Is atheism a religion

[C1ay]

Regardless, unlike the way the pope speaks for all catholics, Dr. Dawkins is but one human being, and tasking him to speak for an entire group of people is, while well intentioned, an inaccurate method of representation.

 

And it's true that he does speak for some atheists because in a way some of them do have a belief that there absolutely is not a god as opposed to simply lacking belief in a god. I would still not categorize this as a belief system per se...

[Pyrotex]

And it's true that he does speak for some atheists because in a way some of them do have a belief that there absolutely is not a god as opposed to simply lacking belief in a god. I would still not categorize this as a belief system per se...

So, what exactly IS a 'belief system'? And is a 'belief system' necessarily a religion?

 

In its broadest interpretation, I would say a 'belief system' is a body of statements that a person accepts as describing or representing Reality or some aspect of or object within Reality. This body of statements could be about any subject under the sun: deities, morality, philosophy, physics, chemistry, woodworking, the Girl Scouts, BMWs, native women of Tahiti, etc.

 

I have a belief system about automobiles, specifically, BMWs, which I believe are the finest cars in the world. My BMW belief system concerns quality, value, performance, luxury, comfort, safety and reliability. But it has nothing to do with religion. You cannot equate my belief system about automobiles with religion.

 

Likewise, you cannot equate my belief systems about physics and Tahiti women with religion.

 

Now, I have a Total Belief System, which describes ALL the belief systems which I have, and ALL the things I do NOT believe in. My Total Belief System includes a belief system concerning Evolution and another concerning Morality. But it does NOT contain any belief or acceptance of deities--there is no "god" in my Total Belief System.

 

You may have a belief system concerning god. Fine. I would say that therefore you have a "religion" since religions are typically concerned with worshiping, praying to, and obeying the wishes of one or more gods.

 

But I don't have that one. I have no religion.

[Lancaster]

What if, by stating "belief system," Dawkins means that Atheist's system of belief is one of non belief?

[Pyrotex]

What if, by stating "belief system," Dawkins means that Atheist's system of belief is one of non belief?

Fine. But there must be seven ways of interpreting your question and as many for his statement.

 

This whole controversy relies on the fact that the word 'belief' or 'believe' has so many subtly different meanings. You start a sentence using one definition of 'belief' and end the sentence on another one. All you have done is crafted a non-humorus "pun" that has no more significance than a pun.

 

To "believe" has different meanings than to "believe in". Both have their meanings shift according to context and subject.

 

"I believe in AlkaSeltzer." is a valid thing to say. It merely means I trust AlkaSeltzer will make my stomach feel better. No one would suggest that AlkaSeltzer is my religion. Or that I worship AlkaSeltzer.

 

Likewise, I believe (in) the barbarian invasion theory for the collapse of the Roman Empire. Here it means, "have chosen after due research".

 

I believe in the Constitution of the United States. Here I am stating my loyalty, but not my religion.

 

I believe I'll have another drink. Here, I am suggesting that I have decided to take an impulsive action.

 

"I believe in Love." The lyrics to many songs, suggesting that Love is something worth pursuing, or that Love is "real".

 

"Belief" can mean doubt, choice, faith, knowledge, opinion, trust, selection, impulse, idea, thought, dogma, religion or just a passing thought.

 

To insist that someone else's use of the word 'belief' or 'believe' gives you the authority to mandate their religion or a state of blind faith is somewhat arrogant, and totally unworthy of an intelligent conversation.

[C1ay]

So, what exactly IS a 'belief system'? And is a 'belief system' necessarily a religion?

 

IMO, no. From the Oxford English Dictionary:

 

religion • noun

1 the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.

2 a particular system of faith and worship.

3 a pursuit or interest followed with devotion.

 

No matter how bad theists want to argue that atheism is a religion I don't see any of the accepted definitions that fit. For me it simply boils down to this, for lack of any explanation of why or how we came to be the concept of a God was created. There is absolutely no evidence to support such a belief and refusing to accept it as fact without supporting evidence is just common sense, not religion.

[Lancaster]

IMO, no. From the Oxford English Dictionary:

 

 

 

No matter how bad theists want to argue that atheism is a religion I don't see any of the accepted definitions that fit. For me it simply boils down to this, for lack of any explanation of why or how we came to be the concept of a God was created. There is absolutely no evidence to support such a belief and refusing to accept it as fact without supporting evidence is just common sense, not religion.

 

I agree,.

 

Also: why does it matter? So what if it is or is not a religion?

[imaplanck.]

Originally Posted by C1ay

IMO, no. From the Oxford English Dictionary:

 

 

 

No matter how bad theists want to argue that atheism is a religion I don't see any of the accepted definitions that fit. For me it simply boils down to this, for lack of any explanation of why or how we came to be the concept of a God was created. There is absolutely no evidence to support such a belief and refusing to accept it as fact without supporting evidence is just common sense, not religion.

 

 

Way to hit the nail on the head!:Glasses:

 

 

Of course, the mentally ill always see others as the ones with the illness.

[ughaibu]

In any case, Dawkins' remark, "they're just people who hold a different belief system", makes no specification of the belief system held by any atheist, so doesn't impact the definition. The only implication is that atheists hold belief systems that are atheistic.

[imaplanck.]

There is no "belief "whatsoever. show atleast a quantity of indirect evidence for your god, and an atheist will lend merit to your claim.

[ughaibu]

Imaplanck: As mentioned by Pyrotex, all people hold a set of (mainly) consistent beliefs, "all people" includes atheists, but that an atheist's belief set is atheistic does not imply that the atheist holds any belief concerning gods.

[imaplanck.]

No(im sorry, but)you are wrong. Even that statement is open to debate, and proof to this athiest, anything you can demonstrate and hold up against testing will be granted consideration.

[ughaibu]

In that case, debate my above statement. What's your objection?

[imaplanck.]

I thought I just did?:)

 

 

 

There is no "belief set" in a proper athiest. There shouldn't even be a belief in the evidential; just an acutely probable conclusion drawn from said evidence ,at the very most.

[ughaibu]

So you hold no belief, as to whether you are right or wrong, in this present conversation.

[imaplanck.]

Indeed! Convince me I am wrong, and I will change my personal conclusion of being extremely probably right.:)

[ughaibu]

"Extremely probably right" about what?

[imaplanck.]

"Extremely probably right" about what?

 

My stream of letters arranged into sentences, preceding your post.