Saddam Husseins Hanging. Your Opinion?

[Freddy]

If we truly seek sovereignty for the Iraqi people we should accept their decision on the matter. That is unless we want to make Iraq the 51st state of the union 'just kidding ofcourse'.................Infy

Well said! Iraq hanged 30 this week for crimes much lower in scale than Saddam's mass murders. The Iraqis have spoken.

[InfiniteNow]

I can see why we put vicious dogs down and dont take the chance that they could maim another.

Because we're too lazy and too absent to spend time and effort rehabilitating the dog, giving it the guidance an instruction it needs to be part of the family. Kinda amazing how well that translates into global politics and education, if I do say so myself.

[Tormod]

For those arguing that it is up to the Iraqi people to determine Saddam's fate: Would you still hold this position if he (for whatever reason) was found not guilty and set free?

 

Who said it is not up to the Iraqi people? I am arguing against the death penalty, which is the topic here, not against the trial.

 

Edit: I misread your question, sorry.

[C1ay]

For those arguing that it is up to the Iraqi people to determine Saddam's fate: Would you still hold this position if he (for whatever reason) was found not guilty and set free?

 

Sure. What would be the point in turning Iraq back over to the Iraqi's if all we're going to do is regulate their actions? Perhaps some folks are forgetting that the invasion and conquest is over, Iraq was handed back to the Iraqi people which in turn asked us to remain in the interim to help with their security. That should now be the limit of our own actions, to honor and support their decisions in running their own country.

[Tormod]

That should now be the limit of our own actions, to honor and support their decisions in running their own country.

 

I think it is important to allow open criticism of any society. The Iraqi government is choosing the death penalty, which IMHO is the weakest choice they could make. It is the *obvious* choice. It will not solve any of Iraq's problems.

[Boerseun]

"Saddam killed our people - and that's wrong! So let's kill him!"

 

er...:D

[Cedars]

Because we're too lazy and too absent to spend time and effort rehabilitating the dog, giving it the guidance an instruction it needs to be part of the family. Kinda amazing how well that translates into global politics and education, if I do say so myself.

 

 

As someone who has worked with ALOT of dogs, primarily German shepards and pit bulls to a lesser extent, I have to assume (by the above statement) you havent spent much time around vicious dogs.

 

For this example, Saddam, he was given rehab. 12 years worth of sanctions, monitoring, removal of sanctions to allow aid to the people. He fought every step taken by the people who were sent there to insure his compliance. He blamed the sanctions for the deaths of babies while building multiple palaces for himself. He drained the marshes of southern Iraq and caused the deaths of large numbers of marsh arabs while being monitored. The list of his sociopath/psycopath behaviors is long, even after 'rehab' began.

 

He is an alpha male who has enjoyed, even felt driven to cause the removal/attack/death of that which he considers a challenge to his alpha position.

 

He is a serial killer.

He is a mass murderer.

 

And there only one cure for that.

[Boerseun]

He is a serial killer.

He is a mass murderer.

 

And there only one cure for that.

Yeah - incarceration.

[Cedars]

Yeah - incarceration.

 

Nope! He still remains a psychopath/sociopath capable of victimising others including prison staff.

 

Besides, have you looked into the chances of escape of prisoners in Iraq?

[infamous]

This debate has been split into two issues. On the one hand, we have the issue of capital punishment and on the other, the sovereigny of the Iraqi people to govern themselves as they see fit. As has been pointed out, the issue here is about capital punishment and not the sovereignty of Iraq. I mistakenly fell into this trap myself in my first post and Tormod correctly pointed it out. To set the record straight; I am against capital punishment, therefore I would not like to see Saddam put to death. Nevertheless, I am also for the Iraqi people demonstrating their sovereignty which in the long term is the only strength which will loosen the ties which bind American forces to the region. This mistake is one many of us make when we stray from the issue before us. Once again, I'm reminded that to get anywhere with these issues, we all need to stay on track, myself included...............................Infy

[Boerseun]

Besides, have you looked into the chances of escape of prisoners in Iraq?

So we should execute people because the jails aren't escape-proof? How about spending some bucks on upping the quality of the jails?

 

Sorry - that last post of yours don't hold any water at all.

[Cedars]

So we should execute people because the jails aren't escape-proof? How about spending some bucks on upping the quality of the jails?

 

Sorry - that last post of yours don't hold any water at all.

 

Holds alot of water dude.

 

I would guess that you wouldnt want your family living next to a prison that cant guarentee this particular criminal wont escape but you have no problem suggesting this idealism when you dont personally have to deal with the possiblity of the consenquences.

 

And nowhere did I say kill all the criminals because they might escape. I only pointed out the fact that you cannot guarentee this extremely dangerous prisoners incarceration.

[Boerseun]

Holds alot of water dude.

 

I would guess that you wouldnt want your family living next to a prison that cant guarentee this particular criminal wont escape but you have no problem suggesting this idealism when you dont personally have to deal with the possiblity of the consenquences.

Come on, Cedars!

 

Let's say my family lives next to a prison that 'can't guarantee' a particular criminal's escape. Should we kill him because of the prison's security shortcomings?

 

Surely, even you can see the ridiculousness of this argument!

[InfiniteNow]

History repeating... For some further good dialogue on the topic, users may wish to visit the following:

 

http://hypography.com/forums/social-sciences/5781-whats-better-than-punishment.html

http://hypography.com/forums/philosophy-humanities/864-death-life.html

http://hypography.com/forums/social-sciences/1330-does-capital-punishment-reduce-crime.html

http://hypography.com/forums/social-sciences/8071-capital-punishment-right.html

 

 

Rethinking Crime and Punishment - Index

[LJP07]

Come on, Cedars!

Should we kill him because of the prison's security shortcomings?

Surely, even you can see the ridiculousness of this argument!

 

I agree, why kill a person for that reason, and when like I said in my initial post, why don't they just secretly hide him somewhere as a substitute but equal in punishment to prison, would that no be fallible?

 

And the results of the poll in percentages:

 

64% of Hypography don't want him hanged.

36% of Hypography want him hanged.

[Cedars]

Come on, Cedars!

 

Let's say my family lives next to a prison that 'can't guarantee' a particular criminal's escape. Should we kill him because of the prison's security shortcomings?

 

Surely, even you can see the ridiculousness of this argument!

 

And I repeat:

And nowhere did I say kill all the criminals because they might escape. I only pointed out the fact that you cannot guarentee this extremely dangerous prisoners incarceration.

 

I dont believe he would do the rest of his life behind bars. Whether thru escape, or civil war leaving his cronies in power, or whatever radical change to government occurs and to spite the former powers that be, his pardon issued.

 

For me, the ridiculious arguement is promoting the contiuned life of saddam. :hihi:

[Boerseun]

Making Saddam out to be this incredibly dangerous monster is also a bit of a strawman, in my opinion.

 

Saddam committed atrocities, to be sure. He's responsible for the deaths of thousands of people. Make no mistake about that.

 

But the truth of the matter is that he was a killer, using the complete Iraqi governmental infrastructure as his weapon of choice. He simply does not have access to the tools and equipment anymore. He is now a sad, powerless ex-dictator suffering from illusions of grandeur. He rants and raves, but I doubt if you put a knife in his hand, he'll know what to do with it.

 

Real killers do the dirty work themselves. They are the dangerous ones. Politicians the world over kill people on a daily basis by signing papers committing armies to battle. They make the decisions that results in death and destruction, yet they claim innocence. But they are also only able to kill by proxy because they have huge State infrastructure at their disposal.

 

Hitler was an evil guy, responsible for the deaths of millions 60-odd years ago. But if you took him out of his position of power, and made him 'just another prisoner', I think he would have cried like a baby and hid in his cell from the brutal monsters out in the exercise yard. Without their governments, they're nothing. Saddam as a normal prisoner is no more of a threat to you or anybody else or even his fellow prisoners, than any other criminal would be.

 

Using that specific argument as pro-DP for Dictators, doesn't hold water, once again.