Sociopathy

[Panjandrum]

What is the basis of sociopathy? It's described as a 'Personality Disorder', but doesnt that just mean no-one knows for sure what causes it? Is it treatable? Are there well-documanted differences between the brain of a sociopath and that of a neurotypical?

[InfiniteNow]

Hello Panjandrum,

 

Welcome to the site. Are you studying psychology or sociology? These are interesting fields indeed, especially when you start examining the "-opathys." Either way, you might learn a bunch about your questions at the following:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociopathy

 

 

See you around.

 

 

Cheers. :eek2:

[infamous]

Welcome to Hypography Panjandrum; Along with the link that InfiniteNow gave you, I think the following might also shed some light on the subject.........enjoy.

 

http://www.drirene.com/doc.htm

[Panjandrum]

I am not so much studying sociopathy, but rather its evolutionary and social role. I am tending towards the view that sociopathy is an adaption that is essential to human success. sociopaths are free to act without regard for convention, with a clarity of vision impossible for a neurotypical to achieve or even comprehend. They allow human socities to survive and flourish by embracing change and exploiting new opportunities. I have also heard that they are the primary reason why modern humans spread so uckly and so completely across the earth.

 

Similarly, I belive schizophrenics fill a valuable role as a source of 'religious' and spiritual insights, useful for giving neurotypicals motivation and a sense of purpose.

 

I further believe that the evolution of social models, and particularly represntative governments, are an attempt by neurotypicals to escape from the natural dominance of sociopaths. It is analogous to the battle of the sexes, with genes and social adaption becoming intertwined.

[TheFaithfulStone]

I further believe that the evolution of social models, and particularly represntative governments, are an attempt by neurotypicals to escape from the natural dominance of sociopaths. It is analogous to the battle of the sexes, with genes and social adaption becoming intertwined.

 

Interesting idea. To quote me some Arthur C. Clarke - (although I'm not sure it's his concept) - "Anyone who wants the job of president should be immediately disqualified from it."

 

I'm not particularly sure that what we define as "sociopaths" are such great choices for leaders - Think of how some "great war heroes" are utterly dysfunctional outside the realm of breaking things and killing people. (U.S Grant, Patton, spring to mind.) But it doesn't strike me as at all odd that we would assign mental illness to the exceptional.

 

Witness the growth of Ritalin prescriptions in the U.S. The symptoms of ADD? Not being able to pay attention for long periods of time, not having a well developed sense of social propriety, and hyperactivity. Hmm... in other words - being a child and not an industrial automaton. (Not that there aren't people with a legitimate disorder, I know some, but ADD is overdiagnosed and Ritalin is overprescribed. Medicate the creativity out of your children!)

 

As for the idea that schizophrenics are a source of religious insight - Have you seen The Last Temptation of Christ. Willem Dafoe as a crazy Jesus... good flick.

 

But on the other hand, there really are people who are sick. I don't think that mental disorders are solely something invented by society to oppress people. But your idea that sociopaths and other "crazies" are a beneficial evolutionary adaptation is intriguing. What make you think they are the primary reason for human population growth?

 

TFS

[Panjandrum]

Oh, I agree entierly that therte are people who are sick. Mental disorders are real phenomena, all those Anti-Psych people are fooling themselves.

 

Let me just clarify something, tho. Just as there exists a spectrum of disorder for sz and autism, so there exists one for sociopathy. The mindless killers are the extreme end, psychopathy. Most sociopaths live completely undetected within society.

 

As to why I think they are responsible for the speed of human exppansion, I was envisoning the natural conflicts between sociopathic leaders, that would tend to be resolved by one of them taking his followers and moving on. This would act as a huge pressure for population dispersal.

[Michaelangelica]

Central to understanding individuals diagnosed with antisocial personality disorder is that they appear to experience a limited range of human emotions, however this should be regarded critical due to current lack of exploring emotional response in detail even in animals. This can explain the lack of empathy for the suffering of others, since they cannot experience emotion associated with either empathy or sufferinghttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sociopath

 

Originally Posted by Panjandrum

 

I am a very open minded person. I dont mind admitting when I am wrong, and Im always open to new arguaments. I am free from many of the preconceptions and biases that aflict otherwise intelligent people, since my reasoning is uninhibited by such things as emotion, compassion and guilt. My vision is clear, my opinions formed through reason alone.

This sound more like a computer than a human. (Dr. Spock maybe) I can't believe you can do this!?

 

Panjandrum

Do you think you are a sociopath?

[Panjandrum]

I thought that was pretty clear, but Ill spell it out for you if you want. Yes, I'm a sociopath. Dont worry, Ivnt killed anyone. Yet. :thumbs_do

[Michaelangelica]

I'm not convinced

Have you explored other possibilities?

eg Aspergers syndrome, (which probably most males suffer from to a degree.)

or disorders in that spectrum.

Does it worry you?

Do you feel you are missing something?

michael

[Panjandrum]

Michael, yes Ive considered other possibilities, and no they dont apply to me. I certainly dont have aspergers :thumbs_do

 

Also, Im female.

 

No, it doesnt worry me. I dont get worried. As for something missing, yes I do 'feel' that. It doesnt bother me, tho.

 

Racoon, Im hardly a terrorist. They are motivated by zealotry, which I am immune to. its strange how many people think it must suck to have no emotions, but I think Im better off without them. They just make people weak.

[Michaelangelica]

Michael, yes Ive considered other possibilities, and no they dont apply to me. I certainly dont have aspergers :evil:

As for something missing, yes I do 'feel' that.

Racoon, Im hardly a terrorist. They are motivated by zealotry, which I am immune to. .

I still don't buy it.

You worry me though.

 

What benefit is there in giving yourself a label like "sociopath"?

What purpose does it serve?

(Would you preferred we have this conversation in private?)

A full blown clinical sociopath is in need of help from a psychologist, psychiatrist or orthomolecular specialist. My choice would be an orthomolecular psychiatrist or psycholigist.

 

You are very intellectual, logical person. You don't suffer fools gladly. (Don't they make you angry?) You are concerned with important philosophical issues like morality, society and its constraints. You like dogs and dope. You are engaged with societies' intellectual issues and with this group and make valuable contibutions to it and therfore to society. Clear thinking is always welcome.

Just because you can be cold, clear, precise and analytical - this does not make you a sociopath.

 

(One gentler definition of socipaths says they)" tend to embrace a particular and often limited belief system to the exclusion of others. They have no doubts. Typically these belief systems have an internal logic. Actions based on the belief system often produces the desired and predicted outcomes. Their views do not stand up to criticism when alternative understandings are used. Views applicable to some activities in society may be given universal relevance and applied to activities where they are clearly inappropriate. These views or their application should not be acceptable to society but society frequently identifies uncritically with their logic and fails to challenge them.

 

Sociopathic individuals are extremely self-confidant, intelligent, charismatic and persuasive of others as well as themselves. They inspire those around them and create a dysfunctional culture, - often dizzy and disoriented by its success. Success is proof of the accuracy of any claim they make. Words and sometimes bizarre ideas become a substitute for reality. They surround themselves by supporters who worship them and believe they can do no wrong. These loyalties persist even when their world collapses around them. The community admires them. The system of justice seldom pursues them."

from

http://www.uow.edu.au/arts/sts/bmartin/dissent/documents/health/sociopathy.html

 

If you are a sociopath I might be one too. :thumbs_do

Just a bit more scatterbarained.

Michael

[Michaelangelica]

Well, I feel sorry for those around you,

.

Racoon that is not a helpful post.:thumbs_do

 

Confucius, K'ung-fu-tzu, says

"First; get the name right"

Don't believe everthing you read.:evil:

[Michaelangelica]

List of Common Sociopathic Traits

"Egocentricity; Callousness; Impulsivity; Conscience defect; Exaggerated sexuality; Excessive boasting; Risk taking; Inability to resist temptation; Antagonistic, deprecating attitude toward the opposite sex;"

From

http://faculty.ncwc.edu/toconnor/428/428lect16.htm

 

Sounds more like Racoon than Panjandrum?:shrug:

[Panjandrum]

You worry me though.

 

How sweet. Why?

 

What benefit is there in giving yourself a label like "sociopath"?

What purpose does it serve?

(Would you preferred we have this conversation in private?)

 

The purpose it serves is to clarify in my own mind what it is that makes me diffrent. I spent my youth not understanding why I am the way I am. I find it useful to understand my condition. Technically, its APD, but that makes me think of violent youths hanging around street corners, so I prefer sociopath.

 

Just because you can be cold, clear, precise and analytical - this does not make you a sociopath.

 

(One gentler definition of socipaths says they) [snip]

 

That definition sounds more like BPD. They believe thier own lies, I dont.

 

If you are a sociopath I might be one too. :surprise:

Just a bit more scatterbarained.

Michael

 

Dont worry, youd know if you were. For one thing, the thought wouldnt worry you. ;)

[Michaelangelica]

Glad to hear from you.

I can go to bed now

I worry about your depression. You call it boredom ;)

 

IS APD

Affective personality disorder?

 

This might be of interest

Martha Farah: The thing is that the parts of the brain that most people think of as critical for empathy – responsible behaviour, remorse after having done something bad – which are the ventromedial parts of prefrontal cortex – sort of the crossroads of prefrontal cortex, which is typically thought of as the seat of higher cognition, conscience – and the limbic system which you are mentioning, which is evolutionarily a much older system that's involved in emotions, strong feelings, acts of passion and so forth.

 

And some very interesting research by Antonio Damasio appears to indicate that if that region is damaged, you develop something that Damasio has called 'acquired sociopathy'. But even so, those people in fact tend not to go out and get arrested. They may act a little funny or give peculiar answers on experimental tests of 'what would you do in this situation?', or put them in a little gambling game and they do kind of crazy, risky reckless things. So they certainly have some impairment of judgement but in fact they don't just turn into ruthless murderers and heartless criminals. I think it's just another reminder of the fact that there is just a lot we don't understand about the brain bases of moral, responsible behaviour at this point...

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/science/mind/stories/s1423329.htm

(not much else on site)

 

and this

 

The Panjandrum Foundation provides funding to charitable organizations within New Hampshire that are committed to protecting the environment, ending human rights abuses and supporting women's issues.

http://www.panjandrum.org/

 

and Racoon is a sociopath too!

Who would have thought it. :surprise:

 

Goodnight

m

[Panjandrum]

IS APD

Affective personality disorder?

 

No. Antisocial.

 

The Panjandrum Foundation provides funding to charitable organizations within New Hampshire that are committed to protecting the environment, ending human rights abuses and supporting women's issues.

http://www.panjandrum.org/

 

Thats priceless. Some people are just too dumb to live.

[HydrogenBond]

Is there any reason for all these new designer disorders? Are we as a culture producing more defective children due to all the drugs taken from the 1960's-1980's, or we over diagnosing to create jobs and sell drugs, or is this a symptom of a major defect in culture, that is causing the new and improved range of restless disorders?