Best President

[Spiked Blood]

Who in your opinion was the best US president of the last 40 years. What makes them the best? What policies did they install that are still beneficial today? Who did you admire? Conversely, who do you think was the worst? Who did more damage than good? Who whom?

 

Who thinks this picture is hilarious?

 

My apologies if this topic has been done to death, offends anyone, is dumb, causes you to sneeze, all of the above.

[alexander]

lol, i voted clinton, from what i can remember, and i can only remember in my lifetime bush sr. clinton and bush jr, i would have to say that clinton had made the most advances to better US relations with the rest of the world, made lots of efforts to wipe out al quaeda before it got to be the biggest terrorist organization in the world, had a good foreign policy, and could actually spealk!

 

the others i cant jusdge as well as i was not alive when they were around :xparty:

[HydrogenBond]

Ronald Reagan was way up there. He was called the great communicator because of his acting training and his ability to give A+ speeches. If he needed something and Congress was draggging its feet, he would take it to the people with an effective prime time speech. The American people would take matters in their own hands and lobby their foot dragging reps. He was also tough with respect to National defense and was able to end the Cold War. The wousy stuff of the world today is nothing in comparision to the tension that existed between super powers during the cold war. The change was like getting rid of the biker gang and replacing it with annoying kids that you can no longer treats as adults. N Korea and Iran may get the bomb, but that is chicken stratch to the Soviet Union that had 1000's of bombs that reach anywhere in the world.

 

On the negative side, Regan's trickle down economics didn't pan out because capitalism uses greed to maximizes allocation of resources. The trickle down fron the top stopped at about the upper middle and never fully reached the middle-bottom. The union busting took away job security but was necessary to make US more competitive in the lower cost international labor markets that were beginning to expand. Losing jobs overseas, meant American jobs, but jobs overseas it the best defense against poverty and tin horn dictators.

 

When Reagan came to office in 1981, he inherited interest rates at 20% and high unemployment from Jimmy Carter. He turned that around to a time of prosperity in a few years. This increased the national debt due to high military spending but brought an end to the cold war. Today the debt is back down and the world is far less threatened by nuclear extinction.

[Freddy]

Ronald Reagan was way up there. He was called the great communicator because of his acting training and his ability to give A+ speeches. If he needed something and Congress was draggging its feet, he would take it to the people with an effective prime time speech. The American people would take matters in their own hands and lobby their foot dragging reps. He was also tough with respect to National defense and was able to end the Cold War. The wousy stuff of the world today is nothing in comparision to the tension that existed between super powers during the cold war. The change was like getting rid of the biker gang and replacing it with annoying kids that you can no longer treats as adults. N Korea and Iran may get the bomb, but that is chicken stratch to the Soviet Union that had 1000's of bombs that reach anywhere in the world.

 

On the negative side, Regan's trickle down economics didn't pan out because capitalism uses greed to maximizes allocation of resources. The trickle down fron the top stopped at about the upper middle and never fully reached the middle-bottom. The union busting took away job security but was necessary to make US more competitive in the lower cost international labor markets that were beginning to expand. Losing jobs overseas, meant American jobs, but jobs overseas it the best defense against poverty and tin horn dictators.

 

When Reagan came to office in 1981, he inherited interest rates at 20% and high unemployment from Jimmy Carter. He turned that around to a time of prosperity in a few years. This increased the national debt due to high military spending but brought an end to the cold war. Today the debt is back down and the world is far less threatened by nuclear extinction.

 

The debt is back down? When George Bush took office the National Debt was about $6 trillion which is now $8.55 trillion which is hardly down and is increasing at $1.63 billion per day.

 

Reagan had the largest buget deficits in history until that time and increased the debt from under $1 trillion in 1981 to about $3 trillion in 8 years by 1989. George H. W. Bush increased it to about $4.5 trillion in 4 years by 1993. Clinton increased it to about $5.8 trillion in 8 years by 2001. George Bush has increased the debt to $ 8.55 trillion in less than 6 years with no end in sight.

 

Congress also deserves blame as it passes the budget and the President signs it into law.

 

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

http://www.cedarcomm.com/~stevelm1/usdebt.htm

[CraigD]

The total US national debt is a complicated datum, but, as a reflection of the Budget that the President authors, is a common one used to compare Presidents.

 

One of the factors that makes the debt complicated is that, as the real value of the dollar, the currency in which the debt is held, decreases due to inflation, the debt effectively decreases. With that in mind, I performed some simple calculations using the debt and the US CPI – perhaps not the best statistic for this analysis, but well known by most readers, and hopefully sufficient for this discussion, to produce the following table (with President in the poll added in the right margin)

Year  Debt            Increase  Debt in 2000 $  Increase
2012 16159487013300.35   0.105 12025339946803.46   0.079
2011 14622644937576.90   0.078 11146611147634.98   0.041
2010 13561623030891.79   0.139 10707526299493.66   0.120
2009 11909829003511.75   0.188  9561177409812.23   0.192  Obama
2008 10024724896912.49   0.113  8017917451223.09   0.072  
2007  9007653372262.48   0.059  7482479067552.34   0.030
2006  8506973899215.23   0.072  7302596737013.27   0.044
2005  7932709661723.50   0.075  6994432174852.98   0.040
2004  7379052696330.32   0.088  6726695999513.40   0.060
2003  6783231062743.62   0.089  6348219505458.97   0.065
2002  6228235965597.16   0.072  5961657772517.13   0.056
2001  5807463412200.06   0.023  5646782606328.91  -0.005  W.Bush
2000  5674178209886.86   0.003  5674178209886.86  -0.029
1999  5656270901615.43   0.024  5846397654610.91   0.001
1998  5526193008897.62   0.021  5838100835166.69   0.005
1997  5413146011397.34   0.036  5807749178583.31   0.013
1996  5224810939135.73   0.050  5734304931288.54   0.020
1995  4973982900709.39   0.060  5620209025604.70   0.031
1994  4692749910013.32   0.064  5452709409610.62   0.037
1993  4411488883139.38   0.085  5257151457969.56   0.054  Clinton
1992  4064620655521.66   0.109  4988793135287.45   0.077
1991  3665303351697.03   0.134  4634105999722.68   0.088
1990  3233313451777.25   0.132  4259958503412.72   0.074
1989  2857430960187.32   0.098  3968142026969.81   0.048  H.W.Bush
1988  2602337712041.16   0.107  3788018208059.91   0.063
1987  2350276890953.00   0.106  3562655639279.11   0.067
1986  2125302616658.42   0.092  3339207213399.45   0.072
1985  1945941616459.88   0.170  3114229984706.24   0.130
1984  1662966000000.00   0.179  2756138067372.47   0.130
1983  1410702000000.00   0.178  2438984783132.53   0.142
1982  1197073000000.00   0.164  2136124047668.39   0.096
1981  1028729000000.00   0.106  1948813353135.31   0.002  Regan
1980   930210000000.00   0.101  1943958276699.03  -0.030
1979   845116000000.00   0.071  2004531338842.98  -0.038
1978   789207000000.00   0.098  2084377996932.52   0.020
1977   718943000000.00   0.100  2042937039603.96   0.033  Carter
1976   653544000000.00   0.133  1977860752196.84   0.072
1975   576649000000.00   0.170  1845705535315.99   0.073
1974   492665000000.00   0.048  1720829878296.15  -0.056  Ford
1973   469898039554.70   0.046  1822442396651.34  -0.015
1972   449298066119.00   0.059  1850936052289.28   0.026
1971   424130961959.95   0.090  1803342016037.12   0.044
1970   389158403690.26   0.057  1727141162769.66  -0.000
1969   368225581254.41   0.028  1727750547466.20  -0.025  Nixon
1968   358028625002.91   0.039  1771624403031.64  -0.003
1967   344663009745.18   0.047  1776975158027.54   0.015
1966   329319249366.68   0.026  1750270825337.73  -0.002
1965   320904110042.04   0.009  1754275801563.15  -0.007
1964   317940472718.38   0.028  1766108045229.19   0.015
1963   309346845059.17   0.019  1740834206509.45   0.006  Johnson
1962   303470080489.27   0.025  1730382379478.55   0.014
1961   296168761214.92   0.021  1705694337164.19   0.010
1960   290216815241.68  -0.002  1688355931912.75  -0.019
1959   290797771717.63   0.028  1720803308927.01   0.021
1958   282922423583.87   0.029  1685786897617.38   0.001
1957   274897784290.72  -0.006  1684604927219.29  -0.038
1956   276627527996.11  -0.015  1751296335328.31  -0.029
1955   280768553188.96   0.007  1804042718624.59   0.011
1954   278749814391.33   0.048  1784413309969.78   0.040
1953   266071061638.57   0.027  1716008869444.26   0.019
1952   259105178785.43   0.015  1683694784409.47  -0.004
1951   255221976814.93  -0.008  1690354784905.04  -0.081
1950   257357352351.04   0.018  1838877015553.90   0.005
1949   252770359860.33   0.002  1828867897812.98   0.015
1948   252292246512.99  -0.023  1802685678404.02  -0.096
1947   258286383108.67  -0.041  1994480500955.74  -0.162
1946   269422099173.26   0.042  2379204383468.48  -0.039
1945   258682187409.93   0.287  2474726259555.00   0.258
1944   201003387221.13   0.470  1966635413606.74   0.445
1943   136696090329.90   0.887  1360639696809.76   0.778
1942    72422445116.22   0.479   765100923252.34   0.334
1941    48961443535.71   0.139   573548338561.17   0.085
1940    42967531037.68   0.063   528500631763.46   0.055
1939    40439532411.11   0.088   500984710877.20   0.104
1938    37164740315.45   0.020   453884275341.88   0.042
1937    36424613732.29   0.078   435577672548.63   0.041
1936    33778543493.73   0.177   418465121555.42   0.160
1935    28700892624.53   0.061   360751365689.35   0.038
1934    27053141414.48   0.200   347653056087.57   0.164
1933    22538672560.15   0.157   298550724219.83   0.219
1932    19487002444.13   0.160   244938819042.28   0.287
1931    16801281491.71   0.038   190340833741.61   0.140
1930    16185309831.43  -0.044   166892835507.32  -0.021
1929    16931088484.10  -0.038   170499031401.29  -0.038
1928    17604293201.43  -0.049   177278321010.89  -0.032
1927    18511906931.85  -0.058   183204044463.48  -0.041
1926    19643216315.19  -0.043   191105189235.92  -0.053
1925    20516193887.90  -0.035   201879347856.94  -0.057
1924    21250812989.49  -0.049   213999415016.97  -0.049
1923    22349707365.36  -0.027   225065474170.47  -0.044
1922    22963381708.31  -0.042   235374662510.18   0.020
1921    23977450552.54  -0.076   230665753360.19   0.032
1920    25952456406.16  -0.053   223450649657.04  -0.180
1919    27390970113.12   0.877   272643066675.10   0.638
1918    14592161414.00   1.552   166408622217.93   1.163
1917     5717770279.52   0.584    76921878291.67   0.349
1916     3609244262.16   0.180    57019436875.59   0.094
1915     3058136873.16   0.050    52139719758.23   0.040
1914     2912499269.16  -0.001    50153237414.94  -0.011
1913     2916204913.66   0.017    50724291528.51   0.017
1912     2868373874.16   0.037    49892321326.30   0.037
1911     2765600606.69   0.043    48104689340.61   0.043
1910     2652665838.04   0.005    46140308819.24   0.005
1909     2639546241.04   0.005    45912107344.15   0.005
1908     2626806271.54   0.069    45690509086.79   0.069
1907     2457188061.54   0.051    42740180221.94   0.051
1906     2337161839.04   0.027    40652451382.09   0.027
1905     2274615063.84   0.005    39564516564.97   0.005
1904     2264003585.14   0.028    39379941147.59   0.028
1903     2202464781.89   0.020    38309538933.48   0.020
1902     2158610445.89   0.007    37546739270.94   0.007
1901     2143326933.89   0.003    37280898789.48   0.003

(sources: http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/NPGateway, http://web.archive.org/web/20060902224928/http://www.toptips.com/debt_history.htm, ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/special.requests/cpi/cpiai.txt)

 

Note: Dept for 9/30, or closest day if no data exists for that day, of each year

 

In inflation-adjusted dollars, clear distinctions between the last 9 Presidents are apparent:

• Johnson (1963-69) inherited a 0.6%/year rate of debt (increasing), leaving it at -2.5% (decreasing). Under him, the debt decreased by 0.8%
  
• Nixon (69-74) inherited -2.5%, left -5.6%. Under him, debt decreased 0.4%
  
• Ford (74-77) inherited -5.6%, left +3.3% (increasing). Debt increased 18.7%
  
• Carter (77-81) inherited +3.3%, left +0.2%. Debt decreased 4.6%
  
• Regan (81-89) inherited +0.2%, left +4.8%. Debt increased 103.6%
  
• H.W.Bush (89-93) inherited +4.8%, left +5.4%. Debt increased 32.5%
  
• Clinton (93-2001) inherited +5.4%, left -0.5% (decreasing). Debt increased 7.4%
  
• H.Bush (2001-2008) inherited -0.5%, left +19.2% (increasing), Debt increased 69.3%.
  
• Obama (2009-2012) inherited 19.2%. Currently, it’s 7.9%, and debt has increased 25.8%
  

A quick analysis presents the following fictional awards:

Best debt-reducer: Carter, -4.6%

Worse debt-reducer: Regan, +103.6%

Most improved: Clinton, from +5.4% to -0.5%

Most improved (so far): Obama, from 19.2% to 7.9%

Most worsened: H.Bush, from -0.5 to 19.2%

[InfiniteNow]

Where's the choice for William Henry Harrison? :hyper:

 

 

Thanks for the clarity above Craig.

[TheFaithfulStone]

That's forty years of mighty slim pickins.

 

And who the hell voted for Johnson?!

 

TFS

[Freddy]

That's forty years of mighty slim pickins.

 

And who the hell voted for Johnson?!

TFS

 

Johnson received many sympathy votes due to JFK's assassination. He was able to portray Goldwater as a promilitary nut who was a danger to world peace and would get us into a war. Shortly, after winning the 1964 election Johnson began an escalation in bombing and Operation Rolling Thunder in March 1965 along with the introduction of the first US combat troops to Vietnam. Some peacemaker! Over 58k Americans died for what? Then again, Johnson managed to get Congress to pass social and civil rights legislation so he was not all bad. Guns and butter, LBJ should have learned you cannot have it both ways.

[TheFaithfulStone]

I know a couple of Vietnam vets, both of whom invariably refer to him as "That Lyin' sonnofaBitch Johnson"

 

Instructive, I thought.

 

TFS

[Igby]

Heh, I thought this would be a Colbert Report type question - W.: Great President, or The Greatest President. :hihi:

 

I voted Clinton, although the only president I can remember clearly is the current one. And he's, all things considered, pretty crap. I'm voting for Clinton simply because of his handling of the Israel/Palestinian conflict. He may not have succeeded, but I really respect his fervour.

 

If Kennedy hadn't been assassinated, the Vietnam war wouldn't have been such an enormous catastro****. Johnson was too keen to win and too convinced he could.

[TheFaithfulStone]

catastro****.

 

:hihi: Learn something new every day.

 

TFS

[eric l]

I'm not an American, so I preferred not to vote in this poll. But among the presidents listed, I might well have voted for Johnson, not because of his Vietnam record, but because of his role in the race to the moon.

I know that it was Kennedy who launched the chalenge, but NASA was very much Jonhson's work. That is why Houston became the Space Center, and that is also why the space program was hoodwinked as soon as Johnson was no longer in office.

And I do think that the space program meant as much or more for the progress of science and technology than any war could have done, and with much less suffering.

[Freddy]

Heh, I thought this would be a Colbert Report type question - W.: Great President, or The Greatest President.

 

I voted Clinton, although the only president I can remember clearly is the current one. And he's, all things considered, pretty crap. I'm voting for Clinton simply because of his handling of the Israel/Palestinian conflict. He may not have succeeded, but I really respect his fervour.

 

If Kennedy hadn't been assassinated, the Vietnam war wouldn't have been such an enormous catastro****. Johnson was too keen to win and too convinced he could.

Perhaps, as some think he was assassinated because he was not going to escalate the US advisors' role into US ground troops. However, Kennedy was a "cold warrior", witness "The Bay of Pigs fiasco", "The Cuban Missile Crisis", and the "Assassination coup of the Diem Brothers". If I had to bet money on it I would bet on your interpretation.

[jackson33]

i find it interesting that so many relate success to the National Debt issue, when no one has mentioned how or why we have such the high debt we do have. in short you can blame Mr. Johnson, the War on Poverty and the efforts to increase spending toward what ever the intended end was. simply placed in order, there is no other element in US national spending policy with greater increases than social programs, bar none. ironically Mr. Clinton was given a Republican Congress and along with a mandate (so called) from a 93 election to curb these programs and did exactly that. there is no need to go into the business cycle which generated the tech boom, systems put into place by Reagan, which are on going to this day, to maintain a 20 year economic boom.

 

if a national debt, is really bad, lets look at Japan. their debt represents 130% of their annual GDP. the European Union and that of the US are about the same with 65% of both with each having about a 13 trillion dollar GDP. the entire world GDP is no more than 65 trillion. there are lots of people being ignored, whom are attempting nothing to put a lid on world terrorist or their activities. if you owe 40k, for your house and all debt, to compare with the US debt, which is deemed so terrible you need a 60k annual income. since the US has a 70%+ ownership of their homes, i suggest not many are doing as well as the US government, on this issue.

[CraigD]

i find it interesting that so many relate success to the National Debt issue, when no one has mentioned how or why we have such the high debt we do have. in short you can blame Mr. Johnson, …

Can you support these and the other claims in your post with evidence?

 

Note that US financial data, and to a lesser extent that of other nations, is very well documented and made available to the public, so claims such as those you make, if true, should not be difficult to support.

 

Although unsupported claims are commonplace in persuasive political speech and writing, they are not permitted in discussions of history.

[HappytheStripper]

What happened to the choice for Abraham Lincoln or John Adams or Thomas Jefferson.. or wow the list goes on..

[CraigD]

What happened to the choice for Abraham Lincoln :naughty: or John Adams or Thomas Jefferson.. or wow the list goes on..

The pool was only for US presidents in the last 40 years.

 

It’s usually so difficult to compare leaders separated by long time periods that such comparisons are somewhat meaningless. Personally, I think that the Republic changed so profoundly in the early 20th century, particularly following the ratification of the 16th Amendment authorizing federal income tax (1913), and changes in military policies following WW I (1918), that comparisons of presidents on different sides of this period are like comparing apples and oranges.