What makes humans different from all the rest

[Vmedvil]

15 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

I never made that claim, as I have said, this is a science forum, what you believe is immaterial, if you cannot back up your claims then do not make them. I am going to bring back the science in this forum, do not make assertions about belief or opinions unless you can back them up.  

Hell, I will give it a shot, Links = Google DeepMind CEO Says AI May Become Self-Aware (futurism.com), https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5110243/,Differences in human and chimpanzee gene expression patterns define an evolving network of transcription factors in brain | PNAS, and The Hardwiring that Makes Us Human | The Brink | Boston University (bu.edu)

Basically, that is why I express that opinion on it.

Edited February 23, 2024 by Vmedvil

[Moontanman]

10 minutes ago, Vmedvil said:

Hell, I will give it a shot, Links = Google DeepMind CEO Says AI May Become Self-Aware (futurism.com), https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5110243/,Differences in human and chimpanzee gene expression patterns define an evolving network of transcription factors in brain | PNAS, and The Hardwiring that Makes Us Human | The Brink | Boston University (bu.edu)

Basically, that is why I express that opinion on it.

You need to break down each of those links and detail how they support your argument, I read them and see little to no connection. Your links are also human centric, humans and primates are not the only large brained organisms on the earth. 

[Vmedvil]

36 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

You need to break down each of those links and detail how they support your argument, I read them and see little to no connection. Your links are also human centric, humans and primates are not the only large brained organisms on the earth. 

This is one piece of evidence; I want to put forward that supports that, which is the size of their monkey brains are smaller.

"Gorillas and orangutans are primates at least as large as humans, but their brains amount to about one third of the size of the human brain. This discrepancy has been used as evidence that the human brain is about 3 times larger than it should be for a primate species of its body size."

Link = https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21228547/

Let's see, This too, it has something to do with this genetic change between primates and humans in the proliferation of neuron cells.

"Human neocortex expansion likely contributed to the remarkable cognitive abilities of humans. This expansion is thought to primarily reflect differences in proliferation versus differentiation of neural progenitors during cortical development. Here, we have searched for such differences by analysing cerebral organoids from human and chimpanzees using immunohistofluorescence, live imaging, and single-cell transcriptomics. We find that the cytoarchitecture, cell type composition, and neurogenic gene expression programs of humans and chimpanzees are remarkably similar. Notably, however, live imaging of apical progenitor mitosis uncovered a lengthening of prometaphase-metaphase in humans compared to chimpanzees that is specific to proliferating progenitors and not observed in non-neural cells. Consistent with this, the small set of genes more highly expressed in human apical progenitors points to increased proliferative capacity, and the proportion of neurogenic basal progenitors is lower in humans. These subtle differences in cortical progenitors between humans and chimpanzees may have consequences for human neocortex evolution."

Furthermore, This shows the differences in gene expression between humans and the great apes in their brains.

"To enable an accurate comparison of TF gene expression and network structure in human and chimpanzee brain, we devised a strategy to reliably distinguish expression levels of individual gene family members. Our analysis of an established dataset (11) uncovered 90 TF genes that are differentially expressed and revealed that they are organized in a coexpression network comprised of two modules with distinct functions. Both modules are enriched for primate-specific KRAB-ZNF genes, which despite their recent advent are robustly embedded in the chimpanzee and human brain networks. Our results implicate a network of TFs with differential expression in human and chimpanzee brain involved in regulation of energy metabolism, vesicle transport, and related functions required to build and maintain the larger and more complex human brain."

Furthermore, This shows that more cortical neurons are generated during fetal development in humans.

"Humans relative to chimpanzees involves an increase in the number of cortical neurons generated during fetal development (Borrell and Reillo, 2012; Florio and Huttner, 2014; Herculano-Houzel, 2009; Lui et al., 2011). This reflects primarily a greater and prolonged proliferative capacity of human neural stem and progenitor cells (NSPCs) within the germinal zones of the developing neocortex (Lewitus et al., 2013). Unravelling differences between human and chimpanzee NSPC behaviour is therefore a key issue, yet very little is known about such differences."

This shows that it has something to do with increased number of cells.

"We have suggested that it is the great apes that might have evolved bodies that are unusually large, on the basis of our recent finding that the cellular composition of the human brain matches that expected for a primate brain of its size, making the human brain a linearly scaled-up primate brain in its number of cells."

This shows that the Neanderthals our ancestors had around 80 billion neuron cells and likely humans favored higher neuron counts.

"We then used those scaling rules and published estimated brain volumes for various hominin species to predict the numbers of neurons that composed their brains. We predict that Homo heidelbergensis and Homo neanderthalensis had brains with approximately 80 billion neurons, within the range of variation found in modern Homo sapiens. We propose that while the cellular scaling rules that apply to the primate brain have remained stable in hominin evolution (since they apply to simians, great apes and modern humans alike), the Colobinae and Pongidae lineages favored marked increases in body size rather than brain size from the common ancestor with the Homo lineage, while the Homo lineage seems to have favored a large brain instead of a large body, possibly due to the metabolic limitations to having both."

Link = Differences and similarities between human and chimpanzee neural progenitors during cerebral cortex development - PMC (nih.gov) and Differences in human and chimpanzee gene expression patterns define an evolving network of transcription factors in brain | PNAS

This shows that the human Pre-Frontal Cortex processes consciousness according to this article.

"Our cognition, or “what makes us human,” is centered in the prefrontal cortex, the most evolved part of the brain, located just behind our foreheads, says Helen Barbas, a Boston University College of Health & Rehabilitation Sciences: Sargent College professor of health sciences. The drives that keep us alive, like hunger and fear, are activated in the hypothalamus and the amygdala, two clusters of neurons deep inside each of the brain’s hemispheres. The amygdala also interprets sensory information; for example, identifying the scent of food or the sound of a predator’s growl.

Researchers tend to consider these areas separately, and “the idea that emotions are not irrational, that they make up a very important part of decision-making, is relatively new” for neuroscience, Barbas says. By mapping the pathways that transmit information throughout the brain, she reveals that the regions for processing emotions and thoughts are inextricably linked—and sundering them “is detrimental to our well-being.”

Until the early 1970s, researchers considered the prefrontal cortex too functionally complex to understand through experimentation. They had found that in a subject under anesthesia, less functionally intricate areas of the brain responded to stimuli; for example, the neurons in the visual area of the brain fired in response to a light shined into the eye. But when the researchers tried to engage the prefrontal cortex, they found it unresponsive and dubbed it the “silent cortex.”

Today, neuroscientists like Barbas know this area is anything but silent. “The prefrontal cortex gets information and does something with it; it’s not just a receiver of information like the sensory areas,” she says. The meaning of the information is important to the prefrontal cortex, and processing it requires consciousness."

Link = The Hardwiring that Makes Us Human | The Brink | Boston University (bu.edu)

My conclusion is probably an increased number of neurons in the prefrontal cortex makes us "Human and capable of higher-level thoughts" and Apes just don't have the neuron counts to achieve consciousness within the prefrontal cortex and higher-level thought. This having something to do with 90 genes that control expression of neuron structure and proliferation with humans which act differently in primates during fetal development.

Edited February 23, 2024 by Vmedvil

[Moontanman]

6 minutes ago, Vmedvil said:

This is one piece of evidence; I want to put forward that supports that, which is the size of their monkey brains are smaller.

"Gorillas and orangutans are primates at least as large as humans, but their brains amount to about one third of the size of the human brain. This discrepancy has been used as evidence that the human brain is about 3 times larger than it should be for a primate species of its body size."

Link = https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21228547/

Let's see, This too, it has something to do with this genetic change between primates and humans in the proliferation of neuron cells.

"Human neocortex expansion likely contributed to the remarkable cognitive abilities of humans. This expansion is thought to primarily reflect differences in proliferation versus differentiation of neural progenitors during cortical development. Here, we have searched for such differences by analysing cerebral organoids from human and chimpanzees using immunohistofluorescence, live imaging, and single-cell transcriptomics. We find that the cytoarchitecture, cell type composition, and neurogenic gene expression programs of humans and chimpanzees are remarkably similar. Notably, however, live imaging of apical progenitor mitosis uncovered a lengthening of prometaphase-metaphase in humans compared to chimpanzees that is specific to proliferating progenitors and not observed in non-neural cells. Consistent with this, the small set of genes more highly expressed in human apical progenitors points to increased proliferative capacity, and the proportion of neurogenic basal progenitors is lower in humans. These subtle differences in cortical progenitors between humans and chimpanzees may have consequences for human neocortex evolution."

Furthermore, This shows the differences in gene expression between humans and the great apes in their brains.

"To enable an accurate comparison of TF gene expression and network structure in human and chimpanzee brain, we devised a strategy to reliably distinguish expression levels of individual gene family members. Our analysis of an established dataset (11) uncovered 90 TF genes that are differentially expressed and revealed that they are organized in a coexpression network comprised of two modules with distinct functions. Both modules are enriched for primate-specific KRAB-ZNF genes, which despite their recent advent are robustly embedded in the chimpanzee and human brain networks. Our results implicate a network of TFs with differential expression in human and chimpanzee brain involved in regulation of energy metabolism, vesicle transport, and related functions required to build and maintain the larger and more complex human brain."

Furthermore, This shows that more cortical neurons are generated during fetal development in humans.

"Humans relative to chimpanzees involves an increase in the number of cortical neurons generated during fetal development (Borrell and Reillo, 2012; Florio and Huttner, 2014; Herculano-Houzel, 2009; Lui et al., 2011). This reflects primarily a greater and prolonged proliferative capacity of human neural stem and progenitor cells (NSPCs) within the germinal zones of the developing neocortex (Lewitus et al., 2013). Unravelling differences between human and chimpanzee NSPC behaviour is therefore a key issue, yet very little is known about such differences."

This shows that it has something to do with increased number of cells.

"We have suggested that it is the great apes that might have evolved bodies that are unusually large, on the basis of our recent finding that the cellular composition of the human brain matches that expected for a primate brain of its size, making the human brain a linearly scaled-up primate brain in its number of cells."

This shows that the Neanderthals our ancestors had around 80 billion neuron cells and likely humans favored higher neuron counts.

"We then used those scaling rules and published estimated brain volumes for various hominin species to predict the numbers of neurons that composed their brains. We predict that Homo heidelbergensis and Homo neanderthalensis had brains with approximately 80 billion neurons, within the range of variation found in modern Homo sapiens. We propose that while the cellular scaling rules that apply to the primate brain have remained stable in hominin evolution (since they apply to simians, great apes and modern humans alike), the Colobinae and Pongidae lineages favored marked increases in body size rather than brain size from the common ancestor with the Homo lineage, while the Homo lineage seems to have favored a large brain instead of a large body, possibly due to the metabolic limitations to having both."

Link = Differences and similarities between human and chimpanzee neural progenitors during cerebral cortex development - PMC (nih.gov) and Differences in human and chimpanzee gene expression patterns define an evolving network of transcription factors in brain | PNAS

This shows that the human Pre-Frontal Cortex processes consciousness according to this article.

"Our cognition, or “what makes us human,” is centered in the prefrontal cortex, the most evolved part of the brain, located just behind our foreheads, says Helen Barbas, a Boston University College of Health & Rehabilitation Sciences: Sargent College professor of health sciences. The drives that keep us alive, like hunger and fear, are activated in the hypothalamus and the amygdala, two clusters of neurons deep inside each of the brain’s hemispheres. The amygdala also interprets sensory information; for example, identifying the scent of food or the sound of a predator’s growl.

Researchers tend to consider these areas separately, and “the idea that emotions are not irrational, that they make up a very important part of decision-making, is relatively new” for neuroscience, Barbas says. By mapping the pathways that transmit information throughout the brain, she reveals that the regions for processing emotions and thoughts are inextricably linked—and sundering them “is detrimental to our well-being.”

Until the early 1970s, researchers considered the prefrontal cortex too functionally complex to understand through experimentation. They had found that in a subject under anesthesia, less functionally intricate areas of the brain responded to stimuli; for example, the neurons in the visual area of the brain fired in response to a light shined into the eye. But when the researchers tried to engage the prefrontal cortex, they found it unresponsive and dubbed it the “silent cortex.”

Today, neuroscientists like Barbas know this area is anything but silent. “The prefrontal cortex gets information and does something with it; it’s not just a receiver of information like the sensory areas,” she says. The meaning of the information is important to the prefrontal cortex, and processing it requires consciousness."

Link = The Hardwiring that Makes Us Human | The Brink | Boston University (bu.edu)

My conclusion is probably an increased number of neurons in the prefrontal cortex makes us "Human and capable of higher-level thoughts" and Apes just don't have the neuron counts to achieve consciousness within the prefrontal cortex and higher-level thought. This having something to do with 90 genes that control expression of neuron structure and proliferation with humans which act differently in primates during fetal development.

Ok, you are suggesting hat humans have bigger brains and therefore are capable of more than apes in the intelligence department.  What does this mean for Dolphins, Sperm whales  and Elephants all of which have bigger brains than humans. Elephant brains are 3 times as big as a human and a sperm whale is 6 times as big as a human. Does this mean they are even more advanced in their emotional behaviors and or higher level thoughts than we are?     

[Vmedvil]

Just now, Moontanman said:

Ok, you are suggesting hat humans have bigger brains and therefore are capable of more than apes in the intelligence department.  What does this mean for Dolphins, Sperm whales  and Elephants all of which have bigger brains than humans. Elephant brains are 3 times as big as a human and a sperm whale is 6 times as big as a human. Does this mean they are even more advanced in their emotional behaviors and or higher level thoughts than we are?     

I am uncertain, I was looking at the differences between the great apes and humans, I am uncertain about other animals and humans, I would need a genetic analysis of their brains versus humans to look at.

[Vmedvil]

2 minutes ago, Moontanman said:

Ok, you are suggesting hat humans have bigger brains and therefore are capable of more than apes in the intelligence department.  What does this mean for Dolphins, Sperm whales  and Elephants all of which have bigger brains than humans. Elephant brains are 3 times as big as a human and a sperm whale is 6 times as big as a human. Does this mean they are even more advanced in their emotional behaviors and or higher level thoughts than we are?     

But one article did suggest it had something to do with the neuron counts in the prefrontal cortex specifically.

[Moontanman]

Just now, Vmedvil said:

But one article did suggest it had something to do with the neuron counts in the prefrontal cortex specifically.

Yes, but for that to be significant in this case you would have to know the neuron counts in those animals as well as humans and other apes.   

[Vmedvil]

1 minute ago, Moontanman said:

Yes, but for that to be significant in this case you would have to know the neuron counts in those animals as well as humans and other apes.   

This is true.

[Shellyklew]

The real reason we are special and different from other species is that we experience not one but two evolutionary cycles. One is the same as other species which is our vessel or bodies also adapts and evolves along with our external environmental changes that come with time, as does every other living thing. For the same purposes as other species. It's to ensure the survival of that species. The second one is a little harder to explain but I'm going to give it a shot. Okay so when we are born are brains contain obviously not fully developed we can agree on that right. Just like other living things with brains all brains contain let's see if I can figure out a name for this state of mind I guess maybe we could call this, The first stage of our brains evolutionary cycle and I'll call it instinctual intellectual portion of the brain which lays the ground work for our basic knowledge for what we need to know and do to sustain ourselves for survival like the need for food, water, and ,shelter and the smarts for obtaining these things. This is the part of intelligence they found imbedded in our DNA so yes they were partially correct about that if we didn't already obtain these instinctual intellectual abilities we wouldn't know what to do when we came out of the womb. So now we are prepared for the would. The second stage of evolution begins upon our arrival. What's the first thing we do when we get here? I'll be back have to cook dinner there's more I can stop here if you want?

[Shellyklew]

On 2/23/2024 at 11:52 AM, Vmedvil said:

I am uncertain, I was looking at the differences between the great apes and humans, I am uncertain about other animals and humans, I would need a genetic analysis of their brains versus humans to look at.

Let me clarify something we did not evolve from a monkey ok now let's think about why we already know this to be true if we evolved from monkeys would not exist anymore if we were one of the same. Just because they look like us does not mean anything if you look at it from a genetic view there's no way we are the same however we are connected think about 

[Shellyklew]

Every Living thing on this planet stem from a single cell. What does that tell you.

[Shellyklew]

Have you ever been like outside or out for a walk in nature and all of a sudden you felt at peace and connected to all the life surrounding you. Because you are connected. Every Living thing is connected by the same life sustaining cells to which we share 99 percent . The remaining 1 percent is then divided by 2 this is where 1 is what we share with other species which is 98.5 percent. The remaining 1.5 percent of DNA is then divided again by 2 that is what we get from both our parents the fathers portion determines whether we are male or female the rest of the DNA is then mixes together to create a human being that resembles both it's parents with the same abilities to create more like them and so on.

[Shellyklew]

This is why people feel one with nature. Simply put

 

[Shellyklew]

On 10/1/2021 at 6:24 PM, atomsmasher said:

Here are a few American sitcom series that brought out something my parents encouraged me and my brother’s to watch.

They all had one thing in common----

 

Can you guess what that common element is/was?

(:-

Yeah they are human beings that possess great God like powers that they don't know they have. They also exist simply because they do and because they weren't given the choice to exist gives them the right to do so in the same way as other human beings do. Knowing your truth will open your eyes to real world around you then and only then you'll be able to see clearly everything that didn't make sense will make sense you will also realize you hold all the answers to all the questions you ever asked.Until then it is our job to protect our own kind until they are ready to know the truth and accept it. I have a feeling you know what I mean. The only way I can help you is to say the key where to start your journey self awareness is the key. You don't have to believe me and you probably think I'm crazy. That's only because you are not ready to face the truth my fellow beings I love you all.

[Moontanman]

On 1/5/2025 at 12:50 AM, Shellyklew said:

The real reason we are special and different from other species is that we experience not one but two evolutionary cycles. One is the same as other species which is our vessel or bodies also adapts and evolves along with our external environmental changes that come with time, as does every other living thing. For the same purposes as other species. It's to ensure the survival of that species. The second one is a little harder to explain but I'm going to give it a shot. Okay so when we are born are brains contain obviously not fully developed we can agree on that right. Just like other living things with brains all brains contain let's see if I can figure out a name for this state of mind I guess maybe we could call this, The first stage of our brains evolutionary cycle and I'll call it instinctual intellectual portion of the brain which lays the ground work for our basic knowledge for what we need to know and do to sustain ourselves for survival like the need for food, water, and ,shelter and the smarts for obtaining these things. This is the part of intelligence they found imbedded in our DNA so yes they were partially correct about that if we didn't already obtain these instinctual intellectual abilities we wouldn't know what to do when we came out of the womb. So now we are prepared for the would. The second stage of evolution begins upon our arrival. What's the first thing we do when we get here? I'll be back have to cook dinner there's more I can stop here if you want?

 

On 1/5/2025 at 3:02 AM, Shellyklew said:

Let me clarify something we did not evolve from a monkey ok now let's think about why we already know this to be true if we evolved from monkeys would not exist anymore if we were one of the same. Just because they look like us does not mean anything if you look at it from a genetic view there's no way we are the same however we are connected think about 

 

On 1/5/2025 at 3:05 AM, Shellyklew said:

Every Living thing on this planet stem from a single cell. What does that tell you.

 

On 1/5/2025 at 3:17 PM, Shellyklew said:

Have you ever been like outside or out for a walk in nature and all of a sudden you felt at peace and connected to all the life surrounding you. Because you are connected. Every Living thing is connected by the same life sustaining cells to which we share 99 percent . The remaining 1 percent is then divided by 2 this is where 1 is what we share with other species which is 98.5 percent. The remaining 1.5 percent of DNA is then divided again by 2 that is what we get from both our parents the fathers portion determines whether we are male or female the rest of the DNA is then mixes together to create a human being that resembles both it's parents with the same abilities to create more like them and so on.

 

On 1/5/2025 at 3:20 PM, Shellyklew said:

This is why people feel one with nature. Simply put

 

 

On 1/5/2025 at 3:39 PM, Shellyklew said:

Yeah they are human beings that possess great God like powers that they don't know they have. They also exist simply because they do and because they weren't given the choice to exist gives them the right to do so in the same way as other human beings do. Knowing your truth will open your eyes to real world around you then and only then you'll be able to see clearly everything that didn't make sense will make sense you will also realize you hold all the answers to all the questions you ever asked.Until then it is our job to protect our own kind until they are ready to know the truth and accept it. I have a feeling you know what I mean. The only way I can help you is to say the key where to start your journey self awareness is the key. You don't have to believe me and you probably think I'm crazy. That's only because you are not ready to face the truth my fellow beings I love you all.

You seem to think that you can claim anything, on this forum you need to to provide a citation for your claims, Please provide evidence of the claims you make or with draw them!