Problem Of Length Contraction At Cern Due To Special Theory Of Relativity.

[Vmedvil]

you know what woman you are starting to annoy me, if you want to know read, this beginning to end.

 

Third

 

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/111607-wormhole-metric-how-is-this-screwed-up/

 

 

This First

 

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/bell-spaceship-paradox-qualitatively.829181/

 

Second

 

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/do-we-move-in-the-universe-or-is-everything-stationary.828562/#post-5209882

Edited December 20, 2017 by Vmedvil

[maheshkhati]

Sorry, I think you are misunderstanding Special theory of relativity.

For example:- If you are measuring some distance dx' in S frame then it is dx'=dx/Y in S' frame. This is not physically shrinking of any object but finding of that distance in other inertial frame to be reduce.

So, distance between two particle get reduce dx'=dx/Y has nothing to do with shirking of space.

This is two different measurement done in two different frames.

We are seeing just same space in two different ways only & measuring differently.

This is not wrapping of space or anything else.

This is just two observation in two different frames. In some frame, I call it as 1 m & in other frame, I call it as 1/Y m.

Edited December 20, 2017 by maheshkhati

[Vmedvil]

Sorry, I think you are misunderstanding Special theory of relativity.

For example:- If you are measuring some distance dx' in S frame then it is dx'=dx/Y in S' frame. This is not physically shrinking of any object but finding of that distance in other inertial frame to be reduce.

So, distance between two particle get reduce dx'=dx/Y has nothing to do with shirking of space.

This is two different measurement done in two different frames.

We are seeing just same space in two different ways only.

This is not wrapping of space or anything else.

This is just two observation in two different frames.

 

Only happens in gravitational fields for empty space. Object with Momentum shrinks the space inside it not outside does not increase gravitational field greatly enough to do that outside of it which is the curvature of time space.

Gravity is a very weak force.

 

Like the Earth has a Mass of

5.972 × 10²⁴ kg take that E = MC² and only pulls at 9.8 m/s² That momentum or "Velocity" gravity is nothing compared to that, which still does not even accelerate to a velocity anywhere near what it would need to be to actually cause a noticeable length contraction or time dilation before hitting the earth in empty space just curvature.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Vmedvil

[maheshkhati]

Now, problem happen when track is fixed & moving matter can not remain on that track due to different reduce measurement.

I give the example:- One of my teacher was teaching chapter on current. He said that when current I is flowing in two parallel cables. Both cables attract each other.

I just ask one question.

In both cables, there are more free electrons. So, both cables are -vely charged.

& free electrons moving in one specific direction in both cables with average constant velocity due to same current.

So, all free electrons are actually stable with one another.

So, There must be only repulsion in both cable.

But experimentally, we find that both cable get attracted towards one another.

---------------------------------------------

When I search for explanation, I find explanation given by special theory of relativity.

In one cable if I fixed frame of reference on free electron then for that frame of reference, distance between all free electrons in other cable remain same but distance between protons get reduce. This is because other cable will be moving in opposite direction, in that frame.

So, for that free electrons attractive force from concentrated protons in other cable is more.

so, Both cable get attracted towards one another.

This is the only explanation, I find for this problem.

------------------------------------------------------

In above solution for this problem.

Distance between +vely charge nucleus get more contracted than free electrons.

So, if you mark the path of free electrons which is not contracted then it goes out of cable length.

This is same problem like CERN.

We find path of motion different than position of particles moving.

This solution is available everywhere for example

http://www.alternativephysics.org/book/LCmagnetism.htm

Edited December 20, 2017 by maheshkhati

[maheshkhati]

I have read 71 post but I will give the same answer

This is simple Special relativity problem.

When primary frame observer find less dx due to dx=dx'/Y.

 

1)I think you are completely wrong. Gravity do not shrink the space but it bend the space.

[Shustaire]

you know what woman you are starting to annoy me, if you want to know read, this beginning to end.

 

Third

 

http://www.scienceforums.net/topic/111607-wormhole-metric-how-is-this-screwed-up/

 

 

This First

 

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/bell-spaceship-paradox-qualitatively.829181/

 

Second

 

https://www.physicsforums.com/threads/do-we-move-in-the-universe-or-is-everything-stationary.828562/#post-5209882

You do realize those just makes your case worse not better.

[Shustaire]

That is that equation reverse solved for p , M_o = E_rest/C²

 

Keep throw stuff out there maybe you will into a part that doesn't show a utter lack of algebra interpolation skills.

Giggle tell me did you try that equation with a photon with rest energy of zero. Or did you forget BEDMAS.

 

( bracket, exponent, divivion, multiply, add, subtract.) is your sequence of operstions.

 

Roflmao try it zero= zero/c^2 giggle....

Edited December 20, 2017 by Shustaire

[Vmedvil]

Giggle tell me did you try that equation with a photon with rest energy of zero. Or did you forget BEDMAS.

 

( bracket, exponent, divivion, multiply, add, subtract.) is your sequence of operstions.

 

Roflmao try it zero= zero/c^2 giggle....

It has not rest mass but has rest energy, Energy and mass are the same thing in the eyes of GR for the generation of gravity, Energy-mass is usually used as the term for this.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_stress%E2%80%93energy_tensor

 

E_rest = hf for a standard photon.

Edited December 20, 2017 by Vmedvil

[Vmedvil]

Now, problem happen when track is fixed & moving matter can not remain on that track due to different reduce measurement.

I give the example:- One of my teacher was teaching chapter on current. He said that when current I is flowing in two parallel cables. Both cables attract each other.

I just ask one question.

In both cables, there are more free electrons. So, both cables are -vely charged.

& free electrons moving in one specific direction in both cables with average constant velocity due to same current.

So, all free electrons are actually stable with one another.

So, There must be only repulsion in both cable.

But experimentally, we find that both cable get attracted towards one another.

---------------------------------------------

When I search for explanation, I find explanation given by special theory of relativity.

In one cable if I fixed frame of reference on free electron then for that frame of reference, distance between all free electrons in other cable remain same but distance between protons get reduce. This is because other cable will be moving in opposite direction, in that frame.

So, for that free electrons attractive force from concentrated protons in other cable is more.

so, Both cable get attracted towards one another.

This is the only explanation, I find for this problem.

------------------------------------------------------

In above solution for this problem.

Distance between +vely charge nucleus get more contracted than free electrons.

So, if you mark the path of free electrons which is not contracted then it goes out of cable length.

This is same problem like CERN.

We find path of motion different than position of particles moving.

This solution is available everywhere for example

http://www.alternativephysics.org/book/LCmagnetism.htm

 

First off they are attracted to each other because of magnetism, not anything to do with SR + GR that is Maxwell's equations.

 

 

and if any of this speculation where true then why does CERN look like this, which obviously works.

 

 

 

 

Edited December 20, 2017 by Vmedvil

[Shustaire]

It has not rest mass but has rest energy, Energy and mass are the same thing in the eyes of GR for the generation of gravity, Energy-mass is usually used as the term for this.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetic_stress%E2%80%93energy_tensor

 

E_rest = hf for a standard photon.

No duh Why didnt you use the equation for [TOTAL ENERGY] which I gave you a few posts ago.

 

My god are you ever an idiot. You dont subtract kinetic energy from the flipping rest energy you subtract it from Total energy via the energy momentum equation

 

Not e=mc^2 that is the flipping rest energy idiot.

 

Here read it yourself

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy–momentum_relation

Edited December 20, 2017 by Shustaire

[Vmedvil]

No duh Why didnt you use the equation for [TOTAL ENERGY] which I gave you a few posts ago.

 

My god are you ever an idiot. You dont subtract kinetic energy from the flipping rest energy you subtract it from Total energy via the energy momentum equation

 

Not e=mc^2 that is the flipping rest energy idiot.

 

Here read it yourself

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy–momentum_relation

Because I didn't want to and the way I did it answered two posts at once which is equally valid.

Edited December 21, 2017 by Vmedvil

[Shustaire]

So you honestly feel trying to subtract relativistic energy from the rest or invariant energy from a particle is valid when the mass term is a property that defines the particle identity?

 

How can you possibly think that is valid?

[Shustaire]

So you honestly feel trying to subtract relativistic energy from the rest or invariant energy from a particle is valid when the mass term is a property that defines the particle identity?

 

How can you possibly think that is valid?

[Shustaire]

How can you possibly think subtracting relativistic energy from a particle at rest is valid?

[Vmedvil]

You have to take that in the proper context, E_Rest= M_RestC²

E_Rest/C² = M_rest 

 

E_{Rest photon} = hf

 

a_{gravity of object} = GM_rest/R₁₂²

Edited December 21, 2017 by Vmedvil

[Shustaire]

double post

Edited December 21, 2017 by Shustaire

[Shustaire]

That is not the right way to do it. If your going to state proper context then follow the proper methods.

 

It really does make you automatically look like a crackpot when you mix math rules for each theory without converting into a single formalized method.

 

My students would automatically fail if they ever did that in my class.

 

first lesson there is no rest frame in GR. So mixing GR with (at rest) is wrong in an equation.

 

Second lesson QFT including ghost fields uses coordinates (x_0,x_1,x_2,x,3) so having those coordinates on the RHS stating its equal to the LHS is wrong because ghost fields do not always have a coordinate basis.

Edited December 21, 2017 by Shustaire