Hydroplate Theory

[stereologist]

I don't want to scare you off so I am providing a good hint on how to start. This is from the Wikipedia article on the Oort cloud.

 

The outer Oort cloud is believed to contain several trillion individual comet nuclei larger than approximately 1.3 km[1] (about 500 billion with absolute magnitudes[14] brighter than 10.9), with neighboring comets typically tens of millions of kilometres apart.[3][15] Its total mass is not known with certainty, but, assuming that Halley's comet is a suitable prototype for all comets within the outer Oort cloud, the estimated combined mass is 3 × 1025 kilograms, or roughly five times the mass of the Earth.[1][16] Earlier it was thought to be more massive (up to 380 Earth masses),[17] but improved knowledge of the size distribution of long-period comets has led to much lower estimates. The mass of the inner Oort cloud is not currently known.

 

Try to figure out the volume of water. Another hint: you'll need to determine the average composition of comets, or assume that the comets are predominantly water to determine an upper limit to the volume.

[Moontanman]

T

he continent we have are 7th run continents and they'll be eroded away soon too?

 

This gets better and better.

 

Not for your side it doesn't. The continents have come and gone changed, collided, drew apart and pretty much been recycled many times. You have no grasp of geology at all.

 

 

Exacltly what mountain ranges are uplifting noticeably? Since we have been able to measure them for 40-50 years accurately (navsats).

 

Well lets see, the Rocky Mountains, the Himalayas, the Andes, most of the newer ranges can be said to be getting bigger in some places. In some areas flat land is being raised up, in others it is being drawn down, Plates are scraping past each other or being pushed up over or driven under other plates at fault lines. Earth quakes are the result. The earth is alive geologically speaking. The surface is in constant flux over time frames that we short lived humans cannot perceive. Your idea the we should see the land rising and falling simply shows your lack of understanding of the precesses. Oh and by the way FYI, there are quite a bit more than few active volcanoes on the Earth.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volcano

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Spreading_ridges_volcanoes_map-en.svg

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_volcanoes

 

Erosion is not linear - that is why I said average. Average of one yard per year coastally.

 

Only 1 inch per year movement

 

87000 yards out to the shelf

 

The current CONTINENTS HAVE ONLY BEEN ERODING FOR 87000 YEARS ON AVERAGE

 

I think Stereo answered this one quite well.

 

 

where was the water before?

 

The water is where it always has been, what do you mean where was it? After the Earth first formed, after the late heavy bombardment, the Earth was almost all ocean, continents formed slowly, see the next answer.

 

where were the continents before?

 

The continents were formed slowly by volcanic eruptions over millions of years as lighter rocks were extruded from the mantle. Even today the volume of the crust is slowly growing. Please study the real science of geology and stop allowing these ID people to shape your thoughts. You are intelligent enough to understand you only need the truth.

 

how can they be older than 87,000 years unless the worlds oceans were frozen solid?

 

Interestingly enough but having no bearing on this discussion, Geological evidence suggests the Earth was indeed frozen over completely at least once and maybe three times over the life of the Earth.

 

simple questions

 

Simple questions answered, "have brain, will travel".....

[stereologist]

Moontan I forgot that the evidence for the earth freezing over is the existence of glaciers at the tropics. That was 1B years ago the last it happened. Amazing place this earth. That makes reading about geology interesting. Wherever you live it is relevant. Look out the window as you travel and and see geology. Learn to recognize features and understand their significance. Right now I'm looking out the window at Permian deposits folded and eroded into rolling hills. The fossils in these rocks tell a history of life on earth before the mass extinction at the end of the Permian. Fascinating!

[tedrick79]

Moontan I forgot that the evidence for the earth freezing over is the existence of glaciers at the tropics. That was 1B years ago the last it happened. Amazing place this earth. That makes reading about geology interesting. Wherever you live it is relevant. Look out the window as you travel and and see geology. Learn to recognize features and understand their significance. Right now I'm looking out the window at Permian deposits folded and eroded into rolling hills. The fossils in these rocks tell a history of life on earth before the mass extinction at the end of the Permian. Fascinating!

 

The mass extinction happened when the Great Flood happened in 2348BC. This is conditions of the extinction vary due to the differing ways animals were trapped. Most were fossilized when mud and sediment trapped them. A great many just rotted. Still more - and primarily the mammoths we are digging up now were frozen solid - upright in some cases with food in their mouths.

 

We have even recovered some T-Rex blood and bone. Google it up .

They were supposed to have gone extinct 75mYa. But we have good samples? Absurd.

 

On a 6000 year time line though we can.

 

More on mammoths.

 

In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood - FrozenMammoths.html

 

 

 

No one has answered how continental erosion is outdone by tectonic drift. Erosion acts 36 times faster than drift. I said on average for all drift and all erosion. I have not seen anything to the contrary.

 

 

By the way - the - "you are dumb" - is not evidence to the contrary it is an evasion.

 

If you think all the ocean are magically frozen solid when erosion gets to be too much thats is dreamy thinking.

 

I do not even think the Ice Age idea ever froze the oceans all solid. Why would they ever melt again if the more ice there was the more heat reflected back by the ice. Runaway global cooling. How is an ice age reversed?

 

 

Something is causing all these time distortions where there are stories of dragons and floods and such. Someone is messing with the time continuum or evolution is all dorked up.

 

 

-source

[REASON]

WOW! That rock is amazing. There is absolutely no chance it was carved sometime over the last decade. :confused:

 

Is that a dwarf Triceratops? It looks kinda puny compared to that rider. Oh well, nice try. :eek_big:

[freeztar]

The mass extinction happened when the Great Flood happened in 2348BC.

 

As a rule here at the Science Forums, we require every member to support their claims. Can you please support this claim, tedrick?

 

This is conditions of the extinction vary due to the differing ways animals were trapped. Most were fossilized when mud and sediment trapped them. A great many just rotted. Still more - and primarily the mammoths we are digging up now were frozen solid - upright in some cases with food in their mouths.

The reason they are frozen solid is because they have been encased in permafrost.

For more information on how mammoths are preserved, see this splendid, interactive, and graphical presentation for NatGeo:

Interactive - National Geographic Magazine

 

We have even recovered some T-Rex blood and bone. Google it up

 

If you make a claim, the onus is on you to support that claim and provide links. Please support your claims.

 

In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood - FrozenMammoths.html

That is not a reliable scientific source, Tedrick. The Center for Scientific Creation is an organization that attempts to discredit mainstream science in favor of biblical stories.

 

Here's the summary of that paper:

 

SUMMARY: Muddy water from the fountains of the great deep jetted above the atmosphere where it froze into extremely cold hail. Within hours, mammoths, which could not have lived in today’s Arctic climates or at Arctic latitudes, were buried alive and quickly frozen as this muddy hail fell back to earth in a gigantic hail storm.

 

Where is the proof for this?

 

No one has answered how continental erosion is outdone by tectonic drift. Erosion acts 36 times faster than drift.

 

Source please.

 

If you think all the ocean are magically frozen solid when erosion gets to be too much thats is dreamy thinking.

No one has said such a thing.

 

I do not even think the Ice Age idea ever froze the oceans all solid. Why would they ever melt again if the more ice there was the more heat reflected back by the ice. Runaway global cooling. How is an ice age reversed?

Good question. It's important to realize a few things. First, ice does not reflect 100% of sunlight. Secondly, clouds and greenhouse gases can trap reflected sun rays and heat the atmosphere, which in turn can heat the land. All of this is driven by insolation.

 

Major glacial events in the Quaternary have coincided when the phases of axial tilt, precession of equinoxes and eccentricity of orbit are all lined up to give the northern hemisphere the least amount of summer insolation.

 

What makes the ice melt when the glaciation is over?

 

Major interglacial periods have occurred when the three factors line up to give the northern hemisphere the greatest amount of summer insolation. The last major convergence of factors giving us maximum summer warmth occurred 11,000 years ago, at the transition between the last glaciation and the current interglacial, the Holocene.

Ice Age Explanation

 

(btw, this is a good example of how to support your claims. Make a claim and find credible sources that support your claims.)

 

Something is causing all these time distortions where there are stories of dragons and floods and such.

 

Dragons? Huh?

 

Someone is messing with the time continuum or evolution is all dorked up.

Evolution has been supported time and time again from fields as diverse as Paleontology, Ecology, and DNA analysis. Creation science has yet to support any observable evidence. Their predictions have been found wrong repeatedly which has caused them, time and time again, to go back to the drawing board and create a new unsupported theory based on the bible. Science does not try to make data fit, it explains observable reality.

[Moontanman]

The mass extinction happened when the Great Flood happened in 2348BC. This is conditions of the extinction vary due to the differing ways animals were trapped. Most were fossilized when mud and sediment trapped them. A great many just rotted. Still more - and primarily the mammoths we are digging up now were frozen solid - upright in some cases with food in their mouths.

 

You'll have to give some proof of this. The idea that mammoths were frozen upright with food in their mouths is an gross misrepresentation of the truth.

 

We have even recovered some T-Rex blood and bone. Google it up .

They were supposed to have gone extinct 75mYa. But we have good samples? Absurd.

 

Not true, no blood, the tissue was preserved but it was fossilized in a strange way, the reports of blood and tissue was sensationalism by the media, all that was preserved was collagen, not flesh and blood.

 

T. Rex Soft Tissue Found Preserved

 

There is some descent about this

 

T. rex 'tissue' may just be bacterial scum - life - 30 July 2008 - New Scientist

 

An interesting Christian perspective on this.

 

Creation Science Rebuttals, Answers in Genesis Daily Feature, T-Rex Soft Tissue

 

 

On a 6000 year time line though we can.

 

More on mammoths.

 

In the Beginning: Compelling Evidence for Creation and the Flood - FrozenMammoths.html

 

As was said before this is not evidence ....

 

No one has answered how continental erosion is outdone by tectonic drift. Erosion acts 36 times faster than drift. I said on average for all drift and all erosion. I have not seen anything to the contrary.

 

Then you either didn't read the posts and links provoded or you are incapable of understanding them.

 

 

Something is causing all these time distortions where there are stories of dragons and floods and such. Someone is messing with the time continuum or evolution is all dorked up.

 

No it's just the the lies and distortions of the creationist crowd make it seem that way.

 

 

This a fake, the man who faked the stones to sell them to unsuspecting tourists confessed to faking them. Of course some refuse to believe they are fakes....

 

http://pseudoarchaeology.org/b03-ross.html

[tedrick79]

Alright from the top.

 

 

The Great Flood of Noah is placed at 2348BC according to the one of the oldest and most widely circulated texts called The Bible. A skill known as addition of the lifespans of Adam, Seth, Enos, Cainan, Mahalaleel, Jared, Enoch, Methusaleh, Lamech and Noah - come out to 1656 years. Coming back from Christ in later lifespans places the flood at 2348 BC.

 

 

Now this does assume the Bible is a good history. Which I and a few billion other nuts have wagered is correct. The Jews and the Muslims also get on board in the Old Testament.

 

For a nice layout of time - according to the Bible - look here. If you want to drill down into my data.

 

Bible World History Timeline Online Index

 

 

 

 

If you do not accept historical data a data then I am going to invalidate your National Geographic as well. :eek_big:

 

 

 

Onto the T-Rex stuff.

 

BBC NEWS | Science/Nature | T. rex fossil has 'soft tissues'

 

Now what is said and quoted here is key---

 

"But when Dr Mary Schweitzer, of North Carolina State University, dissolved away the minerals, she found something extraordinary inside.

 

The soft structures move back into position after flexing

She discovered transparent, flexible filaments that resemble blood vessels. There were also traces of what look like red blood cells; and others that look like osteocytes, cells that build and maintain bone.

 

"This is fossilised bone in the sense that it's from an extinct animal but it doesn't have a lot of the characteristics of what people would call a fossil," she told the BBC's Science In Action programme.

 

"It still has places where there are no secondary minerals, and it's not any more dense than modern bone; it's bone more than anything."

 

 

 

Now you all may be in the business of believing, perhaps on faith, that bone can not turn to dust in 65 million years. But I happen to think there is an alternative explaination - the T-Rex bone is younger. That is what the science says.

 

Evolution is the god of science though - so even if you dated this material and it came back with a young date - it would be discounted - because THE T-REX WENT EXTINCT 65 MYA. That is LAW.

 

 

Onto the next --- wooly mammoths for what they are - are hairy elephants. The hair found on them as you can see here

 

Mammoths: Ice-Age Giants - Google Books

 

Is not going to keep it warm. Also paciderms require 30-60 gallons of water per day - How do they find this in the permafrost? They also have voracious appitites - how would they subsist at such high latitudes? The mammoth lacked erector muscles that fluff up an animals fur and create insulating pockets.

 

Elephant skin and mammoth skin is similar in thickness and structure.

 

Vegetation does not grow in the winter where these mammoths were found. How could all of these mammoth survive?

 

Another fact is that these mammoths were quickly frozen after they died. Otherwise the internal organs would have decomposed.

 

Secondly they were buried rapidly as no scavengers picked at them until they thawed recently.

 

Resources for Dima, the baby mammoth and how she was found can be located:

Valentina V Ukrainseva, Vegetation and Cover of the "Mammoth Epoch in Siberia" (Hot Springs, South Dakota: The mammoth site for the hot springs, 1993) pp 12-13

 

Also in "Upper Quaternary Deposits and Paleogeography of the Region Inhabited by the Young Kirgilyakh Mammoth"

 

 

 

Read those and get back to me.

 

 

 

 

I did read the links and I do understand - they are assuming a great amount of things. They want us to believe them on faith that this continent has been drifting for billions of years - but only eroding for 87,000?

 

If so then you are incapable of math or any critical thinking and can only regurgitate the consensus science of evolution. If you cannot see the problems between billions of years of missing coastal erosion - I suggest we drop the subject because we cannot even agree on the data let alone the derivitives OF THAT DATA.

 

 

 

 

Onto dragons. Well the word dinosaur was coined in 1840. Before then they were called dragons. Not all dragons are the European flying firebreathing ones. that might be a stretch even in my universe. The point is that ancient man has stories of interacting with dinosaurs/dragons

 

We should not. We did not evolve until 64 million years after dinosaurs vanished. Why do have stories of them? Why do we have footprints with us and them?

 

 

 

 

Now I suppose someone carved those into the stone to make it look as though dinosaurs and man walked together to make the Bible correct? I cannot win.

 

There is an even clearer one in permian rock.

 

 

 

Probably faked too - I could say that about all fossils and say they are plaster of paris creations. Like Piltdown Man ? You do remember that scam?

 

A Science Odyssey: People and Discoveries: Piltdown Man is revealed as fake

 

 

 

This might be the best one. They even CT scanned it because it was so nice.

 

YouTube - The Delk Track: Evidence of dinosaur and human coexistence http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXDBX99qePA

 

Watch it.

 

YouTube - The Delk Track: Evidence of dinosaur and human coexistence http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXDBX99qePA

 

 

 

 

 

I understand ice does not reflect 100% of light. It does reflect a great deal of it. There is no mechanism in place to reverse an Ice Age - not one known. In fact if you look at the Sea Charts from the Hanse dating back to the 1500s Global warming is not new and there is no reason to think we are causing it.

 

I am also one of those guys that thinks that the dark ages were actually dark. All the painting of the period were cloudy and something besides the fall of Rome was keeping us down. I wander from topic.

 

 

 

 

 

IN Alaska coastal erosion can be up to 45 feet in a year.

 

Arctic Coastal Erosion - Northern Alaska - Beaufort Sea

 

 

That is, of course, double the usual - that is 22.5 feet per year. That is just Alaska mind you.

Calmer seas will have lower erosion rates -

This is why it is averaged at about 3 feet per year of coast erosion.

 

About continental drift? Speed?

 

Speed of the Continental Plates

 

Depends on who you ask. We havent been able to measure for more than 40 years with navsats. The total movement is within the margin of error for parallax between continents.

 

So between 1cm and 10cm. I will not disagree with that. They are still slowly moving towards the pacific trenches as this map indicates.

 

 

Figure 87: Global Shifts. Each arrow shows the average direction and speed of several years’ worth of shifting at one of about 150 locations worldwide. All measurements were made using the Global Positioning System (GPS), the most accurate of several methods for measuring these movements.

 

Notice that the arrows point in different directions, although most are toward the Pacific. This shows that material deep in the earth shifts in various directions, but generally toward the Pacific. If the entire mantle were circulating, greater uniformity would be seen in speed and direction. The plate tectonic theory considers the plates, outlined in blue, as rigid, but the variations in the measured movements show that the plates are not rigid.57 For the plates to be moving, pressure differences must exist. Either the pressure around the Pacific is greater than normal or the pressure under the Pacific is less than normal—or both. The hydroplate theory explains why both are true.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I do not expect to have any headway with those who hold the Bible to zero worth. This is all just a game of kick the creationist for you all. I have answered your queries. I have quoted my sources.

 

 

The venom I consistently must sift through to get to anything is maniacal. Why is it evolutionist defend the theory so meanly? You do know it is a theory.

 

 

None of us were there in the beginning. Any idea we have of origins is a theory. I have mine and you have yours. Yours is of course, wrong, but that is the spirit of debate. :confused:

 

 

 

 

 

The hydroplate theory isnt some half baked idea. It is fully formed and explains some of the wierd things we see now (like the Grand Canyon) and explains it using some biblical ideas.

 

The Bible is all to quickly dismissed. It has not been proven wrong and is not in error. I speak of the KJV because that all I can attest to.

 

Furthermore if it is in error and mankind is nothing more than stardust stacks. As evolution proposes - then nothing matters. Nothing. Not one thing in your life will ever matter. This is anarchy and has been on the rise since we started labeling this nonsense science in the 60s.

 

 

Evolutionary teachings are the basis for every major atrocity committed in the 19th and 20th century. With these teachings it is justifiable to slay off the weak. If you feel this is a good idea then you and the Nazi party are in agreement.

 

 

 

 

 

 

One last note. After World War II the Nazi's who were in charge of some of the genocide were put on trial. However they had broken no laws with genocide.

 

The laws of Germany, in 1938, were made to reflect that Jews no longer had 'person' status. There was no world law at the time.

 

What the prosecution found was that the Nazi commanders were guilty of violating a 'higher law'. A law known to be true, yet unwritten.

 

This law is in direct conflict with Darwinism. So which is right and which is wrong?

 

Moreover in a universe were there is not a God - Can there be right or wrong?

 

Without authority - No.

 

 

Those who seek to do as they please - will seek a way to undo God. Removing the Creator from creation is how to do it.

 

Without Creation God can become myth - legend.

 

 

While this might be so - if it is not so - many will pay more than they intended to for this assumption.

 

I am turning off auto email me when someone replies. PM me if you want to.

[Moontanman]

God is myth, the tracks you show have been confirmed as fake, the bible is not a historically accurate document. I could write a book about vampires and name actual people, places and events but it wouldn't make vampires real. The T-Rex fossil was of collagen it did indeed have mineral in it, it had to be treated with acid to remove them. You have ignored all the links and facts shown you. If you want to believe please continue to do so but your posts are nothing more than proselytizing. The supernatural is not only not needed to explain the universe it does a very poor job of explaining anything. You can your take ball and go home if you want but you are still wrong.

[Moontanman]

Sorry, double posted by accident or by divine intervention? Who knows for sure/?

[tedrick79]

God is myth, the tracks you show have been confirmed as fake, the bible is not a historically accurate document. I could write a book about vampires and name actual people, places and events but it wouldn't make vampires real. The T-Rex fossil was of collagen it did indeed have mineral in it, it had to be treated with acid to remove them. You have ignored all the links and facts shown you. If you want to believe please continue to do so but your posts are nothing more than proselytizing. The supernatural is not only not needed to explain the universe it does a very poor job of explaining anything. You can your take ball and go home if you want but you are still wrong.

 

How can you say who is wrong?

 

You were not present at the creation or the big bang.

 

 

Both big bang and creation REQUIRE THE SUPERNATURAL.

 

Because the processes involved in both cannot be replicated nor have been seen to occur naturally.

 

Seen any planets form?

Seen any stars form? ( do not show me some nebula nebula)

Seen any life come from non life?

Seen any water bearing comets hit the earth?

 

Have you seen any of the things evolution needs? No.

 

 

What have you seen?

The beak changes in finches over generations as viewed by a racist?

"Let us assume" used 800 times in Origin of the Species.

 

 

If an event has never occured or and cannot be replicated it is supernatural.

 

 

You cannot even make granite cool into granite. When granite melts now - it cools and reforms ryholite. That should raise an issue in the - the planet was once molten idea. But it does not.

 

 

The reason it does not is because you are blinded by your close-mindedness. You are unwilling to call into probability of design. No matter how much points to that effect.

 

 

Evolution is a religion. The tectonic theory is one of its pillars.

 

 

"Evolution is promoted by its practitioners as more than mere science. Evolution is promulgated as an ideology, a secular religion—a full-fledged alternative to Christianity, with meaning and morality. I am an ardent evolutionist and an ex-Christian, but I must admit that in this one complaint—and Mr [sic] Gish is but one of many to make it—the literalists are absolutely right. Evolution is a religion. This was true of evolution in the beginning, and it is true of evolution still today."

 

-Michael Ruse was professor of philosophy and zoology at the University of Guelph, Canada.

 

You can get an idea of his credentials here.

 

Michael Ruse - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

 

 

This is why god is a myth to you. Evolutionism - now is God. As long as you have evolution you need no god. So to believe evolution you must diminish the power of God - until he is no god at all in the end.

 

Yes I have gone through theistic evolutionary ideas and all just seek to water down what Genesis says.. If you can muddy up Genesis then why not Luke? Shred the whole thing?

 

 

 

 

 

 

The hydroplate theory is all stemmed from just a few verses of scripture. It is fact based and holds water. It also lets onto the fact you know to be true - if you would allow the idea time to fight. This planet is not that old.

 

You might want it to be old - so you can defeat god.

 

 

This is the strange claims forum by the way - if you want real science go hit up the rest. This is all about origins - and as I said before - a theory is all you can get close to down here.

 

 

 

 

Strange Claims Forum

This is the place where we put topics that are outside the bounds of standard science: they usually contain interesting but unsupported viewpoints.

 

 

 

 

 

All those pictures are fabricated you say? All of them?

 

Wow - we have been working overtime.

 

I thought evolutionaries has the playing field bagged with frauds.

 

 

Evolution Fraud

 

 

 

 

 

In an attempt to further their careers and justify the claims that evolution is a legitimate theory, many scientists have fraudulently deceived the world by planting or reconstructing fossils which they would claim to be authentic finds. The most widely published evolution fraud was committed in China in 1999, and published in in the National Geographic

 

 

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Human Ancestral Frauds

 

Piltdown man: Found in a gravel pit in Sussex England in 1912, this fossil was considered by some sources to be the second most important fossil proving the evolution of man—until it was found to be a complete forgery 41 years later. The skull was found to be of modern age. The fragments had been chemically stained to give the appearance of age, and the teeth had been filed down!

 

 

Nebraska man: A single tooth, discovered in Nebraska in 1922 grew an entire evolutionary link between man and monkey, until another identical tooth was found which was protruding from the jawbone of a wild pig.

 

 

Java man: Initially discovered by Dutchman Eugene Dubois in 1891, all that was found of this claimed originator of humans was a skullcap, three teeth and a femur. The femur was found 50 feet away from the original skullcap a full year later. For almost 30 years Dubois downplayed the Wadjak skulls (two undoubtedly human skulls found very close to his "missing link"). (source: Hank Hanegraaff, The Face That Demonstrates The Farce Of Evolution, [Word Publishing, Nashville, 1998], pp.50-52)

 

 

Orce man: Found in the southern Spanish town of Orce in 1982, and hailed as the oldest fossilized human remains ever found in Europe. One year later officials admitted the skull fragment was not human but probably came from a 4 month old donkey. Scientists had said the skull belonged to a 17 year old man who lived 900,000 to 1.6 million years ago, and even had very detail drawings done to represent what he would have looked like. (source: "Skull fragment may not be human", Knoxville News-Sentinel, 1983)

 

 

Neanderthal: Still synonymous with brutishness, the first Neanderthal remains were found in France in 1908. Considered to be ignorant, ape-like, stooped and knuckle-dragging, much of the evidence now suggests that Neanderthal was just as human as us, and his stooped appearance was because of arthritis and rickets. Neanderthals are now recognized as skilled hunters, believers in an after-life, and even skilled surgeons, as seen in one skeleton whose withered right arm had been amputated above the elbow. (source: "Upgrading Neanderthal Man", Time Magazine, May 17, 1971, Vol. 97, No. 20)

 

Human Ancestor Fraud - Creationist Links

 

A Human Ancestor Fraud

Deceptive Fossil Interpretations of Evolutionists from the Muslim online book Evolution Deceit

Features of Piltdown Skull "Deliberate Fakes"

Human Evolution - Frauds and Mistakes

Lucy's Fraudulent Fame

Orce man hominid fraud

Piltdown man fraud

The Ape-men fallacy by Malcolm Bowden (Review of book - Ape-men: Fact or Fallacy?)

The Face that Demonstrates the Farce of Evolution The following is a transcript of The Apemen Frauds portion of the audio tape.

The Piltdown Man Fraud by Monty White

The Story of the Piltdown Man by the Creation-Evolution Encyclopedia

The Yale DNA Hybridization Scandal - A UC Berkely professor reports on the intentional alteration of hybridization data which was used to support the theory that humans are more closely related to chimpanzees.

 

 

 

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Ontogeny Recapitulates Phylogeny?

Haekel’s faked embryonic drawings

 

The theory of embryonic recapitulation asserts that the human fetus goes through various stages of its evolutionary history as it develops. Ernst Haeckel proposed this theory in the late 1860’s, promoting Darwin’s theory of evolution in Germany. He made detailed drawings of the embryonic development of eight different embryos in three stages of development, to bolster his claim. His work was hailed as a great development in the understanding of human evolution. A few years later his drawings were shown to have been fabricated, and the data manufactured. He blamed the artist for the discrepancies, without admitting that he was the artist. (source: Russell Grigg, "Fraud Rediscovered", Creation, Vol. 20, No. 2, pp.49-51)

 

Haeckel’ Forgeries Creationary Links

 

Another Evolution Fraud Exposed

Evolution Fraud in Current Biology Textbooks – Haeckel’s Ontongeny

Haeckel's distortions did not help Darwin by Stephen Jay Gould

Haeckel's Fake Drawings - Pictures

Please Urge Publishers to Fix Textbooks by Texans for Better Science Education

 

 

 

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Archaeoraptor Liaoningensis:

Fake Dinosaur-bird ancestor

 

The most recent and perhaps the most infamous evolution frauds was committed in China and published in 1999 in the journal National Geographic 196:98-107, November 1999. Dinosaur bones were put together with the bones of a newer species of bird and they tried to pass it off as a very important new evolutionary intermediate.

 

"Feathers For T-Rex?", Christopher P. Sloan, National Geographic Magazine, Vol. 196, No. 5, November, 1999, pp.99,100,105

 

Interesting Quote - "National Geographic has reached an all-time low for engaging in sensationalistic, unsubstantiated, tabloid journalism" Storrs L. Olson, Smithsonian Institution

 

Archaeoraptor Liaoningensis Creationary Links

 

Adventist Scientist Comments on Retraction of Evolutionary "Missing Link" Claim

And now: Feathered Dinosaur Link

Another Evolution Fraud By Tim Friend, USA TODAY

Another Fossil Flub

Another Hoax by Owen D. Olbricht

Another ‘Missing Link’ Takes Flight

Another "OOOPS" For Science

Archaeoraptor Flight Aborted by John Morris

Archaeopteryx, Archaeoraptor, and the "Dinosaurs-To-Birds" Theory ...

Archaeoraptor: Feathered Dinosaur from National Geographic Doesn’t Fly ... IMPACT No. 321 by Steven A. Austin, Ph.D

Archaeoraptor Hoax Update — National Geographic Recants!

Archaeoraptor: National Geographic's Biggest Embarassment by Craig McClarren

Archaeoraptor: Phony ‘feathered’ fossil by Jonathan Sarfati

Archaeoraptor: Some interesting points about this particular hoax

Crying Fowl: Tale of 'Missing Link' Embarrasses Scientists

'Dragon' fossils seized

EVOLUTION COVER-UP

Evolution Hoax The Archaeoraptor Fraud

Evolution: The Fraud That Shapes The Worldview of Our Kids By Bob Harsh and Chuck Colson. Origins Insights March 2000 Newsletter by the Creation Science Fellowship

"Feathered Dinosaur" Claim Apparently a Fake

National Geographic backs down – sort of! By Carl Wieland

National Geographic Gets a Black Eye

National Geographic Eats Crow

National Geographic retracts boast of dinosaur-to-bird 'missing link'

Smithsonian criticizes National Geographic’s Dino-to-Bird Claims revealing the lack of consensus on the matter among scientists, despite National Geographic’s sensationalistic “propagandizing”.

Smithsonian critiques National Geographic in open letter archaeoraptor

The Missing Link That Wasn’t ... National Geographic’s Bird Dinosaur Flew Again the Facts by Nancy Pearcey,. Access Research Network

The Archaeoraptor Fraud – by Charles Colson

The Archaeoraptor Fraud: National Geographic

The Latest Fraud!

The Missing Link that Wasn't: National Geographic's 'Bird Dinosaur' Flew Against the Facts

The Piltdown Chicken

Well, Folks…It Happened Again!

News Articles Published on The Archaeoraptor Liaoningensis Discovery

 

Second Piece of Fossil Forgery Identified Scientific American 11/21/02

Comparing Modern Birds with The Missing Link Fossils

FEATHERED CREATURES FROM CHINA BOOST DINOSAUR-BIRD CONNECTION

Flying dinosaur was mean, graceless: Fiercesome bird may have been first flying feathered animal to evolve

Fossils from China Link Birds With Dinosaurs

MISSING LINK BETWEEN DINOSAURS AND BIRDS FOUND IN CHINA: Dino Land Has the Full Story of Dinosaur-Bird Evolution and the Latest Exciting Development!

'Missing Link' Dino Actually Two Animals ABCNEWS.com

New Birdlike Dinosaurs from China Are True Missing Links

NEW BIRDLIKE DINOSAURS ON VIEW: COULD T. REX HAVE HAD FEATHERS / T. Rex mit Federn

Researchers find fossils of primitive flying dinosaur

Think of it as a 120 million-year-old turkey: Archaeoraptor liaoningensis may be missing link between ground-based dinosaurs and birds

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Miscellaneous Fakes and Frauds

 

Brontosaurus: One of the best known dinosaurs in books and museums for the past hundred years, brontosaurus never really existed. The dinosaur’s skeleton was found with the head missing. To complete it, a skull found three or four miles away was added. No one knew this for years. The body actually belonged to a species of Diplodocus and the head was from an Apatosaurus. (source: Paul S. Taylor, The Great Dinosaur Mystery and the Bible, [Chariot Victor Publishing, 1989], pp.12-13)

 

General Evolution Fraud Links

 

10 Notorious Darwinist Fabrications

Anatomy of a Hoax by Sean Meek

Dinosaur webcam pictures -- fake, hoax photos and pics

Evolution Fraud in School Scienfic Textbooks

Evolution fraud in current biology textbooks Worldnet Magazine 2001 Exposed as fakes decades ago, major publishers still include them

Evolution Forgeries from the Muslim online book Evolution Deceit

Gaps in the Textbooks' Coverage of the Fossil Record by Texans for Better Science Education

Forensic geochemistry solves fossil riddles ..Geological Society News - New forensic tools developed to spot fossil fakes.

Scientists behaving badly - Journal editors reveal researchers' wicked ways Nature 3/4/2004

Survival of The Fakest Part I or Survival of The Fakest Part II by Jonathan Wells (PDF download)

Textbook Fraud: Inherit The Wind is intellectual pornography!: Full of Lies, deception and very anti-Christian.

Textbook Fraud: The Horse Series; Hyracotherium "dawn horse" eohippus, mesohippus, ...

Text book Fraud! Video -& Documentation by Don Patton

THE CASE OF ARCHAEOPTERYX The evidence strongly indicates it is a fake

Archaeopteryx (unlike Archaeoraptor) is NOT a hoax — it is a true bird, not a ‘missing link’ by Jonathan Sarfati

The Rise of the Evolution Fraud Review of book by Malcolm Bowden

[Buffy]

You were not present at the creation or the big bang.

 

Both big bang and creation REQUIRE THE SUPERNATURAL.

 

Because the processes involved in both cannot be replicated nor have been seen to occur naturally.

 

Seen any planets form?

Seen any stars form? ( do not show me some nebula nebula)

Seen any life come from non life?

Seen any water bearing comets hit the earth?

So you're saying that nothing happens that is not directly observed? Or that even if its observable but it takes longer than a lifetime, that that doesn't count?

 

To try to keep this on topic--and a friendly reminder that it is impolite to create posts like that last one that are so completely and lengthily off topic--it would seem that your claim that "granite can't be created" is based solely on the notion that we cannot see it forming since the theory (and practice by the way), require the transformation to happen hidden by mounds of equipment, let alone thousands of feet of non-transparent rock.

 

One of the reasons you don't find people manufacturing granite is that until recently it's been fairly expensive to do and it's so easy to just dig up.

 

But that hasn't stopped folks, and actually you might want to take a trip down to your local Home Depot and check it out.

 

Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves, :hihi:

Buffy

[Boerseun]

Heck - I haven't laughed so much in years! :hihi:

 

Tedrick, you have just made my day and completely cracked me up. It's amazing that people holding your views are clever enough to operate a QWERTY keyboard.

 

I've just read through this Hydroplate Theory thread, for some reason or another I missed it since 2007. I've just wasted my time.

 

I read your last few postings, and thought to myself that I will take it point by point and show you where and why you have it wrong.

 

Then I realized that I will have to address almost every single word you typed. Except this one:

 

Wow. We have been working overtime.

That is the only sentence I cannot find fault with. The rest is so wrong, it doesn't even deserve an answer.

 

Why is it that the complete and utter misunderstanding of science, and the total and complete lack of scientific knowledge and insight drove you to join a science site?

 

I'm not mocking you at all - I'm really interested to know.

 

As to addressing your posts: (my bold)

Incoherent, uninformed ramblings start HERE...

up until your very last post:

...Incoherent, uninformed ramblings end HERE

it's just wrong.

 

Each and every single line of it (apart from the one I quoted about you guys working so hard).

 

Every single line is wrong to the point that God (assuming he exist) will come down and smite you into oblivion for abusing the brain he (assumedly) gave you. He will hang you up by your testicles upside down in a cage of sex-crazed rabid lemurs. It will not be nice. It will not be fun.

 

If you do not want that to happen to you, take your finger out your left nostril and go read some basic science. God wants you to. What you're currently doing to your mind is tantamount to rape. You cannot take the most complex thing we know about (the human brain) and do to it what you're currently doing. It's vulgar and obscene. It should be a crime.

 

But thanks for the laugh, however. I really did think that cargo cults were the epitome of human stupidity in recent times. You have broadened my views on that particular matter.

[REASON]

You're not the only one that can dump a bunch of information in a post, tedrick. Mine are links to articles that use actual science to debunk your claims and provides resources.

 

It doesn't matter that I post them for you to review though. Your beliefs are like the Woolly Mammoth.....frozen in permafrost.

 

But what the hey. I'm sure there are others out there that are interested in learning something.

 

Walter Brown's Hydroplate Theory

 

And for related articles:

 

Problems With A Global Flood

Technology and the Flood

Orkney Islands and Flood

Why the flood Can't Be Global

Why The Flood Can't be In Mesopotamia

Why The Flood Can't Be In The Black Sea

Letter to Creation Research Society Quarterly

Fish Cause Problems for the Global Flood

The Global Flood Produces Acidic Flood Waters

Carbon Dioxide and the Flood

Mercury pollution from Noah's flood

Geology Articles

Creation Science and Earth History

Flood Stories from Around the World

 

 

Furthermore if it is in error and mankind is nothing more than stardust stacks. As evolution proposes - then nothing matters. Nothing. Not one thing in your life will ever matter. This is anarchy and has been on the rise since we started labeling this nonsense science in the 60s.

 

I believe this quote of yours is the primary issue for you that drives your rejection of scientific research. Can you elaborate, in your own words, why "nothing matters" in a universe with no god? I have a hunch that I know why you think so, but I'll refrain from speculation.

 

The fact is that neither of us know the truth about whether there exists a god. So as we travel together in that boat, we must decide for ourselves what matters in the world. One thing that matters to me is developing a genuine, honest, and acurate understanding of the physical universe, which can only be revealed through the scientific method.

 

Those that choose to find comfort in faithful thinking out of the fear of not having any purpose are free to do so as they please. But in doing so, they may miss the opportunity to see the true wondrousness of the universe as revealed through scientific research, choosing instead to see it merely as they want it to be, or as the architects of the faith want them to see it. But that approach doesn't really bring one closer to the truth, does it?

 

And by the way, I'll just ignore your ridiculous, adolescent Nazi BS. :hihi: That nearly garnered the first ever neg rep I've given to anyone in these fora.

[Moontanman]

Tedrick, since you've been kind enough to point out all these scientific frauds I thought it would be fair to point out all the lies and deceit perpetrated by religion.

 

Christian Urban Legends, etc.

RELIGION INFO - Religious Fraud

http://learn.uci.edu/oo/getDemoPage.php?course=OC0899020&lesson=009&topic=3&page=2

The Fox Sisters Biography (Religious Figures/Frauds) — Infoplease.com

 

the biggest fraud is probably the version of the bible we now use.

Behind The Bible Fraud - What Was The Church Trying To Hide?

 

The list of frauds goes on and on from people who claim they picked up hitchhikers who shout Jesus is coming soon and vanish from the back seats of cars to the faith healers and their fake healing.

religion is awash with frauds and sadly unlike science which polices it's self quite well and exposes frauds, religion embraces it's frauds and does it's best to hide the lies as long as the frauds makes religion look good. Like the human foot prints with dinosaur tracks religion continues to embrace frauds long after the perpetrators of the fraud have confessed to the forgery because the idea of humans and dinosaurs together makes for good press when the times comes to ridicule science. That very thing is what separates science from religion, science is about evidence, if the evidence doesn't line up with the claims it's rejected. Religion is all about gathering proof of it's own worth. anything that supports religion is embraced no matter how fake or unsupported it may be.

[tedrick79]

So both ideals - evolution and creation - are awash with frauds?

 

Piltdown man was embraced as fact when it was made up. Some textbooks still teach it as a early man. Does this invalidate the whole of evolution? We now KNOW that Sir Arthur Kieth concocted the whole of Piltdown man to help fill in the missing link.

 

Piltdown Man

 

So we know of at least one very large fraud in evolutionism. But it was supported and embraced no matter how fake it appeared to be.

 

I am going to stick with Dr Ruse (previously quoted) that evolution is a secular religion. It has all of the same facets. Just because a religion is not calling itself one does not make it so.

 

 

None of this is science by the way - this is all philosophy. One side argues what it cannot prove, verse and other side that argues what it cannot prove. When you have dueling philosopy - science flees.

 

 

We must get back to some semblance of what the OP was about.

 

If you want to argue about data and claims - If we can get back to the Hyrdroplate.

 

 

Where is the material that was in the Grand Canyon? It is not in the delta. The colorado river delta only contains 1% of the 1800 cubic miles of sediment that filled the Grand Canyon.

 

How did it get way out into the Gulf of California without a Flood causing it? A slow carve would have caused a large delta.

[Turtle]

strange claim or not, this religious bs aint passing for science here at Hypography. not on my watch fellas. ;) :shrug:

 

We must get back to some semblance of what the OP was about.

 

If you want to argue about data and claims - If we can get back to the Hyrdroplate.

 

Where is the material that was in the Grand Canyon? It is not in the delta. The colorado river delta only contains 1% of the 1800 cubic miles of sediment that filled the Grand Canyon.

 

How did it get way out into the Gulf of California without a Flood causing it? A slow carve would have caused a large delta.

 

This thread is a repository for all things geographic as relates to Walt Brown's Hydroplate Theory.

 

hydroplate theory is not even wrong. :eek:

 

An apparently scientific argument is said to be not even wrong if it is based on assumptions that are known to be incorrect' date=' or alternatively, theories which cannot possibly be falsified or used to predict anything. ... [/quote']