Four States For Two Nations

[HouseKnight1]

It is generally believed that the only alternative to the “two states for two nations” is a bi-national Jewish-Palestinian state. It is desirable that a Jewish majority remain in such a state, and for this, Gaza must become a separate independent state. This opinion is held today by the US Democratic Party, as announced Nancy Pelosi. If Trump puts forward just such a plan, then he is just a realist. Twice two = four, not more or less.

If there is no Palestine, so let’s give Israeli citizenship, equal civil and social rights to all Arabs living in the West Bank, and give them freedom of movement throughout the country. Run a million people from Gaza, who break into a Jewish state to turn it into an Islamic one. If there is no Palestine, then there will be an Islamic state “from the River to the Sea”.

However, the “One state” solution  is not the single alternative to the “two states for two nations”. My position is four states for two peoples, namely: three Palestinian states, Jordan, the West Bank and Gaza, and one Jewish state of Israel, in which a full-fledged Arab minority lives.

In 1948, the Palestinian people expressed their disagreement to live in the same state with the Jews, and voted with their feet, staging the Nakba. In the Oslo agreements, both sides agreed on two states for two nations. Then the majority of Palestinians voted for Hamas, that is, for one state for one people — the Palestinian. The Palestinians formally denounced the Oslo agreement, and Israel did not denounce. Thus, the Palestinian people frankly proclaimed as their goal the destruction of the State of Israel and the genocide of the Jews. Given the worldwide anti-Semitism, this goal of the Palestinians is quite achievable.

The main task of the people of Israel is to thwart the bloody plan of genocide. For this, we must continue the occupation of the West Bank. The peace remains inaccessible luxury for the Jews.

As long as anti-Semitism exists, there can be no peace for Jews, in principle. And anti-Semitism does not only exist, it has become the leading religion of humankind. Right, left, Muslims, Christians, and even some Jews, want to believe anti-Semitic lie about the oppressed, deprived of all rights Palestinian people.

Our main task is to expose this lie, and not to help anti-Semites, proclaiming fantastic slogans like «Palestine does not exist.» Palestine does exist, just Israel confronts the Worldwide anti-Semitic onslaught, the purpose of which is to destroy us. It is the Palestinians led by Hamas demanding a “one state”. All that the Palestinians have done so far, including terror, missiles and anti-Semitic propaganda, is intended to prevent the partition, that is, Israel’s independence from Palestine.

Those who do not recognize the legal rights of the Palestinians, in fact, cooperate with our mortal enemies. We must de facto recognize all three existing Palestinian states: Jordan, the West Bank and Gaza. In fact, the three Palestinian states are a real situation today, which should be recognized formally in order to repel anti-Semitic aggression. In fact, all the individual elements of this system already exist. It remains only to formally recognize the real facts.

Another prerequisite without which a Jewish state cannot exist is the occupation of the West Bank. We will have to learn to combine the independence of the West Bank with the Israeli occupation. Occupation is necessary in order to prevent the destruction of us by the Palestinians, if they get free hands in the West Bank. The occupation of Palestine is a self-defense against the criminal program of the genocide of Jews, which the Palestinians, supported by all the anti-Semites of the World, are preparing.

All anti-Semites, from Russia to Europe, not to mention Iran, use the allegedly unequal position of the Palestinians to intervene in the conflict on the side of our enemies, and to instigate a war for the destruction of Israel. Our main task is to survive, and our policy should be subordinated to this task. Jews have to be realistic, otherwise the anti-Semites will simply annihilate us, as the Europeans, inspired by Hitler, already did.

http://aaronblog.co/2019/01/four-states-for-two-people/

 

Edited January 11, 2019 by HouseKnight1

[montgomery]

Your entire argument seems to be based on the Palestinian people being at fault, when in fact Zionist expansionist policy is the problem. Israel, the nuclear power with the US at it's back, isn't threatened by Iran of Syria yet Israel continues to attack Syria and Iran assets within Syria. 

 

In truth, no nuclear armed nation is really vulnerable to attack on account of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) But Iran and Syria are certainly perpetually threatened by US/Israel aggression. 40 US wars of aggression since WW2 alone, tells us who the bad guys of the 21st. century are that need to be feared, and Israel is complicit in many of those wars. 

 

Indeed, it can be argued that all of the US's Middle East wars were started and waged at least in part to the benefit of Israel. The West's enemy wasn't radical  Islam until the West created the enemy.

 

Consider that Israel is a tool of US aggression, while US aggression helps to fulfill Zionist interests. And the reason we need to care so much is that Zionism's expansionist agenda threatens the entire world. 

[HouseKnight1]

Your entire argument seems to be based on the Palestinian people being at fault, when in fact Zionist expansionist policy is the problem. Israel, the nuclear power with the US at it's back, isn't threatened by Iran of Syria yet Israel continues to attack Syria and Iran assets within Syria. 

 

In truth, no nuclear armed nation is really vulnerable to attack on account of M.A.D. (mutually assured destruction) But Iran and Syria are certainly perpetually threatened by US/Israel aggression. 40 US wars of aggression since WW2 alone, tells us who the bad guys of the 21st. century are that need to be feared, and Israel is complicit in many of those wars. 

 

Indeed, it can be argued that all of the US's Middle East wars were started and waged at least in part to the benefit of Israel. The West's enemy wasn't radical  Islam until the West created the enemy.

 

Consider that Israel is a tool of US aggression, while US aggression helps to fulfill Zionist interests. And the reason we need to care so much is that Zionism's expansionist agenda threatens the entire world. 

Indeed, I suggest, that the lack of peace between Israel and Palestinians is caused by incessant Palestinian anti-Jewish aggression, which lasts 1000 years. The events of last 100 years are simply episode of this 1000 years confrontation. All the way the Palestinians (and their ancestors) relayed on powerful anti-Jewish players. What You call "Israeli aggression" is actually Jewish self-defense, we are doing what is necessary to survive. Regarding radical Islam, it was inspired by Muhammad himself some 1400 years ago. By betraying Israel, the Western powers only encourage radical Islam. Your idea about Israel threatening entire World is laughable, however, similar Hitler's idea turned out just destructive. Finally, I may calm You down: Jewish Globalists are enemies of Israel, too. Now, Israeli politicians try turning Arabs our friends. The Palestinians make efforts to prevent Arab-Israeli unity.

[montgomery]

Indeed, I suggest, that the lack of peace between Israel and Palestinians is caused by incessant Palestinian anti-Jewish aggression, which lasts 1000 years. The events of last 100 years are simply episode of this 1000 years confrontation. All the way the Palestinians (and their ancestors) relayed on powerful anti-Jewish players. What You call "Israeli aggression" is actually Jewish self-defense, we are doing what is necessary to survive. Regarding radical Islam, it was inspired by Muhammad himself some 1400 years ago. By betraying Israel, the Western powers only encourage radical Islam. Your idea about Israel threatening entire World is laughable, however, similar Hitler's idea turned out just destructive. Finally, I may calm You down: Jewish Globalists are enemies of Israel, too. Now, Israeli politicians try turning Arabs our friends. The Palestinians make efforts to prevent Arab-Israeli unity.

 

I would suggest that the Zionists are doing what they need to do to make sure they don't survive. Sooner or later Arab freedom fighters are going to get their hands on weapons that are more than rockets bulit out of stove pipes and use them in revenge. We know that Israelis who are opposed to the continuing apartheid regime are aware of the danger and understand that it has to end. 

No need to try to calm me down. I feel no anxiety over Israel's obvious fate. When I feel anxiety it's on behalf of the rest of the world that is threatened with nuclear war on account of Israel not fitting in with the rest of the world's standards.

Don't be your own worst enemies!

[HouseKnight1]

 

Indeed, I suggest, that the lack of peace between Israel and Palestinians is caused by incessant Palestinian anti-Jewish aggression, which lasts 1000 years. The events of last 100 years are simply episode of this 1000 years confrontation. All the way the Palestinians (and their ancestors) relayed on powerful anti-Jewish players. What You call "Israeli aggression" is actually Jewish self-defense, we are doing what is necessary to survive. Regarding radical Islam, it was inspired by Muhammad himself some 1400 years ago. By betraying Israel, the Western powers only encourage radical Islam. Your idea about Israel threatening entire World is laughable, however, similar Hitler's idea turned out just destructive. Finally, I may calm You down: Jewish Globalists are enemies of Israel, too. Now, Israeli politicians try turning Arabs our friends. The Palestinians make efforts to prevent Arab-Israeli unity.

 

I would suggest that the Zionists are doing what they need to do to make sure they don't survive. Sooner or later Arab freedom fighters are going to get their hands on weapons that are more than rockets bulit out of stove pipes and use them in revenge. We know that Israelis who are opposed to the continuing apartheid regime are aware of the danger and understand that it has to end. 

No need to try to calm me down. I feel no anxiety over Israel's obvious fate. When I feel anxiety it's on behalf of the rest of the world that is threatened with nuclear war on account of Israel not fitting in with the rest of the world's standards.

Don't be your own worst enemies!

Let's pay attention: the "freedom fighters" (that is anti-Semitic aggressors) may wage their war for annihilation of Israel for decades, only due to external support. Palestine does exist and wages anti-Semitic war at the expense of anti-Semitic "donors". Actually, Israel is waging war for survival against entire World. I cannot guarantee that we will win this war, but we make all possible efforts to win. We have no intention to surrender. This time Hitler has hard task dealing with the Jewish State, instead of dispersed Jews.

Edited January 20, 2019 by HouseKnight1

[montgomery]

So now the Zionist apartheid regime is waging war against the entire world? You must have been listening to Elie Weisel's tall tales. 

 

 

Indeed, I suggest, that the lack of peace between Israel and Palestinians is caused by incessant Palestinian anti-Jewish aggression, which lasts 1000 years. The events of last 100 years are simply episode of this 1000 years confrontation. All the way the Palestinians (and their ancestors) relayed on powerful anti-Jewish players. What You call "Israeli aggression" is actually Jewish self-defense, we are doing what is necessary to survive. Regarding radical Islam, it was inspired by Muhammad himself some 1400 years ago. By betraying Israel, the Western powers only encourage radical Islam. Your idea about Israel threatening entire World is laughable, however, similar Hitler's idea turned out just destructive. Finally, I may calm You down: Jewish Globalists are enemies of Israel, too. Now, Israeli politicians try turning Arabs our friends. The Palestinians make efforts to prevent Arab-Israeli unity.

 

I would suggest that the Zionists are doing what they need to do to make sure they don't survive. Sooner or later Arab freedom fighters are going to get their hands on weapons that are more than rockets bulit out of stove pipes and use them in revenge. We know that Israelis who are opposed to the continuing apartheid regime are aware of the danger and understand that it has to end. 

No need to try to calm me down. I feel no anxiety over Israel's obvious fate. When I feel anxiety it's on behalf of the rest of the world that is threatened with nuclear war on account of Israel not fitting in with the rest of the world's standards.

Don't be your own worst enemies!

Let's pay attention: the "freedom fighters" (that is anti-Semitic aggressors) may wage their war for annihilation of Israel for decades, only due to external support. Palestine does exist and wages anti-Semitic war at the expense of anti-Semitic "donors". Actually, Israel is waging war for survival against entire World. I cannot guarantee that we will win this war, but we make all possible efforts to win. We have no intention to surrender. This time Hitler has hard task dealing with the Jewish State, instead of dispersed Jews.

 

[montgomery]

I'll repeat me post above because it got tangled up in the quotes, due to my lack of experience with this format.

 

I would suggest that the Zionists are doing what they need to do to make sure they don't survive. Sooner or later Arab freedom fighters are going to get their hands on weapons that are more than rockets bulit out of stove pipes and use them in revenge. We know that Israelis who are opposed to the continuing apartheid regime are aware of the danger and understand that it has to end. 

No need to try to calm me down. I feel no anxiety over Israel's obvious fate. When I feel anxiety it's on behalf of the rest of the world that is threatened with nuclear war on account of Israel not fitting in with the rest of the world's standards.

Don't be your own worst enemies!

[fahrquad]

Lets just move the state of Israel to Arizona or New Mexico and be done with this mess.  

 

Israel has evidence of the earliest migration of hominids out of Africa.^[27] Canaanite tribes are archaeologically attested since the Middle Bronze Age,^[28][29] while the Kingdoms of Israel and Judah emerged during the Iron Age.^[30][31] The Neo-Assyrian Empire destroyed Israel around 720 BCE.^[32] Judah was later conquered by the Babylonian, Persian and Hellenistic empires and had existed as Jewish autonomous provinces.^[33][34] The successful Maccabean Revolt led to an independent Hasmonean kingdom by 110 BCE,^[35] which in 63 BCE however became a client state of the Roman Republic that subsequently installed the Herodian dynasty in 37 BCE, and in 6 CE created the Roman province of Judea.^[36] Judea lasted as a Roman province until the failed Jewish revolts resulted in widespread destruction,^[35] expulsion of Jewish population^[35][37] and the renaming of the region from Iudaea to Syria Palaestina.^[38] Jewish presence in the region has persisted to a certain extent over the centuries. In the 7th century CE, the Levant was taken from the Byzantine Empire by the Arabs and remained in Muslim control until the First Crusade of 1099, followed by the Ayyubid conquest of 1187. The Mamluk Sultanate of Egypt extended its control over the Levant in the 13th century until its defeat by the Ottoman Empire in 1517. During the 19th century, national awakening among Jews led to the establishment of the Zionist movement in the diaspora followed by waves of immigration to Ottoman Syria and later British Mandate Palestine. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

[fahrquad]

It is only 8019 square miles after all.  Maybe the Lake Havasu area?  I am sure the Mojave Indians won't mind.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Havasu

[OceanBreeze]

 

It is generally believed that the only alternative to the “two states for two nations” is a bi-national Jewish-Palestinian state. 

 

What do you think of the  “two states plus fifty” solution?

That is, Make Israel a State of the U.S.

[fahrquad]

What do you think of the  “two states plus fifty” solution?

That is, Make Israel a State of the U.S.

 

Not really crazy about the idea.  Quite frankly, I favor the immediate discontinuation of any and all foreign aid.  Not to sound like an isolationist, but I think we need to get to our own affairs in order before we forcibly impose our ideas on other unwilling nations.  The rest of the world can take care of themselves.  War, disease, and famine are natures way of keeping humanity in check.  I hate being manipulated by "Charitable" organizations that spend more on executive perks than they do on relief with pictures of children with bloated bellies.  Particularly rankling were the ones with an overly fed has-been actress from the show "All in the Family" managing to get a plea out of her own stuffed mouth.

 

 

Doggie looks pretty tempting.

Edited March 8, 2019 by fahrquad

[montgomery]

Our concern needs to be more about world peace. The Zionist regime's tactics are endangering the world as regarding the chances of a nuclear war more than any other current situation. And I say this even in a time when the situation between Pakistan and India is at it's worst.

 

The time is coming when little Israel will need to resort to the use of nuclear weapons in order to continue to survive. This will be due to Israel's outrageious performance as opposed to Iran's aggression. 

 

The US needs to back off it's protction of Israel and it's apartheid regime, in order to allow the UN and the concerned powers of the world to correct the situation and bring justice for the long suffering Palestinian people.

 

No doubt Ahmadinejad's suggestion that apartheid must be killed by pushing it into the sea would be a solution. Unfortunately for the world, the US prevents that solution from solving the problem.

 

(pushing apartheid into the sea is just that and nothing else!)