Aliens Poll

[Moontanman]

Moontan, can you describe some ''natural factors'' which have no causal

origin?

Do you know of any debris found on earth that has proved to be connected with extraterrestrial life or spaceships?

 

All natural factors have no causal origin, as for space ship debris, do you really think alien space craft fly around dropping pieces off at random? If you want to have a dog in this hunt I suggest you read the all the posts in this thread and then enter the discussion.

[modest]

Moontan, can you describe some ''natural factors'' which have no causal origin?

 

If there was no causal factor in the appearance of the universe, how did it happen? Are you saying it was not caused?

 

The topic here has nothing whatsoever to do with the "causal origin" of the universe. This is an official request, questor: stop hijacking this thread.

 

~modest

[Moontanman]

Some new UFO INFO:hihi:

 

NASA Spacecraft Operator Saw Alien Being

 

UFO Crash & Retrieval at Needles, California

[Moontanman]

UFO in Israeli jet gun camera video....

 

UFO in Gun Camera Footage?

[questor]

The common thread in the UFO stories is they usually occur near some type of government facility and the government immediately rushes in to cart away the evidence and cover up the incidence.

These stories have been around for hundreds of years, but no alien bodies have ever been found as as far as I know, no UFO mechanical parts or body parts have been exhibited. There are many UFO'S detectable in the skies, but has there ever been an actual spaceship part exhibited? or an actual alien body? The mechanics of a spaceship arriving here from a distant planet defie the laws of physics and the basic requirements of life as we know it.

[Moontanman]

The common thread in the UFO stories is they usually occur near some type of government facility and the government immediately rushes in to cart away the evidence and cover up the incidence.

 

That is one common thread and the idea of alien space craft falling from the sky is in my opinion mostly if not completely wishful thinking and simple BS.

 

These stories have been around for hundreds of years, but no alien bodies have ever been found as as far as I know, no UFO mechanical parts or body parts have been exhibited. There are many UFO'S detectable in the skies, but has there ever been an actual spaceship part exhibited? or an actual alien body?

 

Again I'll say the idea of technology advanced enough to travel across interplanetary distances routinely much less interstellar distances being so unreliable that pieces fall off with any regularity or that the vehicles fall from the sky every few years is silly and just shows how crazy the whole UFO thing really is. It also shows how desperate the debunker's are to show the obtuse side of UFOs. There really are sightings with inexplicable evidence, lots of widely separated witnesses that could send you to the death chamber with less evidence but debunker's have no interest in these sightings they want to concentrate of lights in the sky they can write off with equally stupid explanations like "it was probably a comet" to expect aliens bodies or pieces of space craft is silly and should not be part of real discourse on the subject.

 

The mechanics of a spaceship arriving here from a distant planet defie the laws of physics and the basic requirements of life as we know it.

 

Not true questor, there is no law of physics or life that negates the possibility of interstellar travel.

[questor]

So you are willing to believe there are spacecraft that never have accidental

crashes, and are piloted by some type of alien life from some planet outside our solar system who have come to this low-tech planet to achieve.. What?

The fact that most of the Roswell flap has been disproved, and no bodies are available, and no UFO'S are ever seen on the ground and we know there is an abundance of space debris in our atmosphere doesn't affect your belief? Why don't you do the math to find out how many miles a spaceship would have to travel assuming it came from outside our solar system?

[Moontanman]

So you are willing to believe there are spacecraft that never have accidental

crashes, and are piloted by some type of alien life from some planet outside our solar system who have come to this low-tech planet to achieve.. What?

 

I'm glad you asked, first you have to remember that not every light in the sky is an alien space craft. If indeed alien space craft were visiting us thousands of times a year then eventually the laws of chance would say yes, alien space craft must have crashed at some point. But I contend that for every real sighting there are probably in the range of ten thousand or more false or mistaken identity sightings. Looking at from the stand point it would surprising if an alien space craft crashed on the earth. I am sure that star faring aliens built ships that are for too reliable to expect them to crash on a regular basis. If our Commercial jets only flew once a year instead of thousands of times a day how many crashes would you expect to see per year? Another thing is why would aliens leave the cracked up space craft and the bodies of their buddies for us to study? Wouldn't they take away the craft and it's pilots the same we go in and salvage a crashed military jet? Expecting to see crashed saucers on anything but an extraordinary basis is really naive.

 

 

 

The fact that most of the Roswell flap has been disproved, and no bodies are available, and no UFO'S are ever seen on the ground and we know there is an abundance of space debris in our atmosphere doesn't affect your belief?

 

No why should it? Roswell was BS almost certinly but one BS case doesn't make all cases BS as for space debris, i don't see your point, are you saying that alien space craft parts should be raining down on us?

 

Why don't you do the math to find out how many miles a spaceship would have to travel assuming it came from outside our solar system?

 

Yes I do the math, see this thread,

 

http://hypography.com/forums/space/14616-new-idea-about-ufo-s.html

[questor]

The math you posted was 400 years to get here? How would life survive on this trip? How much food would be needed? How much fuel? If you read the reports, there may be many such spaceships, but we never can seem to get hold of one, or even a piece of one, or a body, or a bone. Seeing a UFO is easy to believe, but seeing a craft flown by intelligent life has never been proved, even though the sightings may number in the hundreds.

[Moontanman]

The math you posted was 400 years to get here? How would life survive on this trip? How much food would be needed? How much fuel?

 

Do you not read an entire article when you are shown a place to go to get information? all of those things is explained in detail there. 400 years is a completely reasonable travel time, as I said the entire galaxy could be colonised in 250,000 years at that rate.

 

 

If you read the reports, there may be many such spaceships, but we never can seem to get hold of one, or even a piece of one, or a body, or a bone.

 

Again "may be" is the jet part of that sentence, do primitive tribes in South American get hold of advanced human space craft just because they orbit over head every once in a while? You seem to be hung up on the idea of UFO crashes. Personally I have never seen anything that would suggest this to be true.

 

 

Seeing a UFO is easy to believe, but seeing a craft flown by intelligent life has never been proved, even though the sightings may number in the hundreds.

 

If it had been proved then there would no controversy nor would there be any discussion of "are they real" Yes sightings number in the hundreds of thousands but not every sighting is an alien space craft. You seem to think that if one is real they all must be real, there are a very few that totally defy explanation even though they have multiple witnesses, radar, and military personnel, even military personal that are carrying nuclear weapons. These few contain evidence so sure that if it was a capital murder case you could be executed by this evidence. Many sightings could indeed be real but a glimpse of something inexplicable in the sky does not an alien space craft make.

[Turtle]

So you are willing to believe there are spacecraft that never have accidental crashes, and are piloted by some type of alien life from some planet outside our solar system who have come to this low-tech planet to achieve.. What?

The fact that most of the Roswell flap has been disproved, and no bodies are available, and no UFO'S are ever seen on the ground and we know there is an abundance of space debris in our atmosphere doesn't affect your belief? Why don't you do the math to find out how many miles a spaceship would have to travel assuming it came from outside our solar system?

 

What part of the Roswell flap isn't disproved/explained exactly? And what do you, a presumably intelligent lifeform, come here to achieve? The same as everyone else? Different reasons? As to crashes, have you heard if they found Stevo Fosset yet? No? Mathematically speaking, since we know where he could've gone down, we have a better chance of finding him, but instead they found crashes from decades ago. Bodies not available? :doh: Why not just ask for some of that extra anthrax that government lab guy didn't use? Many UFO's are reported on the ground; called close contacts of the 2nd kind. Google it. :hihi: I find your arguments weak and I fail to see why you care. ;)

[questor]

If you want to believe in something for which there is no HARD evidence, be my guest. All there is to go on is second hand observations of objects which

may have a natural explanation. If you have a link to some HARD evidence

of an interplanetary spaceship or an extraterrestrial pilot, please post it.

If there are visitors from outer space, what do you think we should do about it?

[DougF]

I just found this thread and have not read through it yet.

but I voted.

 

"There's intelligent life in the universe and they've visited."

 

 

I believe life; yes intelligent life in the universe is very plausible even if the chance of life could happen only once out of all of the stars we know of, then I say yes it could happen.

 

Question:

How many stars are there in the universe?

------------------------------------------------

Answer:

There are about 10 billion (10^10) stars in an average galaxy,

And there are about 10 billion galaxies that we can observe in the universe,

So the answer is 100 billion billion or 10^20.

 

 

 

And if they are smart enough to have visited us, and then they are smart enough to know that we are a dangerous life form and they should stay away.

 

 

Originally Posted by Pyrotex

Re: Quality Jokes and Humor' date=' post 611

You just have to read this:

 

[b']MEAT[/b]

 

http://http://www.terrybisson.com/meat.html

[Moontanman]

If you want to believe in something for which there is no HARD evidence, be my guest. All there is to go on is second hand observations of objects which

may have a natural explanation. If you have a link to some HARD evidence

of an interplanetary spaceship or an extraterrestrial pilot, please post it.

If there are visitors from outer space, what do you think we should do about it?

 

Questor, I am a skeptic, I don't "believe" I require data, I just believe that there are sightings that should inspire further investigation, I don't know what UFOs are, they may be due to some odd neuron activity in the human brain that causes humans to see things of supernatural origin like angels and gods.

 

Or it could be some sort of natural phenomenon that is interpreted as aliens. It could be time travelers or some sort of inter dimensional travel from another reality. These last two could explain some of the really weird things about UFOs.

 

There are reasonable scenarios that allow them to be aliens from other stars. One thing is for sure, something interesting other than hoaxes and misidentified could be going on.

 

The subject needs to be studied with all the data available in a scientific way. Until now you have two groups, true believers that will point to any light in the sky and scream UFO! And the debunker's that could be hit in the head by an alien space craft and still scream comet or swamp gas.

 

Both sides are considerably less than scientific when it comes to UFOs, believers say anything is evidence of Aliens from a glimpse of something unknown to someone in the middle of New York city being abducted from their bedrooms and probed.

 

Debunker's never allow themselves to have to deal with really good quality inexplicable cases and dwell on the cases that are either obviously not UFOs or cases that simply do not have enough evidence to make any kind of decision at all. To understand this phenomenon we must endeavor to stay in the middle ground.

 

Questor I am going to assume you are not trying to be intentionally insulting but when you start accusing me of believing something that i have plainly stated over and requires data and study show me either you do not read any more of a post than it takes to set you off or that you are just trying to be obtuse.

 

Please read my posts and then come back with reasonable intelligent ideas not accusations and recriminations about something you obviously haven't researched beyond what the powers that be have told you.

 

As for what we should do if they turn out to be aliens? first it depends on what their intentions really are. If they are just studying us they was we might study come primitive tribe deep in the amazon jungle then they will probably not allow us the chance to do anything.

 

If they are indeed advanced enough to make routine visits just out of idle curiosity I would say we can't do anything about them. maybe we should endeavor to try and contact them but it all depends on them.

 

If UFOs are aliens and they have in some way colonized our solar system and are studying us from nearby eventually both of us will have to come to some sort of agreement and that will require contact. Again with their technology it will depend on them. I doubt very seriously we can force anything on them.

 

If UFOs are alien space craft and we can contact and negotiate with them much stands to be gained but to say we should do something about them implies we have to ability to do something about them and that is unlikely.

 

If UFOs turn out to be something else we will still have the knowledge we gain from knowing what they are, The human brain is complex and finding out why people need so badly to see UFOs, angles, demons, trolls, gods and other illusions will also help us in our quest to be free from the darkness of ignorance.

[questor]

I would think that any time a UFO is sighted, a great deal of inquiry ensues.

All of these sightings as of now are in the ''we don't know'' category. Given the vast number of planets and moons in the universe, I would say anything is possible, but the facts are that there is no HARD proof of space ships or extraterrestrial beings. If it eventually occurs that there are ET's, we better hope that they are friendly..What about the SETI project?

SETI Institute

 

Wouldn't you think if there are ET's visiting earth, they would pick up on our signals or broadcast their own?

[Moontanman]

I would think that any time a UFO is sighted, a great deal of inquiry ensues.

 

You could think it but you would be wrong, there a couple of private UFO investigator organizations and they are very limited but nothing else.

 

All of these sightings as of now are in the ''we don't know'' category.

 

Yes that is true but no further investgation is being done on new sightings or on the old.

 

Given the vast number of planets and moons in the universe, I would say anything is possible, but the facts are that there is no HARD proof of space ships or extraterrestrial beings. If it eventually occurs that there are ET's, we better hope that they are friendly..What about the SETI project?

 

SETI doesn't have anything to do with UFOs and as I have said before hard proof is highly unlikely. About as likely that a primitive tribe in the amazon would find a crashed F-22 Raptor, it's possible but not likely.

 

 

SETI Institute

 

 

 

Wouldn't you think if there are ET's visiting earth, they would pick up on our signals or broadcast their own?

 

It's very possible they could hide their communications from us if they wanted to, laser pulse communication would be the easiest way to do this and lasers are better than radio waves. I'm sure they can pick up our signals and if we picked up theirs it would be unlikely we would necessarily recognize them as alien. Only signals originating far from the Earth would be suspect and very few receivers could tell this anyway.

[Turtle]

You could think it but you would be wrong, there a couple of private UFO investigator organizations and they are very limited but nothing else.

 

Yes that is true but no further investgation is being done on new sightings or on the old.

 

On the investigators, have you looked at any of Linda Howe's work MoonTer?

 

>> Earthfiles.com Headline News

 

She covers all the usual 'out there' stuff, but she did go down and do interviews in Texas after that Stevensville flap a few months ago and publish reports on her page.

 

If you want to believe in something for which there is no HARD evidence, be my guest. All there is to go on is second hand observations of objects which may have a natural explanation. If you have a link to some HARD evidence of an interplanetary spaceship or an extraterrestrial pilot, please post it.

If there are visitors from outer space, what do you think we should do about it?

 

All you have to go on for a black hole are second hand observations which may have another natural explanation. :confused: The philosophical debates aside, everything has a natural explanation. If there are visitors from outer space we ought to investigate those natural phenomena. If some UFO's are electrical effects, we ought to do likewise, and if it's optical, the same, and yada yada yada human curiosity, exploration, and application of the scientific method to who-laid-the-chunk. :naughty: