NoBigDeal Posted May 12, 2004 Report Posted May 12, 2004 I found it interesting that it can be very easy for a number of people-or maybe just one person, to come up with a religion. Try and guess which religion this came from "After you pass, your body is done, your soul shall move to the high heavens, on the tip of the universe, past everything known and unknown, sights seen and unseen, back into another world in which life would start over. Different times and different rules would make up of this new world, in which all deceased have traveled to." Well, sounds like a religion, no? Well, seeing as how I made it up as I went, and I am only 13, I find it troubling how easy this type of thing can be. So, I came here to ask people with brains...somewhat like mine, mostly larger, wider, but, what do you think? How easy IS it to create a religion? What religions do you think are made up, or do you think they ALL are? I'd like to know.... Josh
NoBigDeal Posted May 12, 2004 Author Report Posted May 12, 2004 wow, 15 views and no replies? Maybe I've come to the wrong sight....
GAHD Posted May 12, 2004 Report Posted May 12, 2004 LMAo, check the "what would it take to...." thread. We've creaated the Religion of the IPU. We actually discuss precisely this topic there.
Freethinker Posted May 13, 2004 Report Posted May 13, 2004 Originally posted by: GAHDLMAo, check the "what would it take to...." thread. We've creaated the Religion of the IPU. We actually discuss precisely this topic there. Created? The Great IPU has been around for an infinite time period of course. Or 1994 or so on alt.atheism. But like you said, Nobiggy, Please join us on the "how little will we sell our minds for", er... "What would it take to prove the existence of a God?" I think you'll fit right in.
sanctus Posted May 13, 2004 Report Posted May 13, 2004 Originally posted by: NoBigDealSo, I came here to ask people with brains...somewhat like mine, mostly larger, wider, but, what do you think? How easy IS it to create a religion? What religions do you think are made up, or do you think they ALL are? Well, I like your last question: YES I believe they are all made up! Why? Because it's the price we had to pay for our capacity of being aware of ourselves (I'm not sure if it's the right expression in english, I mean being conscient of ourselves, i.e. something like having an intelligence). Once intelligence came up the questioning about the meaning of life and so on came as well, the presence of intelligence implied that there was a big emptyness inside all the intelligent beings. So what did they do, they filled the emptyness, with culture, traditions, religions, rituals,... everything that took away the emptyness. There isn't meant to be any judgement there, I actually do not believe in any religion, but my life is full of culture (or what I define to be culture). That's the funny thing, we are still not able (at least I'm not) to accept the emptyness, if I wouldn't have anymore any kind of culture and tradition, then I could imagine that I would even start to believe in a religion (IRISHEYES, if you read this, then you see that the answer I gave you in the thread "what would it take to prove the existence of god" has to be corrected : No culture would maybe make me believe even in the god of the bible). Actually I see that there is a problem in my thinking, culture includes (but never equals) religion so not all of what I wrote above holds, but there are some ideas i like so i post it anyway.
Freethinker Posted May 13, 2004 Report Posted May 13, 2004 Before I start one of my extensively condensed replies :-) Should we move this to "what would it take..."? Or keep this a seperate discussion? It seems to parrallel the other discussion and would dilute each.
sanctus Posted May 14, 2004 Report Posted May 14, 2004 wherever you prefer, i keep up reading both threads.But i would like to hear your extensive answer.
sundog Posted May 15, 2004 Report Posted May 15, 2004 "How easy IS it to create a religion?" Well, your only 13, and off the top of your head you came up with a good start. I'm sure if you put your mind to it, you could come up with your own bible and teachings. So actually creating a basis for religion is not hard. It's more a question of peoples level of acceptance. If the teachings of a particular religion seem convincing and make sense, it may provide an answer, as sanctus says "to fill the emptiness." One may then accept those teachings to be true, and follow them. As for myself, I cannot accept a story (especially an ancient one that does not make sense to me) without some kind of proof. That's just my level of acceptance. Mankind is very diverse. Some will accept, others will question. For many situations it is our diversity which has kept our species alive. My knowledge of history is not that good, but as I understand it, thousands of years ago, the number of educated people were few among a population, so others may have looked up to them for knowledge and understanding. If a story were told by respected, educated people, it may have given it more credibility and acceptance. If one were to offer a NEW religion today, you will find some may accept it, some will question it, others will find it totally absurd. On the whole, I think it would be more difficult to get a following now, than when the bible was written. That's my take on it. sundog
Freethinker Posted May 19, 2004 Report Posted May 19, 2004 As I see it, way back in the old days, cave man type, or tree type based on the latest info I have seen, ... anyway... animals, in this case early human animals, often pick an Alpha Male/ Leader based on physical ability. The guy that was left standing after a battle for control. THis became the obvious leader of the community. As intellegence developed, some humans woould start to recognize patterns. This plant helped that, this could be sharpened as a tool/ weapon, sunrise, sunset, seasonal changes ... Add to this, supposed connections such as making it rain, calls to the various forces of nature/ gods. This would set upa 2nd contest for power. One based on intellect. The smarter animal/ human would recognize patterns/ connections and would be able to make up others. This would set up two seats of power, one physical one mental. Perhaps at times the brute and the brain would battle for control. The brute would surely win. The brain would figure out therefore that the best way to have a favored spot, be brought under the special protection of the brute would be to join forces. Suddenly a merger of church and state. This is reflected in all of recorded history. On rare occasions they may be the same person, but the vast majority of times, the brute and the brain were differrent members of the tribe. They worked together to maintain power. One by force, the other by spells and chants. When two tribes would battle, each with their own brute/brain combo, which ever would win, that brain's superstition would be brought to the front as he obviously had the better set of gods behind him. We can see this thru history. It still exists today. The appointed Resident of the US White House "KNOWS" his god is stronger than the infidel's Allah. Thus he "KNOWS" he is in the right and anything he does in his self proclaimed CRUSADE against the non-Christians is justified. But new religions are being started all the time. Joseph Smith found golden tablets left by Jesus in the US and started a religion. The Urantia was provided by divine inspiration even later. Wicca, while based on older Pagan concepts, is a new age version. Sun Myung Moon started the moonies. Maharishi Mahesh Yogi ... All it takes is some elaberate claims that can't be supported. Thus offering someone in need of a mental addiction any number of choices. This spread of SUCCESSFUL new religious beliefs has been fairly unique in the last 1600 years. Once Christianity had been given political authority by Constantine in 312CE, the opposition started to be slaughtered, just as the bible says it should. Ignorace was enforced as part of the tenets of Christianity, just as the bible says it should. Thus Christianity was the first religion to spread and take control anywhere near as fast and strong as it has. But Society/ HUmans/ started to reject the ignorace of antiquated superstition during the Enlightenment. Humans decided, OUTSIDE of the existing Christian dogma, that killing others was wrong. That thought was new. It was based on SECULAR tenets. Humanistic drive. Since it was no longer fashionable for most Christian authorities and political leaders of Christian countries to just kill the opposition willy nilly, other religions started to florish. Along with Atheism. Now non-belief is taking over the rest of the industrialized world. While new age "spirituality" is taking over the US. Starting a new religion in the US is simple. Just as nobigdeal originally posted. There is no longer the same level of direct physical threat. Though there is still, because of the extreme fundementalism of the Exec Office in the US, a strong governmental prejudice against anything that is not Christian Fundamentalism. So create a new religion, it's easy, any nonsense with a good poem behind it will find a sucker somewhere. But watch out for the Feds!
Freethinker Posted May 21, 2004 Report Posted May 21, 2004 And once more we see the results of the Christian mindset: Bible Argument Spurs Boiling-Oil ChargeEUGENE, Ore. - A woman is accused of pouring boiling oil on her boyfriend's face in an argument over a Bible verse.http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20040521/ap_on_fe_st/boiling_oil_bible&e=4
cookyman Posted May 26, 2004 Report Posted May 26, 2004 i reckon all a religion is is an idea that a group of people follow because if humanity had nothing to follow it would not work as we as a people need sumthin to follow and belive in
Freethinker Posted May 26, 2004 Report Posted May 26, 2004 Please show us PROOF that people NEED something to "believe in". People "believe in" in things when they don't have any valid reason to ACCEPT something as factual Show us why it is not BETTER for people to "accept things they can PROVE" instead of blindly follow something they merely BELIEVE IN.
cookyman Posted May 31, 2004 Report Posted May 31, 2004 all i was saying is that that is my opion on what a religion is. ok... i don't have any hard proof on that matter but it is just what i have observed. thats all. Cooky
Freethinker Posted June 1, 2004 Report Posted June 1, 2004 Religion is given way too much of a free ride. It is almost automatically assumed that religion is a GOOD thing, when it's historic and current reality shows quite the opposite. When challenged to actually show a positive value for religion, we find how horredeous it actually has been.
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