their right to believe.

 

Theology as a whole is not an arguable issue. It can be discussed and debated and the participants may alter their view, but such discourse should be voluntary and there are really no winners or loosers in the end. It is all a matter of opinion. To claim that every Christian is responsible for their forefathers error is poor logic and to propigate it in a secular realm would imply that any American was responsible for slavery and the new pope was responsible for the Holocaust. Such stereotyping is reprehensable and might as well be the Scientific Inquisition.....

[lindagarrette]

Religion can be an important part of the constituant population as well as the leaders, and in practice the cleavage of church and state is imperfect, but there is a reasonable voice that has been backed by the Judicial branch to secure the gov't as a secular existence.

Not necessarily. Religious zealots in the White House and Congress could influence constituents to disempower the courts or the courts themselves could lose secularity. It's scary times for the US.

[BEAKER]

I agree it is unreasonable to say that "Christians think..." Christians may have a lot of differences but the key commonality is their irrational belief in Biblical myths and superstitions, not thinking.. .

If it wasnt for a few thinking christians with their "myths & superstitions", you might still be sitting on the other side of the ocean somewhere thinking the earth was flat.