MSG - "Poisoning" chain letter meme

[Michaelangelica]

A well written comprehensive article on the MSG problem

AFPA Articles and Newsletters » MSG: Food For Though But Not For Eating

MSG: Food For Though But Not For Eating

. . .

One of the things that makes diagnosis of MSG sensitivity extremely difficult is the different reaction times experienced by different people. Some people eat MSG and react immediately. Some react as late as 48 hours after ingesting MSG.

A second consideration is the fact that reactions are dose related. Jeannette can not tolerate even the smallest amount of MSG without having a reaction. However, Pat tolerates small amounts, but reacts to MSG when she ingests four grams or more in any one meal.

How many people are sensitive to MSG? H. Schaumburg, writing in the late 60’s and early 70’s, estimated that approximately 30% of our population suffered adverse reactions when fed MSG in an ordinary diet at levels readily available on a given day.

 

Other independent researchers confirmed his observations.

[freeztar]

The last two times I've eaten asian food (chinese and Japanese), I had a reaction about 1 hour later. My ears turned red and hot. My face felt flush. Worst of all, my breathing was constricted. It felt as though I could not take in enough air. The symptoms continued all the way to bedtime.

 

So I think I may have MSG sensitivity, but I'm going to do a few more trials before I accept that. Japanese food is my favorite. :(

If I am allergic to it, then I guess I'll just have to deal with it because there's no way I could deprive myself of Japanese food. :)

[DougF]

A well written comprehensive article on the MSG problem

AFPA Articles and Newsletters » MSG: Food For Though But Not For Eating

Thanks for this link Michaelangelica,

I'm amazed that this is still in the food products we eat.

How many people are sensitive to MSG? H. Schaumburg' date=' writing in the late 60’s and early 70’s, estimated that approximately 30% of our population suffered adverse reactions when fed MSG in an ordinary diet at levels readily available on a given day.

[/quote']

But that’s not the half of it. Under FDA regulation' date=' hydrolyzed protein may be included in various products with no mention of the hydrolyzed protein. The information we have at this time tells us that broth, bouillon, stock, flavoring, natural flavoring, natural flavors, and a whole host of products called natural chicken flavoring, natural turkey flavoring, etc. contain MSG insinuated into the product through the use of some form of hydrolyzed protein. So MSG sensitive people who know about the hiding of MSG are afraid to eat any product that has “flavoring” or “natural flavoring” in it, for example, even though it might be MSG-free. As a result, the grocery shelf, the refrigerator, and the freezer case, contain very little that a sensitive person can be sure is free of MSG.

 

Further, the amount of MSG found in food today is growing. It is found in most soups, salad dressings, and processed meats; in some crackers, bread, canned tuna fish, most frozen entrees, ice cream, and frozen yogurt. Lately we’ve seen it included in the new “low fat” foods. That makes sense because if you remove the flavor provided by the fat, you have to put back the flavor, and that, some say, calls for MSG. [/quote']

MSG is used widely in food to enhance food’s flavor. You will find it' date=' in one form or another, in almost all processed or otherwise manufactured food. [b']Instead of making chicken soup with a whole chicken, use half a chicken and a little MSG;[/b] you get a big chicken taste and save some money. Unfortunately, about 30 per cent of our population experiences one or more adverse reactions, along with the savings and explosion of taste, when they use MSG.

We are putting less food and more additives in the things we eat,

This sounds like a movie have you seen the 1973 movie Soylent Green?

Soylent Green - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

.

.

.

.:cheer:

[Michaelangelica]

It is surprising

Even more surprising that they keep inventing new words for it.

 

"Soylent Green" sounds like my kind of movie.

[OldBill]

To paraphrase Henny Youngman: 'When I read about the evils of MSG, I gave up reading.'

[Michaelangelica]

No government, chemical or food company really wants to take the many adverse environmental health effects, we are constantly exposed to, seriously do they?

 

I've mentioned this before.

If it was cannabis or aspirin there would be a huge hue and cry

Rats subjected to monosodium glutamate (MSG) administration during the neonatal period present chronic neuroendocrine dysfunction associated with marked cognitive deficits.

ScienceDirect - Brain Research Bulletin : Deficit in hippocampal long-term potentiation in monosodium glutamate-treated rats

[Michaelangelica]

What is really going on here do you think

(Also check out "Depression (Clinical)" thread and magnesium supplements !?)

Piracetam - the original nootropic

Reducing dosage, or taking magnesium supplements (300-500mg/day), which reduce neural activity, will frequently alleviate such "overstimulation" effects. Persons consuming large amounts of MSG (monosodium glutamate) and/or aspartame in their diet should be cautious in using Piracetam, as should those who are highly sensitive to MSG-laden food (the "Chinese restaurant syndrome").

piracetam (smart drug) article by James South

 

 

They eat more or they don't?

Just say it!

This effect on meal time food selection replicates earlier observations made on elderly persons. It is suggested that manipulating palatability of various foods within a meal, and especially by using MSG, is an efficient way to affect food selection in the meal, without inducing hyperphagia.

Monosodium Glutamate Affects Mealtime Food Selection In Diabetic Patients

[Michaelangelica]

this was from avery interesting website with lots of good, detailed, long articles on health matters.

AFPA Articles and Newsletters » MSG: Food For Though But Not For Eating

. . .researchers have found a relationship between MSG and some of the dreaded neurodegenerative diseases such as ALS, Parkinsonism, Huntington’s disease, and Alzheimer’s disease, which all affect the elderly. Scientists used to think that in adults, brain cells were protected from invasion of MSG. Now, however, researchers realize that there are at least five areas in the brain that are not well protected.

 

What are the symptoms?

Symptoms of MSG are many and varied. In fact, so many different symptoms occur that people often question how one substance could cause such diverse reactions.

The answer lies in the fact that MSG is a neurotropic drug (a substance that effects the nervous system).

If you realize that valium, which is a popular neurotropic drug, may produce a wide variety of side effects, you should not be surprised that the same is true of MSG. MSG-sensitive people have reported numerous reactions, including

• simple skin rash,
  
• bloating, fatigue,
  
• joint pain,
  
• shortness or breath,
  
• chest pain,
  
• severe gastric distress,
  
• diarrhoea,
  
• asthma type symptoms,
  
• exercise induced asthma,
  
• headache, migraine headache,
  
• irregular heart beat, atrial fibrillation,
  
• rapid heart beat (called tachycardia),
  
• nausea and vomiting,
  
• anxiety attacks,
  
• depression, hyperactivity in children,
  
• mood swings,
  
• mouth lesions,
  
• flushing, and
  
• tremors.
  

. . .

 

Dosage

Some people eat MSG and react immediately.

Some react as late as 48 hours after ingesting MSG.

A second consideration is the fact that reactions are dose related.

Jeannette can not tolerate even the smallest amount of MSG without having a reaction.

However, Pat tolerates small amounts, but reacts to MSG when she ingests four grams or more in any one meal.

. . .

How many people are sensitive to MSG?

H. Schaumburg, writing in the late 60’s and early 70’s, estimated that approximately 30% of our population suffered adverse reactions when fed MSG in an ordinary diet at levels readily available on a given day.

 

Other independent researchers confirmed his observations.

Those studies were followed by studies sponsored by the glutamate industry which purported to demonstrate that no more than 1-2% of the population might be sensitive to MSG.

Those industry- sponsored studies were methodologically inadequate, statistically unsound, and came to conclusions which did not follow from the results of the studies.

Unfortunately, the amount of MSG readily available in food has grown to such proportions that we would now expect more than 30% of the population to suffer adverse reactions to MSG at levels readily available in an ordinary diet.

. . .

If you are concerned about MSG sensitivity, or would like to help the Truth in Labeling Campaign, (a nonprofit corporation), write Jack Samuels, Truth in Labeling Campaign, P.O. Box 2532, Darien, IL 60561. A stamped, self-addressed envelope would be appreciated.

[Michaelangelica]

Red Clover Blocks Neurological Damage From MSG

Red Clover Blocks Neurological Damage From MSG

The photo at the link is actually a chive flower

(I wish I could start a herb-editing business)

here is better or google it

It is acommon weed

[mynah]

Here is an interesting explanation I've read:

 

MSG sensitivity has also been called "Chinese restaurant syndrome" - although it does not occur (or rarely occurs) in China. Apparently the stuff is most potent when taken on an empty stomach. In Chinese foods, it is mostly used in soup, which is traditionally served first in the West, but in between other food in china.

 

I've seen someone apparently (though briefly) at death's door after a Chinese meal, and have experienced the symptoms myself (though never in the East). Solution: Read the labels, and if you have to have something with MSG, eat some additive-free food first.

[Michaelangelica]

Here is an interesting explanation I've read:

 

MSG sensitivity has also been called "Chinese restaurant syndrome" - although it does not occur (or rarely occurs) in China. Apparently the stuff is most potent when taken on an empty stomach. In Chinese foods, it is mostly used in soup, which is traditionally served first in the West, but in between other food in china.

 

I've seen someone apparently (though briefly) at death's door after a Chinese meal, and have experienced the symptoms myself (though never in the East). Solution: Read the labels, and if you have to have something with MSG, eat some additive-free food first.

almost everthing has MSG in it now

 

The only really bad reaction I have had is in a japanese restaurant where MSG was continuously shaken on the BBQd food

I had heat palpitations, extreme agitation,- abit like taking amphetamine.

I could not sleep for 24 hours and then collapsed into an incoherent mess for another 24 hours..

 

Here is one japanese version of "don't give me MSG or I will die" ( below)

[Michaelangelica]

The Slow Poisoning of America - MSG

 

Between MSG and High Fructose Corn Syrup, the majority of americans are poisoning themselves on a daily basis. These two ingrediants are in nearly everything and with prolonged exposure can do some MAJOR damage to your body.

 

I have another article on my blog about HFCS (high fructose corn syrup) you may feel inclined to read. I’m sure you’ve seen the commercials about corn syrup if you live in the US that goes on about how safe it is.

 

She states, What? That it’s made of corn? What she doesn’t say is corn syrup itself is so broken down in the process that it has to be rebuilt by man, and is therefore no longer a natural substance. In fact it’s closer to being a plastic then it is corn. Talk about a major attempt to brainwash the unsuspecting consumer! ~Kat

The Slow Poisoning of America - MSG Kat’s Musings

[chriswhite]

 

Its really hard to find any unbiased info on the topic. Does anyone know anything definitive?

 

Cheers,

Buffy

 

I spent some time researching this. i too found very little unbiased data.

However i came to the conclusion that these "exitotoxins" like MSG and ASPARTAME are very bad news and can have extreamly severe neurological effects.

 

see the movie "sweet misery" online too

[chriswhite]

The thing that shocked me was that the idea that is wasnt dangerous was based on the idea that there would be no iteration between the blood-brain barrier, and there are several common reasons that a blood-brain barrier would be porous.

[Michaelangelica]

My blood -brain barrier has been compromised since I was 12. last week fixed by surgery. was this the problem?

 

It would be very difficult to design an experiment to show my type of reaction to MSG

 

If you took a random sample of 10,000 people maybe one or two might have a reaction. this would not be statistically significant. Only to the two affected ( With a peanut allergy one could be dead -still not statistically significant)

 

You could ask people who thought they had an allergy, do cognitive and physiological tests before and after MSG

Again, poor research design which may be howled down by the scientific community

 

You could feed rats MSG to find LD50 and find MSG was extremely safe.

 

How could research be designed? I would love to do some.

 

here is some work that has been done

The monosodium glutamate symptom complex: assessment in a double-blind, placebo-controlled, randomized study.

BACKGROUND: Considerable debate swirls about the validity of symptoms described by many people after ingestion of monosodium glutamate (MSG), and the question has remained unresolved largely because of a paucity of well-designed challenge studies.

. . .

METHODS: We conducted oral challenge studies in self-identified MSG-sensitive subjects to determine whether they had a statistically significant difference in the incidence of their specific symptoms after ingestion of MSG compared with placebo.

. . .

Rechallenge revealed an apparent threshold dose for reactivity of 2.5 gm MSG.

. . ..

The mechanism of the reaction remains unknown, but symptom characteristics do not support an IgE-mediated mechanism. According to Food and Drug Administration recommendations, the symptoms, originally called the Chinese restaurant syndrome, are better referred to as the MSG symptom complex.

The monosodium glutamate symptom complex: assessme...[J Allergy Clin Immunol. 1997] - PubMed Result

Probably the best paper I could find without doing a Ph.D..

So, as i found in my case, reaction is dose dependant. Does this build up or does it have to be given in one hit? Does the health of the subject at the time effect/affect this?

 

I don't know how strictly medical studies like this help

Stimulation of the parabrachial nuclei with monosodium glutamate increases arterial pressure.

. . .

glutamate injections within this area led to decreases in mean arterial pressure

Stimulation of the parabrachial nuclei with monosodium glutamate increases arterial pressure.

Activity increase associated with obesity induced by monosodium glutamate in mice

Activity increase associated with obesity induced by monosodium glutamate in mice -- Araujo and Mayer 225 (4): 764 -- AJP - Legacy

The induction of obesity in rodents by means of monosodium glutamate

CJO - Abstract - The induction of obesity in rodents by means of monosodium glutamate

Brain Lesions, Obesity, and Other Disturbances in Mice Treated with Monosodium Glutamate

In newborn mice subcutaneous injectionis of monosodium glutamate induced acute neuronal necrosis in several regions of developing brain including the hypothanamus

Brain Lesions, Obesity, and Other Disturbances in Mice Treated with Monosodium Glutamate -- Olney 164 (3880): 719 -- Science

there are a lot of studies on this topic

The Safety Evaluation of Monosodium Glutamate1

. . .

The conclusions of a subsequent review by the Federation of American Societies for Experimental Biology (FASEB) and the Federal Drug Administration (FDA) did not discount the existence of a sensitive subpopulation but otherwise concurred with the safety evaluation of JECFA and the SCF.

The Safety Evaluation of Monosodium Glutamate -- Walker and Lupien 130 (4): 1049 -- Journal of Nutrition

i.e.,

MSG is safe; except for. . ?

Monosodium Glutamate induces Convulsive Disorders in Rats

 

H. N. BHAGAVAN*, D. B. COURSIN* & C. N. STEWART†

 

*Research Institute, St Joseph Hospital, Lancaster, Pennsylvania 17604

†Department of Psychology, Franklin and Marshall College, Lancaster, Pennsylvania 17604

 

THE physiological and pharmacological effects of L-glutamate have received much attention since its implication in the aetiology of the "Chinese restaurant syndrome"1−3. Although an excess of L-glutamic acid (GA) as the monosodium salt (MSG) was known to cause retinopathy in experimental animals4−7, brain lesions have been noticed only recently8−10.

There seems to be no agreement about its pharmacological and neurophysiological effects in humans11 and experimental animals12

.

Monosodium Glutamate induces Convulsive Disorders in Rats

Monosodium Glutamate Effects

 

John W. Olney, Norma Jean Adamo, and Albert Ratner

 

No abstract or summary view of this item is available. To view the full-text version, follow this link.

 

Article topics:

 

* Physiology..Rats

* Physiology..Rodentia

* Neuroscience..Glutamate

* Physiology..Mice

* Medicine..Pediatric and Congenital Heart Disease

* Endocrinology..Ovaries

* Physiology..Ovary

* Medicine..Necrosis

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/content/citation/172/3980/294

Does anyone have access to this article?

 

Locomotor and learning deficits in adult rats exposed to monosodium-Image -glutamate during early life

The results indicate that exposure to MSG in early life in rats could lead to subtle behavioral aberrations in late adulthood.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T0G-401HH9T-H&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=abdc700dfa22432bbe5b2f3576ed69b8

So that's what is wrong with me (

 

77 articles here mostly on brain lesions as they are something that can be easily scientifically controlled and measured.

Unlike all that messy human behavioural stuff.

http://www.sciencemag.org/cgi/search?session_query_ref=rbs.queryref_1226545271682&COLLECTIONS=hw1&JC=sci&FULLTEXT=(Monosodium+AND+glutamate)&FULLTEXTFIELD=lemcontent&RESOURCETYPE=HWCIT&ABSTRACTFIELD=lemhwcompabstract&TITLEFIELD=lemhwcomptitle

[Michaelangelica]

A whole web-site for people who have problems with MSG!

Front Porch Productions asks if migraines, fibromyalgia, or stomach problems are caused by MSG (monosodium glutamate) or aspartame.

 

Is this the book Buffy was talking about when she started this thread?

 

This page had some intersting comments and observations about St John's Wort (Hypericum perforatum)

Battling the MSG Myth: St. John's Wort and Glutamate

[Buffy]

Is this the book Buffy was talking about when she started this thread?

 

I looked at a bunch of sites at the time, and I think this may have been one of them. What really sparked the thread was that my step-dad was an inveterate forwarder of chain-letter memes like this one, and it was fuzzy enough that it was not fodder for Snopes or other debunking methods.

 

All of these outside-the-mainstream health issues really should have more attention paid to them, mainly because their "truthiness" is so hard to pin down.

 

I've always been skeptical of the vaccine-autism link claim, but I can tell you that I am indeed allergic to Aspartame and Acesulfame-K: they both raise my heart rate and the latter actually gives me headaches.

 

Since there's no real commercial benefit from investigating this stuff, they're all ongoing mysteries that could be much worse than anyone imagines.

 

So when someone says government programs are all evil, ask them how any potential health dangers will ever be discovered....

 

He defers to economic interests over the public health, to executive agencies over the Congress, and to secrecy over the public's right-to-know... He's always tweaking the facts to the benefit of insiders, ;)

Buffy