The Prison System

[belovelife]

i don't think is about fault neccesarily

 

unless you blame parents, slavery, war, etc.

 

some traits are passed throught generations, just as a way of life

 

now as far as responsibility, i think it is everyone's responsibility

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaWOC5IXNxc

 

 

 

since in life, we are in a constant state of stimulation, and resulting constant conditioning

 

then, as we learn to be more proactive in positive change, the more positive change occurs

 

( see the past )

 

but all it takes is someone to start the negative again

 

like one bad apple spoils the whole bunch sort of mentality

 

social awkwardness, leads to estrangement,

 

jealousy, leads to trying to get what someone else has

 

etc.

[Guest MacPhee]

as to prison prohibitng reproduction, it is a ridiculous thought. it ignores that someone may have children before incarceration, as well as ongoing sex after incarceration whether authorized or nay. therefore, we should sterilize inmates and euthanize their children. that'll fix things. :rolleyes:

 

I don't think the idea of prisons prohibiting reproduction is ridiculous. Rather, I think that's why we thought up prisons

in the first place.

 

Didn't our thoughts go like this: A person has committed a crime. By committing this crime, the person has shown he has bad anti-social genes. We don't want these genes in our society. Therefore we should just execute the person. That will rid us of the bad genes once and for all.

 

However, executing him seems very drastic, and perhaps unfair. After all, he can't be blamed for the bad genes he was born with - it's not his fault he was born that way. On the other hand, if we let him remain at large, he'll propagate his bad genes by fathering children.

 

Therefore, the humane solution is this - don't execute him, just lock him up in prison. In there, he won't be able to get at any women. So he won't father any children. And when he dies, his bad genes will die with him.

 

Surely that must be the underlying, instinctive, rationale for the whole prison concept. What sense does it make otherwise?

[Lancewen]

I don't think the idea of prisons prohibiting reproduction is ridiculous. Rather, I think that's why we thought up prisons

in the first place.

 

Didn't our thoughts go like this: A person has committed a crime. By committing this crime, the person has shown he has bad anti-social genes. We don't want these genes in our society. Therefore we should just execute the person. That will rid us of the bad genes once and for all.

 

However, executing him seems very drastic, and perhaps unfair. After all, he can't be blamed for the bad genes he was born with - it's not his fault he was born that way. On the other hand, if we let him remain at large, he'll propagate his bad genes by fathering children.

 

Therefore, the humane solution is this - don't execute him, just lock him up in prison. In there, he won't be able to get at any women. So he won't father any children. And when he dies, his bad genes will die with him.

 

Surely that must be the underlying, instinctive, rationale for the whole prison concept. What sense does it make otherwise?

 

I did some searching and couldn't find any support for your comment. But I did find the following.

 

purposes of prisons

Prisons have four major purposes. These purposes are retribution, incapacitation, deterrence and rehabilitation. Retribution means punishment for crimes against society. Depriving criminals of their freedom is a way of making them pay a debt to society for their crimes. Incapacitation refers to the removal of criminals from society so that they can no longer harm innocent people. Deterrence means the prevention of future crime. It is hoped that prisons provide warnings to people thinking about committing crimes, and that the possibility of going to prison will discourage people from breaking the law. Rehabilitation refers to activities designed to change criminals into law abiding citizens, and may include providing educational courses in prison, teaching job skills and offering counseling with a psychologist or social worker. The four major purposes of prisons have not been stressed equally through the years. As a result, prisons differ in the makeup of their staffs, the design of their buildings and their operations.

 

http://www.stoptheaca.org/purpose.html

[Turtle]

I don't think the idea of prisons prohibiting reproduction is ridiculous. Rather, I think that's why we thought up prisons

in the first place.

 

Didn't our thoughts go like this: A person has committed a crime. By committing this crime, the person has shown he has bad anti-social genes. We don't want these genes in our society. Therefore we should just execute the person. That will rid us of the bad genes once and for all.

 

However, executing him seems very drastic, and perhaps unfair. After all, he can't be blamed for the bad genes he was born with - it's not his fault he was born that way. On the other hand, if we let him remain at large, he'll propagate his bad genes by fathering children.

 

Therefore, the humane solution is this - don't execute him, just lock him up in prison. In there, he won't be able to get at any women. So he won't father any children. And when he dies, his bad genes will die with him.

 

Surely that must be the underlying, instinctive, rationale for the whole prison concept. What sense does it make otherwise?

 

no macphee; it is not the genes. i see you ignored my reference and obviously you have made no effort to do some actual research on your own. you just spout your narrow-minded tripe and evidence be damned. pathetic.

[Guest MacPhee]

no macphee; it is not the genes. i see you ignored my reference and obviously you have made no effort to do some actual research on your own. you just spout your narrow-minded tripe and evidence be damned. pathetic.

 

Turtle, you're right that I didn't follow up your reference. Or do any actual research on genetic inheritance, the nature/nurture debate - or how the prison system is supposed to operate today. Because that doesn't interest me.

 

What I find interesting is this - how did our ancestors originally come up with the idea of putting a criminal in prison?

 

I still think it must have been - because they wanted to isolate him reproductively, and so stop him passing his criminal tendencies on to offspring.

 

Please bear in mind, that I'm not claiming that our ancestors were right. Or had any understanding of genetics. Heck, even Darwin didn't know about genes. Wasn't Darwin a kind of quasi-Lamarckian - with misguided concepts that raise the eyebrows of any modern biologist.

 

I'm only trying to understand why our ancestors thought prison was a good idea - if that's not germane to the thread, I apologise, and will refrain from spouting any further such "tripe".

[Turtle]

Turtle, you're right that I didn't follow up your reference. Or do any actual research on genetic inheritance, the nature/nurture debate - or how the prison system is supposed to operate today. Because that doesn't interest me.

 

What I find interesting is this - how did our ancestors originally come up with the idea of putting a criminal in prison?

 

I still think it must have been - because they wanted to isolate him reproductively, and so stop him passing his criminal tendencies on to offspring.

 

Please bear in mind, that I'm not claiming that our ancestors were right. Or had any understanding of genetics. Heck, even Darwin didn't know about genes. Wasn't Darwin a kind of quasi-Lamarckian - with misguided concepts that raise the eyebrows of any modern biologist.

 

I'm only trying to understand why our ancestors thought prison was a good idea - if that's not germane to the thread, I apologise, and will refrain from spouting any further such "tripe".

 

since there is no way to know what our ancestors were thinking, your question is vacuous. your lack of further posting in this thread will not be missed.

[Guest MacPhee]

since there is no way to know what our ancestors were thinking, your question is vacuous. your lack of further posting in this thread will not be missed.

 

I admire your "Logical Positivist" approach to such questions. Ok, Ok, I'm gone already.....

[Turtle]

I admire your "Logical Positivist" approach to such questions. Ok, Ok, I'm gone already.....

 

good answer. :thumbs_up to put a fine point on the genetic business, there is also the matter of folks who commit "crimes" (never minding that this is so broad and ill-defined a word as used here that it is virtually meaningless.) but have no criminal history in their family tree. wrong is, as wrong does.

 

"first in cities searching for what it is; then thusly we could examine also in some individual, examining the likeness of the bigger in the idea of the littler." ~ socrates

[belovelife]

in this article the county i live in is going to be on the discovery channel

 

i hope the discovery channel has a nuetral perspective, wheighing the pros and cons

 

something like dui statisics vs other counties

 

or something

 

it is an artist community

 

i just hope that it doesn't get a bad rep

 

there are some good things going one here