If You Ever Remember A Dream

[labelwench]

That must be a rather disconcerting dream to have repeating, Deepwater6. :mellow:

[CraigD]

Apologies, everyone, for a long post in reply to several – discussing dreams and dreaming tends to make me long-winded.

 

I had a lucid dream in my early teens where I decided to test if I actually was in a dream by diving off a 10 foot cliff in a quarry. I figured if I was not in a dream I would just be winded ...

Man! You Aussies must be (or at least believe your are) way tougher than us Americans – were I, in waking life, to take a 10 foot dive (I’m assuming you went for the belly-flop position, rather than headfirst) at hard ground, I fear I’d come away worse than just winded. ;)

 

You account is interesting to me, because for the past few years, my “standard ‘am I dreaming’” check is to attempt to fly, floating with my feet perhaps just a few centimeters above the ground for a few seconds. I seem to always be able to experience this when dreaming, never when awake (if I could, I’d surely have the JREF $1,000,000 and many talent show prizes long in hand :)).

 

The only drawback to this is that, according to my wife, most or all times that I fly in my dreams, I slightly or strongly kick my feet in the waking world, as if swimming. I find this interesting, because in my dreams, I perceive myself flying just by willing myself up and in the direction I want to go, without any arm or leg movements.

 

When I fly fast in my dreams (which I’m not always able to do, often being able to go no faster than a walking pace), my wife reports that I “flop like a fish out of water”. Needless to say, she’s not fond of this.

 

Though the “try flying” check is my standard one, my favorite one involves talking to the people in my dreams. With only rare exceptions, if ask one of them “who are you?”, she or he will reply “I’m you”, or words to that effect. I’ve had some long, wonderful dream “conversations” following this opening exchange.

 

I had the following dream that ended the flying series, in the middle of a nights sleep around 20 years ago, that was extremely vivid and appeared to go on for a long time. It has several parts and I have not had another dream remotely like it since then.

 

Every other time I started this type of dream I was confronted with an upper height limit that was defined by the web of street power/phone cables on poles and large buildings. This time I passed very close to a cable and actually felt something brush by (opposite to my test where I felt nothing) so I made a subconscious determination in the dream to avoid any obstacles and see how far I could go.

My dream experience is similar. Often, I can’t fly much higher than nearby power/phone poles, trees, or buildings, and even have to dodge, climb, and scramble to avoid getting snagged in them. Another recurring theme in my dreams is flying inside a building, looking for a window to open or break to get out.

 

Also, as I mentioned previously, I often can’t fly very fast horizontally. This can be troubling, as often when I fly in my dreams, it’s to escape something or somebodies on the ground. Unable to fly fast, the something/somebodies often just follow me around. This performance limitation often affects not only unaided dream flying, but riding in planes and ground vehicles. Cars and planes often prove useless in my dreams, able to move little or no faster than I can without them.

 

About 21 years ago, I had a flying dream dramatically unlike any I’d had before, in which I was able to fly very fast. At first, with a feeling of near ecstasy, I flew around my neighborhood at bird and aircraft-like speeds, swooping effortlessly and fearlessly above and below trees limbs and power lines, then greater distances, my view of the scenery blurring with speed as I flew over ground in which I wasn’t interested, covering tens of kilometers in a few seconds, slowing with no sense of acceleration to bird-like speed when I arrived where I wanted to go. Finally, I cross the entire North American continent in similar fashion, from my near-Atlantic coast origin to Pacific coast places familiar to me in perhaps 10 seconds (that’s about Mach 1500, a waking-world physical impossibility), with no uncomfortable feelings. Though I sensed I could go as high as I might want as easily, I never exceeded typical light airplane altitudes of a few kilometers.

 

Despite frequent attempts, I’ve never since been able to re-experience this easy, physically absurd flying, but by recalling the memory of it, I can usually, fly at plane-like speeds and altitudes whenever in my dreams I want.

 

Frequent triggers that turned a dream into a Lucid Dream are:

...

“It’s *another* 500 ft wave? Don’t worry, it’s only a dream.”

I think we can draw a distinction between “dream checks” like my flying and Laurie’s cliff-diving, and “triggers” like you’re describing, Vexer, in that the dreamer must actively try a check, while a trigger can be passively noticed.

 

My most common triggers are noticing that the paths of throw objects – a ball, for example – are wrong, typically flat like a Frisbee rather than the correct parabolic path. When I see a softball float past like a gigantic bumblebee, I immediately think “oh, this is a dream.”

 

When a dream gets too nasty or repetitive, I can consciously, within the dream, decide to wake up. Sometimes this is a much self-debated decision. I mentally debate the merits of the dream. I know I’m dreaming, I know I can wake up if I want to. The ‘shock’ of waking up is very unpleasant. It’s a nasty whole-body (feeling) shock. This is a factor in deciding whether or not to wake up.

 

“I can keep fighting off the giant bees (or whatever), OR wake up (which is like being slapped in the face). Which is more hurtful?”

Here’s a technique you might be able to teach yourself, and find a better alternative to your present ones.

 

Though I can rarely do it now, from about 1975 to 1995 (I was born in 1960), I was able to reliably use a visualization trick while dreaming where I “wrapped” the dream in a bubble, withdrew from it, then, If I wanted, reentered it. Or move to another bubble and enter it, to enter a different dream.

 

As best I’ve been able to determine, I learned this trick from reading descriptions of something like it “swords and sorcery” fantasy novels. I recall seeing a wall poster based on such fictional magic, which I think helped me form a strong enough image of it that I was able to incorporate it into my dreaming.

 

If you’ve read this far, I only say the above is all real, intriguing. I’d like to know how normal it is.

From lucid dreaming literature and casual conversations, I’ve concluded that frequent lucid dreaming normal, but unusual. A common, imprecise statistic from the literature is that about 50% of people report never having a single lucid dream, while about 20% of people report often or always having them. This agrees with my informal experience.

 

It’s widely believed that lucid dreaming can be taught. Recently (ca 2005), psychotherapist have taught it to patients to treat disorders involving frequent severe nightmares. My experience, however, is that most people who often dream lucidly recall doing so from an early age, often as long as they can remember (which is typically from around the age of 5 years). My personal experience is of vaguely remembering a time, at around 5 years old, that I first became aware of when I was dreaming, and having been able to tell in most, but not all, of my dreams ever since.

 

Early in our relationship, my wife, a now-retired psychotherapist, recommended that I intentionally avoid attempting to always dream lucidly, her reasoning being that it reinforced an unhealthy need to always feel in control of my life. Accepting this advice, I found, and continue to find, that not only do I not always dream lucidly, but that choosing to “forget” my awareness that I’m dreaming during a dream can result in more pleasant and uplifting dreams.

[belovelife]

You account is interesting to me, because for the past few years, my “standard ‘am I dreaming’” check is to attempt to fly, floating with my feet perhaps just a few centimeters above the ground for a few seconds. I seem to always be able to experience this when dreaming, never when awake (if I could, I’d surely have the JREF $1,000,000 and many talent show prizes long in hand :)).

 

The only drawback to this is that, according to my wife, most or all times that I fly in my dreams, I slightly or strongly kick my feet in the waking world, as if swimming. I find this interesting, because in my dreams, I perceive myself flying just by willing myself up and in the direction I want to go, without any arm or leg movements.

 

When I fly fast in my dreams (which I’m not always able to do, often being able to go no faster than a walking pace), my wife reports that I “flop like a fish out of water”. Needless to say, she’s not fond of this.

 

Though the “try flying” check is my standard one, my favorite one involves talking to the people in my dreams. With only rare exceptions, if ask one of them “who are you?”, she or he will reply “I’m you”, or words to that effect. I’ve had some long, wonderful dream “conversations” following this opening exchange.

 

 

My dream experience is similar. Often, I can’t fly much higher than nearby power/phone poles, trees, or buildings, and even have to dodge, climb, and scramble to avoid getting snagged in them. Another recurring theme in my dreams is flying inside a building, looking for a window to open or break to get out.

 

Also, as I mentioned previously, I often can’t fly very fast horizontally. This can be troubling, as often when I fly in my dreams, it’s to escape something or somebodies on the ground. Unable to fly fast, the something/somebodies often just follow me around. This performance limitation often affects not only unaided dream flying, but riding in planes and ground vehicles. Cars and planes often prove useless in my dreams, able to move little or no faster than I can without them.

 

About 21 years ago, I had a flying dream dramatically unlike any I’d had before, in which I was able to fly very fast. At first, with a feeling of near ecstasy, I flew around my neighborhood at bird and aircraft-like speeds, swooping effortlessly and fearlessly above and below trees limbs and power lines, then greater distances, my view of the scenery blurring with speed as I flew over ground in which I wasn’t interested, covering tens of kilometers in a few seconds, slowing with no sense of acceleration to bird-like speed when I arrived where I wanted to go. Finally, I cross the entire North American continent in similar fashion, from my near-Atlantic coast origin to Pacific coast places familiar to me in perhaps 10 seconds (that’s about Mach 1500, a waking-world physical impossibility), with no uncomfortable feelings. Though I sensed I could go as high as I might want as easily, I never exceeded typical light airplane altitudes of a few kilometers.

 

Despite frequent attempts, I’ve never since been able to re-experience this easy, physically absurd flying, but by recalling the memory of it, I can usually, fly at plane-like speeds and altitudes whenever in my dreams I want.

 

 

I think we can draw a distinction between “dream checks” like my flying and Laurie’s cliff-diving, and “triggers” like you’re describing, Vexer, in that the dreamer must actively try a check, while a trigger can be passively noticed.

 

My most common triggers are noticing that the paths of throw objects – a ball, for example – are wrong, typically flat like a Frisbee rather than the correct parabolic path. When I see a softball float past like a gigantic bumblebee, I immediately think “oh, this is a dream.”

 

 

Here’s a technique you might be able to teach yourself, and find a better alternative to your present ones.

 

Though I can rarely do it now, from about 1975 to 1995 (I was born in 1960), I was able to reliably use a visualization trick while dreaming where I “wrapped” the dream in a bubble, withdrew from it, then, If I wanted, reentered it. Or move to another bubble and enter it, to enter a different dream.

 

As best I’ve been able to determine, I learned this trick from reading descriptions of something like it “swords and sorcery” fantasy novels. I recall seeing a wall poster based on such fictional magic, which I think helped me form a strong enough image of it that I was able to incorporate it into my dreaming.

 

 

From lucid dreaming literature and casual conversations, I’ve concluded that frequent lucid dreaming normal, but unusual. A common, imprecise statistic from the literature is that about 50% of people report never having a single lucid dream, while about 20% of people report often or always having them. This agrees with my informal experience.

 

It’s widely believed that lucid dreaming can be taught. Recently (ca 2005), psychotherapist have taught it to patients to treat disorders involving frequent severe nightmares. My experience, however, is that most people who often dream lucidly recall doing so from an early age, often as long as they can remember (which is typically from around the age of 5 years). My personal experience is of vaguely remembering a time, at around 5 years old, that I first became aware of when I was dreaming, and having been able to tell in most, but not all, of my dreams ever since.

 

Early in our relationship, my wife, a now-retired psychotherapist, recommended that I intentionally avoid attempting to always dream lucidly, her reasoning being that it reinforced an unhealthy need to always feel in control of my life. Accepting this advice, I found, and continue to find, that not only do I not always dream lucidly, but that choosing to “forget” my awareness that I’m dreaming during a dream can result in more pleasant and uplifting dreams.

 

 

 

 

wow my flying is similar, eccept i usually teach people how to fly, i can do it at will

 

and all that , very similar experience

Edited July 6, 2012 by belovelife

[LaurieAG]

Some good insights there CraigD.

 

The dreams that I tend to remember are the ones where something happens that either surprises or shocks me and its almost as if that shock or surprise triggered something like a short term memory that allowed me to remember the dream and/or allowed it to become lucid.

 

Also, us aussies aren't that tough, the cliff was actually in a clay quarry or claypan (there were a few around where I grew up). :)

[Rade]

The last dream that I can recall (a few weeks ago) I ended while still in the dream state. This demonstrates that my consciousness ("I") has an identity.

[belovelife]

had a dream last night i was waiting to meet obama and the chinese president

 

then all of a sudden a virus hit the beach where i was

 

i ran away from it so fast

even when i got to where everyone said it was safe

 

i was still scared and running

 

worst dream i've had in a while,

 

and it started off soo coool

[Vexer]

CraigD,

 

 

I’ve never discussed dreams Online before, but your mention of Lucid dreaming drew me in.

 

Thanks for the intelligent reply.

 

 

You wrote:

>>I think we can draw a distinction between “dream checks” like my flying and Laurie’s cliff-diving, and “triggers” like you’re describing, Vexer, in that the dreamer must actively try a check, while a trigger can be passively noticed.<<

 

Just for information, I can’t of think *any* passively noticed things that alert me to lucid dreaming. They’re all “Wait a sec, isn’t this a bit of a cliché/repeated theme?”

 

 

 

>>>My most common triggers are noticing that the paths of throw objects – a ball, for example – are wrong, typically flat like a Frisbee rather than the correct parabolic path. When I see a softball float past like a gigantic bumblebee, I immediately think “oh, this is a dream.”<<

 

It is interesting to read other’s experiences. (In this case)

 

 

 

>>A common, imprecise statistic from the literature is that about 50% of people report never having a single lucid dream, while about 20% of people report often or always having them.<<

 

For what it’s worth, in my case there is a definite correlation between the *quality* of sleep and the level of lucid dreaming. The lucid dreaming occurs in ‘second half’ of nightly sleep. In cases of bad, or short, sleep there is no lucid dreaming. (Just the other kind).

 

So I'm saying that long (at the tail end of the good) good sleep is more likely to be lucid.

[labelwench]

For quite a number of years I have had no lucid dreams or even any sense of recall that I had been dreaming at all. This roughly coincides with the time that I started working graveyard shift and completely changing my awake/active/sleep patterns. My current pattern of activity is that I work graveyards three nights of the week and office work on two mornings, one of which (today) occurs on my return to graveyards. My week is therefore completely divided in that I spend half of it on a regular 'day' schedule and the other half as a 'night stalker'. :P (Graveyard shift humor, lol...)

 

I have been on this divided schedule for three years come September (doing graveyards for seven years, previously full-time nights) and have decided that I have been running a sleep deficit for some considerable time and have been actively working to change this fact. This is not easy when you live in the land of the midnight sun as even in a completely blacked out bedroom, one's body and brain is aware that it is a nice day outside and we'd rather be doing something in the open air.

 

My point in sharing this is simply to observe that I am now starting to become aware of dreaming once again when I manage to get more than 5 hours sleep. I awoke last night chuckling about a whacky dream I was having that seemed to include a still-born foal, a human male off-spring sprung from the same womb (horse and human 'twins') a couple of greenhouses that I was tending with some remarkable plants and one that was growing 'mandelbrot' but looked like human body parts (ears?). The human offspring had a birthmark that was of great interest to a religious leader (the Pope?) and he forgave us for burying the remains of the stillborn foal.

 

I think I read too much on forums. :D

[Deepwater6]

I sometimes have dreams about events that are set to, or already have been happening. Such as a wedding, a funeral, or a car accident, etc. of course the players and the conditions are different. My mind has a way of twisting these events. Years ago I was involved in a car accident. No one was hurt, but it demolished the back of my pick-up truck. I was stopped at a light and the gentlemen was wasn't paying attention and just plowwed into the back of me. Everyone from the police to the other driver and his insurance company agreed it was all his fault. His insurance paid right away it was over, done, forgotten.

 

A month or so after that I had a dream about it, in the dream all the players were the same, but everyone insisted that the accident was my fault. I spent the whole dream arguing that it can't possible be my fault but no one would listen to me.

 

I spent some time trying to analyze that dream. At first I thought it was my mind telling me you shouldn't have been there at that spot to begin with. I didn't have anything weighing on my conscious though, I wasn't going to commit any crime. I don't cheat on my wife and I wasn't going anywhere to buy drugs or anything of the sort. I was on my way home from work. So why did my mind twist the results of that accident in the dream against me? Did my mind feel subconsiously that someone in that event was less than honest with me? Did my mind pick up something about someone being less than sincere with me at the accident? My mind could have spun it alot of different ways, but why did it choose that way?

 

Under the Rose, I feel for you. I worked swing shift for a few years. 1 week day turn, next week 4-12, the next midnight shift. Round and round your body never gets adjusted. I was a zombie for most of the time. Shift work and lack of sleep can take a real toll on your body as you know. I hope you can find something with more reasonable hours. It didn't just affect me either. When I came home from working all night I also darkend the room completley, but my wife had to make sure our young children weren't yelling and screaming like children do as they play sometimes. I don't know how many times I heard one of my children excited outside voice followed by my wifes shhhhy your dad is trying to sleep. It one of the happiest days of my life when I got off shift work and my sleep habits returned to normal.