Interesting Connections

[arkain101]

I have been doing a little 'work' of sorts and found some really interesting connections.

 

The mandelbrot set (figure) is strikingly familiar with the Phi spiral or golden ratio. When we spiral outwardly from the horizontal axis both in top and bottom sides of the axis.

 

(Mind you I did a poor job of tracing these lines)

 

 

Also, The Aether Physics Model,

- http://peswiki.com/index.php/Paper:A_New_Foundation_for_Physics%2C_by_Quantum_Aether_Dynamics_Institute#Charge_Geometry

 

Contains these Phi characteristics and describes the shape of such things like an electron from our time perspective as having this shape.

 

 

This shape happens to be of a Phi ratio, and is identical to the general main shape of mandelbrot set figure.

 

The Phi section of the Qunatum Aether Physics Model is located here;

 

http://peswiki.com/index.php/Paper:A_New_Foundation_for_Physics%2C_by_Quantum_Aether_Dynamics_Institute#g-factors

[UncleAl]

You are missing some pieces, and the curves do not superpose where they overlap. The Mandelbrot set has an infinitely fuzzy edge. In science we have a technical term for this kind of correspondence: "wrong."

 

Given any two irrational numbers 'x' and 'y' it is always possible to find integers j, k, m, n such that |(j)(x^m) - (k)(y^n)| < epsilon, where "epsilon" is arbitrarily small. One should not be impressed by such a relationship since one could find an arbitrarily large number of relationships as good or better by picking any other irrational number, like the Napierian base 'e', Euler's constant gamma, the Golden Ratio, any irrational square root, etc.

[Mercedes Benzene]

Come on UncleAl.

He's saying there is a connection! ... Not that the mandelbrot sets are actually proven by the golden ratio!

I'm not saying arkain right, but you certainly have no right to say arkain is "wrong".

 

Since you are not God/the creator of the golden ratio/master of the universe, you really have no right to flat-out say that arkain is wrong.

 

Why don't you try to have an open mind... considering that is the basis for scientific reasoning...

I'm trying not to be rude, but come up with a definite proof that there is no relationship between the golden ratio and the mandelbrot sets.

 

HE IS MERELY SUGGESTING THAT HE FOUND A STRANGE PARALLELISM BETWEEN THE TWO.

[Turtle]

Come on UncleAl.

He's saying there is a connection! ...I'm trying not to be rude, but come up with a definite proof that there is no relationship between the golden ratio and the mandelbrot sets.

 

HE IS MERELY SUGGESTING THAT HE FOUND A STRANGE PARALLELISM BETWEEN THE TWO.

 

Uhh...Unky Al is (as usual;) ) correct on this one Benzy. Furthermore, what he stated IS the proof. The similarity is completely arbitrary inasmuch as it ignores the gaps (non-correspondence) & extends the spiral into an "interior" that doesn't exist.

[Mercedes Benzene]

I see that UncleAl makes some excellent points, but the name of the thread is "Interesting Connections", and they are interesting connections.

As mentioned perviously, I'm not saying arkain is correct, I'm simply saying that uncleAl was shooting down something when an interesting observation was made. No hard feelings or anything... just trying to explain myself.

[arkain101]

What is kind of funny, but unrelated is that if you turn that 'tracing image' to the counter-clockwise (To how the shape is supposed to be posistioned -it was an accident to upload it in a vertical posistion-), the intersection of the as is above is below spirals, draws that symbol for Jesus.. The fish or whatever... lol,

 

Not sure where that symbol originated but it showed up anyway.

 

I have some more connections between these two that I am working on.

 

If you look at the change in size of the fuzzy pertrusions they increase in size by a visible a ratio. What value that ratio is I am not sure, and is what I wanted to look into.

 

If we percieve these smaller pertrusions as further away we can visualize a spiraling like shape if we could see it 3 dimensionally.

 

The thing is with the mandelbrot set is that this particualr image that appears is blank. It only expells details from its 'constant' like self, the origin of these details.

 

Is the ratio of the geometry of this shape quantized? or possibly accurate to phi?

 

Just some thoughts. I couldnt help but see some logical connections.

 

Uncle Al, I understand how a person can make connections (of no sense) between different things that contain sense. I connected these with a logical sense and is the only reason I found it ot be some kind of connection.

 

The logical sense is that they are all a visual perspective looking into time. Time coming at you. You cant see past it directly or behind it. It appears as a representation of time spiraling into existence. Except, we (our concsiousnes as we are awake) are in some kind of fixed posistion of this spiraling like 'geometry'.

 

I agree it is very undefined and backed up and flat out sketchy.

 

Although I am by no means scared to be bold and will put a little enthusiasm and effort into things.

[Turtle]

What is kind of funny, but unrelated is that if you turn that 'tracing image' to the counter-clockwise (To how the shape is supposed to be posistioned -it was an accident to upload it in a vertical posistion-), the intersection of the as is above is below spirals, draws that symbol for Jesus.. The fish or whatever... lol,

 

Not sure where that symbol originated but it showed up anyway.

 

...

I agree it is very undefined and backed up and flat out sketchy.

 

Although I am by no means scared to be bold and will put a little enthusiasm and effort into things.

 

The shape you reference is the Vesica Piscis & so sad you had to only relate it to Hayzeuss:

http://hypography.com/forums/physics-mathematics/1902-vesica-piscis-real-sacred-geometry.html

...As mentioned perviously, I'm not saying arkain is correct, I'm simply saying that uncleAl was shooting down something when an interesting observation was made. No hard feelings or anything... just trying to explain myself.

 

We rely on Uncle Al for just that.;) Personally I expected an "illucid" from him & a link to mazepath & that sacred yoga position he developed.:love: :cup:

For more on the set & its math see this Hypography thread:

http://hypography.com/forums/physics-mathematics/5980-fractal-explorations.html?highlight=fractal

:)

[arkain101]

You are missing some pieces, and the curves do not superpose where they overlap.

 

I agree, The curves do not meet (superpose?) at the correct curve angle to form a smooth joint. Is that what you were refering to al?

 

Or do you mean they do now originate from the same center point?

 

The three particualar 'elements' of sorts were so familiar I had to make note of it. I'd be glad to hear an equally logical argument to the logical claim I may appear to make.

 

Al must use alot of energy when he gets fired up enough to respond to 'outrageous' ideas.

 

Every idea that has ever came to be was always called outrageious even you need to agree to that.

 

The world is outrageous. The elite group of the science community is a group that is based off of fundamentals theory that was at one time considered outrageous ideas.

 

Yet still this elite group, that slaps the wrist of those who hold parts of the puzzle that may or may not fit, continues to become emotionally involved in the original beginning of the quest of humanity.

 

 

I Thought I would freestyle a live wise quote on this,

 

He who has not revised their own action in the history of their own life should not so aburptly revise another persons actions.

 

It is when he who has considered themselves in the judgements they begin to apply to others that the judgement is made balanced and of less emotional intensity and overall less un-needed emotional conflict.

 

Not one, and I say one, can act onto another with complete confidence that someone would have NEVER acted upon them in the same manner some point in their life of some particular event they were involved in.

 

But none the less UNC AL surely guides us to facts time and time again I am thankful for his message but it is the character that gets in the way of his information sometimes.

[Qfwfq]

I would replace the words 'wrong' and 'right' with 'meaningless' and 'meaningful'. Of course, there is the matter of how one defines the 'frontier' of that shape, but the visual evidence does suggest a shape and perhaps some criterion could be found. :naughty:

[Farsight]

Hmmn. This connection sounds like one of those my wife reads out to me from the newspaper. It's called a Horoscope. :cup:

[UncleAl]

Proximity is not causality. As correctly exposed by Turtle, all the fancy stuff drawn in the interior is matched to a null subset of the Mandlebrot set.

 

One cycle of a sine curve can be arbitrarily well fit by an arithmetic polynomial. How well do things correspond outside that interval? Economics is the same pack of lies writ large. Economics can interpolate 200 years of US economic data with arbitrary precision in any and all venues. However, economics is not predictve. If it were, economiics would be the domain of unlimited personal wealth rather than job searches.

 

Black, Merton, and Scholes formulated a zero-risk investment strategy. The two survivors got a Nobel Prize/Economics for it, 1997. In 1994 they formed a hedge fund investment company THAT COULD NOT LOSE, Long Term Capital Management. In 1998 it tanked, losing $4.6 billion in less than four months.

 

Perhaps the Nobel Prize was premature. Don't bet your life on economic theory. Heteroskedasticity (that tiny excess between the curve and the data) will kill you.

[Qfwfq]

Proximity is not causality. As correctly exposed by Turtle, all the fancy stuff drawn in the interior is matched to a null subset of the Mandlebrot set.

Likewise, all of the "trajectories" that particle physicists believe they "see" in bubble chambers would be but a pure myth. In a sense, perhaps they are, too.

 

Heteroskedasticity (that tiny excess between the curve and the data) will kill you.

Likewise, all of experimental physics' "results" would be but a pure myth. In a sense, perhaps they are, too, and maybe they're even killing someone.

 

:confused:

[arkain101]

old thread, new stuff..

 

 

Approximate and true golden spirals. The green spiral is made from quarter-circles tangent to the interior of each square, while the red spiral is a Golden Spiral, a special type of logarithmic spiral. Overlapping portions appear yellow. The length of the side of a larger square to the next smaller square is in the golden ratio.

 

 

I noticed the simularity of the Phi ratio spiral (golden spiral) and quarter circles, so I went and made some animations of these full circles in rotation. Some nifty results.

 

Spinning Golden Circles

 

Twin spins

 

Left hand spin

 

Right hand spin