Terra Preta - The parent thread which started it all

[erich]

At Last a Nature article link that will Last

 

http://bestenergies.com/downloads/naturemag_200604.pdf

[Philip Small]

At Last a Nature article link that will Last

 

Another "link that will last" is at the bottom of this 1/19 blog post:

 

environmentdebate.wordpress.com/2007/01/19/carbon-sequestration-the-old-fashioned-way/

[erich]

NewTerra Preta Page & Mail List

 

My latest activities include being drafted by these guys at REPP Crest to coordinate a central data base for all things Terra Preta: Terra Preta.

 

the TerraPreta mail list: [email protected] ,

 

The whole REPP thing started just a few days ago , so we will see who comes to the party.

 

Thanks,

Erich J. Knight

[Michaelangelica]

My life is being slowly taken over by terra preta (like the cre ep ing socialism in USA:) )

 

I am having troubles understanding some abbreviations in the book, "Amazonian Dark Earths" Can any one help? (No I don't have a copy of the book)

Talking about organic and inorganic carbon in soil ; they use this abbreviation "Mg C ha-1 m-1"

The "-1"s are above the line.

So ADE, Soil Organic Carbon stocks are estimated at " 147-506 Mg C ha-1 m-1 "(p127). What does that mean?

In other research articles I am sure I read people talk about 10-20% charcoal content in ADE. So far I have not found an accurate estimate of charcoal (apart from organic carbon) in ADEs In the book

Another problem

Many of the articles I have read (especially Japanese ones ) talk about Charcoal stopping the leaching of nutients, even though ADEs are more friable. This seems to be true but I was surprised by this comment:-

"When inorganic nutrients were applied to amazonian Dark Earths as a fertiliser, however, leaching proved very high and exceeded that found in the Ferralsol" (p115)

So what gives? Are only organic nutrients saved?

 

It also seems some crops do better than others because of the nutrients most persistent in ADEs P, N and Ca seem high

[InfiniteNow]

they use this abbreviation "Mg C ha-1 m-1"

The "-1"s are above the line.

So ADE, Soil Organic Carbon stocks are estimated at " 147-506 Mg C ha-1 m-1 "(p127). What does that mean?

...

Many of the articles I have read (especially Japanese ones ) talk about Charcoal stopping the leaching of nutients

 

milligrams of carbon per metric hectare?

 

The char holds the nutrients that water would otherwise wash away, but I'm not sure about the Japanese discrepanc you noted...

[redgreenblue]

I am having troubles understanding some abbreviations in the book, "Amazonian Dark Earths" Can any one help? (No I don't have a copy of the book)

Talking about organic and inorganic carbon in soil ; they use this abbreviation "Mg C ha-1 m-1"

The "-1"s are above the line.

So ADE, Soil Organic Carbon stocks are estimated at " 147-506 Mg C ha-1 m-1 "(p127). What does that mean?

 

I believe this is the amount of carbon present in the soil over one hectare, measured to a depth of 1m, with Mg being Mega-grams or scientific jargon for 1 tonne... so if you use the right metric conversion factors, you can use this number to find how much carbon is present in a cubic meter of the soil.

[Philip Small]

MG = one million grams or 1000 kg

 

Units are MG per soil volume: a hectare meter, as in a hectare of surface area and a meter deep. A hectare is a square hectometer, that is, the area of a square which is 100 meters on each side.

[Michaelangelica]

MG = one million grams or 1000 kg

 

Units are MG per soil volume: a hectare meter, as in a hectare of surface area and a meter deep. A hectare is a square hectometer, that is, the area of a square which is 100 meters on each side.

 

Sorry redgreenblue

and Philip

I am very confused.

I am a 'Bear-of -little Brain'

 

So is there a LOT of Charcoal or a LITTLE bit?

 

 

 

Is this of interest?

 

Fossil-Free-Landscaping group

<[email protected]> to Fossil-Free-La.

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Fossil Free Landscaping

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TOPIC: fossil-free Re: Fwd: Kelpie Wilson | 2006 Top Green Tech Ideas

Google Groups: Fossil Free Landscaping

==============================================================================

[redgreenblue]

So is there a LOT of Charcoal or a LITTLE bit?

 

If my calculations are correct, then that's between 14.7 and 50.6 kg of char per m3... it definitely seems like a lot...

 

147 to 506 tonnes = 147000 to 506000 kg

1 ha = 100m * 100m = 10000 square meters

147000/10000 = 14.7kg/m3

[Philip Small]

If my calculations are correct, then that's between 14.7 and 50.6 kg of char per m3... it definitely seems like a lot...

 

147 to 506 tonnes = 147000 to 506000 kg

1 ha = 100m * 100m = 10000 square meters

147000/10000 = 14.7kg/m3

 

Clay mineral soils in the USA weigh about 1.1 times water. Organic soils (TP?) weigh less, coarse soils (sands) weigh more in the 1.5 - 1.6 range. Above 1.7 is compacted soil. Water weighs 1 gm/cc.

 

A cubic meter of water weighs a tonne (handy that if correct - check my math!). That puts 14.7 kg/cubic meter at 1.47% by weight. Not my area of knowledge, but that seems like a lot for a ferrasol soil.

 

I have been wondering about those 20% C numbers though. One source of confusion is if the author slips and is thinking Organic Matter but writes Organic Carbon. OM is 1.5 to 2.0X OC. It is supposed to be calibrated regionally, but calibration is demanding so labs often use 1.724 as a default. On the other hand, high organic matter soils weigh less per soil volume so maybe 20% C makes sense.

[Michaelangelica]

Very confused now.

 

I just posted this on the new Tera preta website in response to a question but thought you might like to read it here too

Still procastinating about writing my TP article

 

Home Made Terra Preta (Nova?) Kit

"TP goes way beyond the old saw of "Feed the Soil, Not the plants" to "Feed, House, and provide water& waste infrastructure to the Soil! "-eric

 

Great definition erich

 

I have been mucking around with different potting mixes. with different %s of the following . I do much of it by "feel" or instinct as I have been growing plants in pots for 40 years. Always looking for "The Perfect Potting Mix"

 

I can't find broken terracotta clay so I use bentonite or attapultite as it is cheap and readily available.(kitty litter.).

I am told zeolite would also work well. I do like to use Terracotta Pots when I can.

 

Charcoal, very fine, in amounts from 5% to10% (I would use more up to 20% if I could afford it)

 

Down the bottom of the pot I put some seaweed (whole), horse manure fine, and fine chicken manure. I cover this with Very cheap potting mix then I add the clay and charcoal and more potting mix (I don't want young plant roots touching raw manure)

I use also a little slow release fertiliser and Miracle Grow Liquid fertiliser (small amounts often-the basil seems to especially like this)

Most plants and worms seem to love the "Terra Preta (Nova?)" thus made

 

Things I am leaving out shells, (have found a small local midden and may try this soon) fish fertiliser (too expensive), soil (too many weed seeds and poor PH) , quartz ( too hard) microorganisms.(too mean to buy them)-

 

The mix is a little heaver than I would like. Some sand, bigger bits of charcoal or silica might help. I notice there is a new Kitty Litter on the market that looks like silica but I wish they would put the full name of the product on the packet for Strange Gardening Experiments by Strange Gardeners. Replicating the pottery shard side of terra preta is difficult.

 

I am most proud of my one year old Fig tree (from cutting) that is now over a metre tall and has figs friuts/flowers? coming !

 

One thing that Terra preta does do for you, is give you a new appreciation of the complex web of life in the soil

I have a huge compost pile mainly of seaweed, have taken to emptying the vacuum cleaner bag on plants (As S. American Indians keep home floor sweepings for the garden) and now keep and grind up egg shells in a M&P for my 1 lavender plant. Even the ham leg from Christmas I gave to the crabs down the lake to clean. I have now retrieved it and trying to work out away of pulverising it!!

 

I noticed yesterday some locals putting lawn clippings in the council green waste bin.

I had to control my urge to run over and tell them not to throw away such good organic matter. It was not easy.

[Michaelangelica]

Good site with some good basic facts about charcoal for cooking

BBQ Charcoal FAQ by Bill Wight, www.bbqdan.com

Q: What is charcoal?

 

A: a dictionary or encyclopedia definition goes like this: Charcoal is a substance obtained by partial burning or destructive distillation of organic material. It is largely pure carbon.

The most common variety, wood charcoal, was formerly prepared by piling wood into stacks, covering it with earth or turf, and setting it on fire.

In this process volatile compounds in the wood pass off as vapors into the air, some of the carbon is consumed as fuel and the rest of the carbon is converted into charcoal.

Charcoal, being almost pure carbon, yields a larger amount of heat in proportion to its volume than is obtained from a corresponding quantity of wood; as a fuel it has the further advantage of being smokeless.

 

Q: So is barbecuing and grilling with charcoal healthier than using wood?

 

A: Yes. It is healthier for us humans to cook our meat and vegetables over a charcoal fire than over one of wood. However, the risk of getting cancer or lung disease from barbecuing and grilling over wood is quite low, orders of magnitude lower than smoking cigarettes or living in the Los Angeles California air basin.

. . .

We as consumers have to take it on faith that a company who makes charcoal from scraps of hardwood lumber (from furniture or flooring) has taken precautions to use wood that is free from any contaminates or additives

[erich]

Hi All,

 

Muck and Mystery, a great blog , has a great review of Philip Small's review of a brace of articles from E/The Environmental Magazine The Scoop On Dirt: Why We Should all Worship the Ground We Walk On, part I and part II, by Tamsyn Jones.

 

Muck and Mystery: Soiled Stories

 

Included is a link back to our new TP site at Terra Preta , the first I've come across.

 

Erich

[Michaelangelica]

Good blog on a new book on soil bugs

transect points: Teaming with Microbes Arrived Today

 

Thursday, January 25, 2007

Teaming with Microbes Arrived Today

 

My anticipated copy of "Teaming with Microbes" has arrived. While I can't comment on the full text with any authority yet, I can say that it is well organized and has an extensive index (8 pages). It pleased me no end to see "soil science 28 - 42".

There is also a valuable guide to labs and suppliers (4 pages). A supplier of mycorhhizal fungi here in Spokane is going to be getting a new customer.

 

Australian Customs, paranoid at the best of times, would FREAK if I started importing soil bugs.

I wonder if we just shoudn't be feeding the ones that grow naturally in our own areas?

 

One of the reasons the soil microflora of Terra preta has not been worked out yet is the fears Brazillians have of US firms patenting genetic material.

[erich]

I have used Mycorrhizal fungus inoculation in planting custom ornamental gardens for about ten years.

I spoke years ago to one of M-Root's developers, He admitted that their product was a shot gun approach and they were working on matching particular species to specific plant groups.

 

My experience is that the sleep, then creep, then leap phenomena of new plantings of trees and shrubs is partly over come by the acceleration of the reestablishment of the symbiotic fungal / root relationship. This responce I have not seen however in my Perenial and annual beds.

 

M-Roots is the best bang for the buck that I've found,

25 billion per 40 lb bag @ $13,

24 different species both Endo and Ecto

 

Here's the M-Roots site: Roots Inc. - Mycorrhizal fungi and more.

 

I found a sales office in Australia for M-Roots:

 

http://www.rootsinc.com/images/SALESMap.pdf

 

 

 

and for ya'll in the western US:

 

REFORESTATION TECHNOLOGIES INTERNATIONAL

RTI was founded in 1993 to provide planting establishment and protection products for reforestation, landscape restoration, horticulture and agriculture. Our two primary product lines are controlled release and organic fertilizers in a “teabag” delivery system plus mycorrhizal inoculants. Recently we have been developing an animal repellent product based on nutrition, not foliar applied repellents.

:.:reforest.com:.: - products

[RBlack]

I am currently trying to get as many referenced articles that I can on Terra Preta soils and charcoal amendments to soil. I feel that we must avoid any perception of TP soils being "fringe" or "new age" by using quality sources. So if you have any links to good articles let me know.

 

In light of that the best article I have found so far documenting the relationship or microbial life and charchoal is: "Charcaol as a Potential Tool for Land and Water Remediation". You will have to Google this as I do not have enough posts to add links yet but when I do I will also share the referenced articles that I have found. Most of you may already have them.

Thanks,

RB

[RBlack]

Thought I'd get another post under my belt! One of the best online articles I have found is by Natasha Celine (this may have already been mentioned in an earlier post), called "Amazonian Dark Earths". Again Google this and it comes up quick. I think this may have been an unpublished master dissertation it is great for the history, benifits, and overall view of Terra Preta. It is referenced and the best thing I can say is that I wish I had written it!

RB