Aliens Poll

[Buffy]

I wouldn't say that suicide by intelligence is a guaranteed outcome like Moontanman might suggest....

It all depends upon whether or not testosterone is a convergent evolutionary development... ;)

 

Being a woman is a terribly difficult task, since it consists principally in dealing with men,

Buffy

[bongo]

i think simple organisms and bacteria live in the universe as there has been proof of existence of water..

[Turtle]

I'm definitely in the there is intelligent life but hasn't visited us. We're way too boring to bother visiting...

 

Cheers,

Buffy

 

Breaking News!!! Edgar Mitchell now says there is & they have! :shrug: >> :naughty:

FORMER NASA astronaut and moonwalker Dr Edgar Mitchell - a veteran of the Apollo 14 mission - has stunningly claimed aliens do exist.

 

And he says extra-terrestrials have visited Earth on several occasions - but the alien contact has been repeatedly covered up by governments for six decades.

Alien contact covered up, says Apollo veteran Edgar Mitchell | The Daily Telegraph

[Moontanman]

Breaking News!!! Edgar Mitchell now says there is & they have! :shrug: :) >>

 

Alien contact covered up, says Apollo veteran Edgar Mitchell | The Daily Telegraph

 

Yes! What is this now three or four astronauts that say we have had contact with aliens? I am beginning to think maybe there really is a government cover up. I mean if you can trust a trained astronaut Dr. then who can you trust? It's difficult to think these guys would lie about it.... isn't it? Damn, so much confusion I'm not I'd believe the evening news if they had live footage of a alien space craft on the white house lawn :naughty: then again maybe that's what the governemnt wants, for us to be unable to believe.

[CraigD]

Breaking News!!! Edgar Mitchell now says there is & they have!

I saw this, too, on lots of yesterday’s news sources.

 

It’s not really “news”, however, as Edgar Mitchell has been making alien claims since before he was an Apollo astronaut. In 1973, he founded the Institute of Noetic Sciences, which remains one of the best known institutes for the promotion of paranormal beliefs to this day.

 

Mitchell’s website (a pretty and interesting read, IMHO) gives one a pretty good idea of Mitchell’s beliefs, which include such ideas as morphic fields and quantum hologram consciousness. Another odd quirk of Mitchell’s is that he claims to have been nominated for the 2005 Nobel Peace Prize – according the the official Nobel Prize website, the names of the nominees and other information about the nominations cannot be revealed until 50 years after they are made.

 

Mitchell is a smart and engaging man, and a test pilot, aerospace engineer and astronaut to boot, but he’s also, IMHO, very credulous, and confused about many concepts of modern physics that should be clear to anyone with a moderately thorough undergraduate physics education.

[Moontanman]

Well thanks craig, I have been busy all evening dusting off all my conspiracy theories and now you rain on my parade:doh:

 

Seriously do you think this guy is likely to tell a bald faced lie like this or is he just addled? He is not the first astronaut to say this, maybe all that space radiation has fried their brains? It is very frustrating to have someone

(or several someones) you should be able to trust and then you see they are nuts too, at least in some ways. I ask this question, is his lack of knowledge about some things or his belief in some odd things reason to totally discount his word on this subject especially since he is not the only astronaut that says this or all they all suspect for some reason we are not aware of? It's confusing an already confusing issue. As I have postulated before just because there is a speed limit doesn't mean aliens can't be here it just means they aren't going back to their home star on the weekends. Every time we seem to get some idea of yeah or nay someone comes out and sends the counter back the other way. It's almost like theres a conspiracy to just confuse the hell out of everyone for the fun of it :singer: :shrug:

[REASON]

It's almost like theres a conspiracy to just confuse the hell out of everyone for the fun of it :) :singer:

 

I don't understand what you mean. :shrug: :evil: :hihi:

[Turtle]

I saw this, too, on lots of yesterday’s news sources.

 

It’s not really “news”, however, as Edgar Mitchell has been making alien claims since before he was an Apollo astronaut. In 1973, he founded the Institute of Noetic Sciences, which remains one of the best known institutes for the promotion of paranormal beliefs to this day.

 

...

Mitchell is a smart and engaging man, and a test pilot, aerospace engineer and astronaut to boot, but he’s also, IMHO, very credulous, and confused about many concepts of modern physics that should be clear to anyone with a moderately thorough undergraduate physics education.

 

What I got from the video that the interviewer found new from Mitchell, was his claim that 'inside contacts' confirmed to him that aliens have visited and those visitations are covered up. :shrug: This seems outside whatever confusion Mitchell may have about physics etcetera. No worries I guess, the Pope says it's OK to have aliens now, so peoples' beliefs need only be stirred and not shaken. :singer:

[CraigD]

Seriously do you think this guy is likely to tell a bald faced lie like this or is he just addled? He is not the first astronaut to say this, maybe all that space radiation has fried their brains? It is very frustrating to have someone

(or several someones) you should be able to trust and then you see they are nuts too, at least in some ways.

Listening to Mitchell’s 7/24/08 radio interview, I wouldn’t say he’s lying nor addled. He doesn’t directly claim (nor does his interviewer, who IMHO isn’t very good good at interviewing, ask) to have personally seen an alien or an alien spacecraft or artifact. He describes the source of his information as “briefed is one word for it”, and information “available to anyone interested in it and willing to dig for it”, coming from “very credible scientists and very intelligence (sic) people who do know the real inside story”. In short, he claims to have been told of the confirmed existence of ETs by people he believes, which is what most of the roughly 70% of people who answer “we are being visited right now by ETs” to polls give as the reason for their belief. If we define this behavior as “nuts”, we define about 3/4s of our neighbors and fellow citizens as nuts.

 

I don’t think his time spent in space harmed him physically or psychologically. Ed Mitchell’s belief in alien visitation, and other fringe subjects such as ESP, and conventional beliefs such as Christian religiosity, date by his own admission to his childhood. He’s not turned senile or gone nuts – he’s always believed roughly what he believes now. He doesn’t claim to personally have convincing evidence of his beliefs, but believes such evidence exists, has been secretly collected and stored by various nation’s governments, and will eventually – perhaps soon - be made public.

 

IMHO, Mitchell’s motives are honorable. He’s enthusiastic about manned spaceflight, and expects manned space travel to planets of other stars to occur sooner than later. He believes faster-than-light spacecraft will be used to do this, that such machines are used by ETs to visit Earth, and that at least one crashed and was recovered by the US government at Roswell, NM. It’s possible his claims are a well-intentioned hoax intended to promote interest in space science and exploration, but I think much more likely that he truly believes them.

 

I don’t believe that we are frequently visited by ETs, that FTL spacecraft requiring less power than the output of entire stars are possible, that telepathy is real and commonplace, that human consciousness is due to poorly-understood quantum non-local effects, or many of the other things that Ed Mitchell believes. I do believe that manned spaceflight to planets of others stars will occur sooner (before 2200, by my WAG).

 

Despite my many disagreement with Mitchell and others about ETs, UFOs, FTL spaceflight, and fundamental issues of evidence and truth, he and other astronauts remain among my personal heroes and role models. :shrug:

[Moontanman]

Listening to Mitchell’s 7/24/08 radio interview, I wouldn’t say he’s lying nor addled. He doesn’t directly claim (nor does his interviewer, who IMHO isn’t very good good at interviewing, ask) to have personally seen an alien or an alien spacecraft or artifact. He describes the source of his information as “briefed is one word for it”, and information “available to anyone interested in it and willing to dig for it”, coming from “very credible scientists and very intelligence (sic) people who do know the real inside story”. In short, he claims to have been told of the confirmed existence of ETs by people he believes, which is what most of the roughly 70% of people who answer “we are being visited right now by ETs” to polls give as the reason for their belief. If we define this behavior as “nuts”, we define about 3/4s of our neighbors and fellow citizens as nuts.

 

I don’t think his time spent in space harmed him physically or psychologically. Ed Mitchell’s belief in alien visitation, and other fringe subjects such as ESP, and conventional beliefs such as Christian religiosity, date by his own admission to his childhood. He’s not turned senile or gone nuts – he’s always believed roughly what he believes now. He doesn’t claim to personally have convincing evidence of his beliefs, but believes such evidence exists, has been secretly collected and stored by various nation’s governments, and will eventually – perhaps soon - be made public.

 

IMHO, Mitchell’s motives are honorable. He’s enthusiastic about manned spaceflight, and expects manned space travel to planets of other stars to occur sooner than later. He believes faster-than-light spacecraft will be used to do this, that such machines are used by ETs to visit Earth, and that at least one crashed and was recovered by the US government at Roswell, NM. It’s possible his claims are a well-intentioned hoax intended to promote interest in space science and exploration, but I think much more likely that he truly believes them.

 

I don’t believe that we are frequently visited by ETs, that FTL spacecraft requiring less power than the output of entire stars are possible, that telepathy is real and commonplace, that human consciousness is due to poorly-understood quantum non-local effects, or many of the other things that Ed Mitchell believes. I do believe that manned spaceflight to planets of others stars will occur sooner (before 2200, by my WAG).

 

Despite my many disagreement with Mitchell and others about ETs, UFOs, FTL spaceflight, and fundamental issues of evidence and truth, he and other astronauts remain among my personal heroes and role models.

 

Astronauts are some of the very few real heroes left in the world, I was just wondering why he would say this if he didn't have real knowledge it was true. Having read what you said I understand your point but he isn't the only astronaut to make the statement UFOs are real. A few even say they have seen them in orbit or on the way to the moon. I just feel some what jerked around on this issue, so much so I formed a theory that allowed for them to visit regularly over time and still not have star travel (FTL) Very confusing more so every day almost.

[Reaper]

Don't you think, though, that if aliens do visit Earth on a regular basis to contact a few humans, that evidence of such visits would be very obvious, even if governments try to cover it up? After all, I'm pretty certain that all of those hitchhiking microorganisms will be very happy to make a home right here on Earth, even if the intelligent ET's aren't.

[Turtle]

Don't you think, though, that if aliens do visit Earth on a regular basis to contact a few humans, that evidence of such visits would be very obvious, even if governments try to cover it up? After all, I'm pretty certain that all of those hitchhiking microorganisms will be very happy to make a home right here on Earth, even if the intelligent ET's aren't.

 

I think all the UFO sightings & stories cover yourobviousbet. As to the microbes, we take steps to insure no hitchikers on our probes so expecting the same from a more technologically advanced visitor isn't a stretch. The truth is out there! :hyper: :)

[Reaper]

I think all the UFO sightings & stories cover yourobviousbet. As to the microbes, we take steps to insure no hitchikers on our probes so expecting the same from a more technologically advanced visitor isn't a stretch. The truth is out there! :hyper: :)

 

 

I don't think so. Sterilizing would definitely work if they only sent robotic probes, but if the biological aliens decided to come themselves, bring microbes would be completely unavoidable for the sole reason that microbes are necessary for the survival of any complex life form, whether they are intelligent or not. And, it's really difficult (and completely uneconomical to say the least) to separate the bad ones from the good ones. In fact, it would be impossible for them to tell which ones would be good or bad for Earth's particular ecological system.

 

Most of the photos and videos and accounts of the alleged aliens are shown NOT to be wearing any environmental protection suits whatsoever. If those photos or videos were truly authentic and their abduction stories really happened (and hence they visit Earth on a regular basis), you should also expect to see pandemics racing throughout the globe by alien microorganisms.

[Turtle]

I don't think so. Sterilizing would definitely work if they only sent robotic probes, but if the biological aliens decided to come themselves, bring microbes would be completely unavoidable for the sole reason that microbes are necessary for the survival of any complex life form, whether they are intelligent or not. And, it's really difficult (and completely uneconomical to say the least) to separate the bad ones from the good ones. In fact, it would be impossible for them to tell which ones would be good or bad for Earth's particular ecological system.

 

Most of the photos and videos and accounts of the alleged aliens are shown NOT to be wearing any environmental protection suits whatsoever. If those photos or videos were truly authentic and their abduction stories really happened (and hence they visit Earth on a regular basis), you should also expect to see pandemics racing throughout the globe by alien microorganisms.

 

Presumes we know the level of scientific development of aliens, as well as understand their view of economics. If aliens have been visiting for a time, then they can learn what's bad & good same as we do. Maybe they have caused pandemics and we just don't know it. :)

 

There is no proving aliens haven't visited, that's a given. :hyper:

[Turtle]

Update: Mitchell is now qualifying his statements in the interview I posted. :)

 

LB: So the interview has been a little misquoted. But you actually have information about the Roswell incident?

 

EM: Yes and my information comes from what I call “the old timers,” because I grew up in the Roswell area and when I went to the moon, some of the old timers from that period, some locals, and others military and intelligence people, who were under rather severe oaths to not reveal any of this and kind of wanted to get their conscience clear and off their chests before they passed on, selected me and said, independently – this wasn't a group effort – independently that maybe I might be a safe person to tell their story to. And all of them confirmed, and what I'm saying is they confirmed the Roswell incident was a real incident and they in some way had some part in it that they wanted to talk about. ...

Dr. Edgar Mitchell Sets Record Straight

[Reaper]

Presumes we know the level of scientific development of aliens, as well as understand their view of economics.

 

The biological issue is not really a technical one. If they are capable of traveling across the stars, then surely they know that they need their microorganisms to survive. And that's the problem with claims of being visited, the fact that there is no physical evidence, biological or otherwise, whatsoever.

 

The only way that our hypothetical aliens will not leave any biological footprints is if they only send robotic probes, but even that is not a guarantee. Even our own space program has had a difficult time keeping bacteria from becoming stowaways, as is shown in this well documented case: Earth microbes on the Moon

 

And not only that, we are bringing more and more organisms into our space stations; it is only a matter of time before some of them escape out into the solar system.

 

If aliens have been visiting for a time, then they can learn what's bad & good same as we do. Maybe they have caused pandemics and we just don't know it. :)

 

Yes, but the only way to learn is to actually come to Earth first. And unless they use robots, they will inevitably leave some sort of biological and/or ecological footprint, especially if the claims of conspiracies and abductions are actually true (as they have been going on for the past 60+ years if they are to be believed).

 

And every recorded pandemic can be traced to terrestrial life, so it is very, very unlikely that they were caused by aliens.

 

 

There is no proving aliens haven't visited, that's a given. :hyper:

 

It's certainly not impossible that aliens could have visited Earth, it's just staggeringly unlikely. In the whole 4.5 billion years of Earth's existence, there isn't a single compelling piece of evidence that has been found that shows that alien life has come here, either to live or just visit. There is nothing in the fossil records that indicate that aliens have visited or colonized this planet, and nothing in our technological or societal history that indicates that aliens have visited.

 

Hell, even if the government was covering it up (which is HUGELY impractical to do BTW, if not impossible), we would most certainly see very obvious evidence; after all, some of the technology or science that they bring with them will certainly have been reversed engineered by our scientists after 60 or so years, for our own use. But alas, every single technological or scientific patent ever recorded or dug out has a known terrestrial origin.

[CraigD]

So Ed Mitchell is claiming that some “old timers” – presumably retired army and civilian staff who worked at Walker Air Force Base in Roswell, NM, prior to its conversion to a civilian airport and industrial park – told him words to the effect that “the Roswell incident was a real incident”. Note that, when asked “what did they tell you”, he doesn’t report anyone claiming to have actually seen a live or dead alien or piece of spacecraft wreckage, only that they know that such things were recovered, then hidden and knowledge of them covered up by the US government.

 

I’ve had people swear to me that they have actually been abducted, taken into space, and full-on all-orifice probed by ETs. Although I’m certain Mitchell’s sources are more credible than mine (that his reportedly don’t claim to have actually seen any evidence, only know of it, IMHO bolsters their credibility), there’s not, IMHO, a qualitative difference in our experiences, other than Mitchell appears to believe what his sources claim is true, while I believe that what my sources claim is not – although some of mine, I think, truly believe their accounts.

 

:) The lines Mitchell closes his “setting the record strait” interview with say it all, I think:

Well, I think the only thing that people should understand is that our star system has a finite lifetime and we've got to continue our space exploration. We only have a couple more billion years to be on the planet. We don't have to rush it but eventually we have to be off this planet if we want to survive as a species.

The only disagreement I have with this statement of Mitchell's on this one is his numbers: from what I’ve read, the expected 10% increase in the Sun’s luminosity over the next 1 billion years will likely result in the extinction of all surface life along with the vaporization of all surface water. Macrofauna like humans will likely become unsupportable hundreds of millions of years before this.

 

My hope is that humans will be independent of Earth’s ecosystem within centuries, not hundreds of millions of years, in no small part owing to the efforts of pioneers like Mitchell and thousands of less well known scientists and engineers. The question of whether the “Roswell incident was real” or not will, I suspect, be an obscure footnote in history long before then.