Freedom?

[hallenrm]

Is any body really ever free/independent?:Glasses:

[Tormod]

From what? :Glasses:

[ughaibu]

To what?

[Tormod]

What watt? Light bulb light bulb. :Glasses:

[Boerseun]

Is any body really ever free/independent?:Glasses:

No. Although we try.

[Lord Illidan]

I don't think so. While living in society, one is never technically free/independent. Now, if one was living alone, away from society, and self sufficient, then, yes, he would be free and independent. But in a society, one has not only to think for oneself, but also for others.

[InfiniteNow]

Freedom has an infinite number of interpretations. Tell me first what freedom means to you, and I will tell you if it is or is not possible (IMO).

[Drip Curl Magic]

yes, there are many ways that one can interpret "freedom"

 

I believe that living within a society of any other equally conscious beings as yourself.... there is always some sort of social wall. Social barriers that are, for the most park, not broken. Our brain develops all of these filters (especially with spoken language) And rather than just saying what comes naturally, we unknowingly second guess everything that comes out of our mouths. Every sentance is carefully composed in a fashion that will hopfully please others around that are causing the social pressures.

 

We can't escape the social barriers that we put up. But we can temporarily relieve the pressure (kind of like cracking your knuckles or neck) But it always comes back.

 

In that sense, we are not entirely free. Ya dig?

 

But there are many other aspects to freedom.

 

Lots of african countries are going through some messed up genocide bull. There are people out there.... afraid to do anything. Constantly fearful of attack and death.

 

And if we look at it in that sense.... we, here at the science forums... have MUCH more freedom to do as we please. We don't have to live in constant fear. We have luxurys.... like computers with internet access.

 

See, there are many many different ways to go about debating freedom..... it just depends what specific aspect of living you want to discuss.

 

Wow, I'm tired. I don't even know if any of what I just rambled about will turn out to be relevant.

 

I need sleep.

[Lord Illidan]

yes, there are many ways that one can interpret "freedom"

 

I believe that living within a society of any other equally conscious beings as yourself.... there is always some sort of social wall. Social barriers that are, for the most park, not broken. Our brain develops all of these filters (especially with spoken language) And rather than just saying what comes naturally, we unknowingly second guess everything that comes out of our mouths. Every sentance is carefully composed in a fashion that will hopfully please others around that are causing the social pressures.

 

We can't escape the social barriers that we put up. But we can temporarily relieve the pressure (kind of like cracking your knuckles or neck) But it always comes back.

 

In that sense, we are not entirely free. Ya dig?

 

But there are many other aspects to freedom.

 

Lots of african countries are going through some messed up genocide bull. There are people out there.... afraid to do anything. Constantly fearful of attack and death.

 

And if we look at it in that sense.... we, here at the science forums... have MUCH more freedom to do as we please. We don't have to live in constant fear. We have luxurys.... like computers with internet access.

 

See, there are many many different ways to go about debating freedom..... it just depends what specific aspect of living you want to discuss.

 

Wow, I'm tired. I don't even know if any of what I just rambled about will turn out to be relevant.

 

I need sleep.

 

Even in these forums, we are not completely free. I can't start saying obscenities and the like.

 

Look at China. They aren't even free to look at pictures of Tianmen Square as it was in the revolts (in google images). A censored nation.

 

This rises a new question: Do laws remove our freedom and should they be removed? Would this create an anarchy?

[InfiniteNow]

So you see freedom as something given, not something achieved?

[Boerseun]

Even in these forums, we are not completely free. I can't start saying obscenities and the like.

'Course you can!

 

Sum idjit Admin will just have to ban you, but it won't stop you, now will it?

 

And that's what people never keep in mind when they claim their 'freedoms'. You can do what you damn well please, but you have to live with the consequenses.

[Drip Curl Magic]

Even in these forums, we are not completely free. I can't start saying obscenities and the like.

 

Look at China. They aren't even free to look at pictures of Tianmen Square as it was in the revolts (in google images). A censored nation.

 

The point I was trying to get at with my last post was this-

 

Freedom is all perception... just like anything else in life. Life is what you make of it. Bring an ethiopian kid over to the US and give him food, shelter, clothing, and if that wasn't enough.... give him access to education... computers.... any kind of technology. I'm pretty sure the kid would perceive it all as heavenly freedom. The point is.... be thankful for what freedom you have. It may seem like very little... But it's more than what a good portion of the world has. We are living the dream, my friend. Carpe Deim. Who cares if you don't have COMPLETE freedom. What is complete freedom? I can't even comprehend it. Can you?

 

On one hand.... you could argue that death is complete freedom... because you no longer have to deal with the ever changing array of conflicting human emotion.

 

On the other hand.... you could just as easily argue that Life is complete freedom because you get to be a conscious being... and you can control this collection of atoms and make your body do whatever you want.

 

Who really knows, man?

 

Life is what you make of it.

 

Questions like these don't really have any answers. It just all depends on how you look at the situation.

 

This rises a new question: Do laws remove our freedom and should they be removed? Would this create an anarchy?

 

Laws and anarchy are part of nature's balance. You can't have a positive energy without negative energy. The conflicting energys feed off of eachother.

 

As long as there are beings as intelligent as humans roaming the earth, there will be people enforcing rules... and people breaking rules.

 

It's all about co-existance. If you think hard enough about ANYTHING on earth.... you can figure out exactly where it fits in the balance. Life is a teetering see saw.... the opposite energys are constantly battleing eachother.... but none over wins..... because if that were to happen.... it would be the end of life itself.

 

Balance and cycle, my friend. Balance and cycle. Nothing we can do about it but kick back and enjoy the ride.

 

That's just how I perceive the whole situation.

[Lord Illidan]

So you see freedom as something given, not something achieved?

 

While there are authorities among us which have power over us, yes, then freedom is something given.

[Drip Curl Magic]

While there are authorities among us which have power over us, yes, then freedom is something given.

 

 

That brings up darwin's thoery of evolution- survival of the fittest.

 

No matter what... there is always some sort of power or rule.

 

Right now... the fittest are the government officials.

 

thousands and thousands of years ago.... the fittest were the creatures with the biggest muscles (which is the same as the governments weapons).

 

We are still a bay to the laws of nature.... no matter how advanced we get.

 

 

I don't think so. While living in society, one is never technically free/independent. Now, if one was living alone, away from society, and self sufficient, then, yes, he would be free and independent. But in a society, one has not only to think for oneself, but also for others.

 

 

I mean... even if you were to escape from HUMAN society... you wouldn't really have absolute freedom.... Because you'd still have a society of animals to deal with.

 

And you could argue that you could go onto some deserted island and be top dog... and not be ****ed with by any of the animals... due to your knowledge with tools and weaponry.... but you can't forget natural disasters.

 

No matter what.... nature is always top dog.

 

ya dig?

[Queso]

i'm free when i'm naked.

I'm free when i'm climbing on rocks

[Drip Curl Magic]

i'm free when i'm naked.

I'm free when i'm climbing on rocks

 

 

As free as a conscious being can be.

 

And that is beautiful.

[Queso]

thank you for calling my naked self beautiful,

maybe Boerseuns right about you.